Diesel cars (toxic tax) announced

hotpot

WoW! £20 a day tax to use your diesel vehicles in towns cities. http://www.msn.com/en-gb/cars/news/if-you-drive-a-diesel-car-you-could-soon-have-to-pay-up-to-£20-a-day/ar-BBzbbDU?li=AAmiR2Z&ocid=spartandhp

sweepy

That will screw the Motability scheme as it's usually an extra £1000 plus for the petrol variant of any model

Sporky

It's just scaremongering at this point.

The firmest proposal so far only affected Euro IV and earlier.

dano

Wood burners will be the big pollution problem next decade. 3L TDIs will be nice and Cheap then.

ICBM

Sporky said:

It's just scaremongering at this point.

The firmest proposal so far only affected Euro IV and earlier.

Come to think of it, scaremongering people into not buying new diesels while not actually penalising those who have already bought them would be quite a good compromise for now… although it's unlikely for politicians to be that clever.

VimFuego

dano said:

Wood burners will be the big pollution problem next decade. 3L TDIs will be nice and Cheap then.

tho the main issue I find with wood burners is getting up to a decent speed on the motorway.

Sporky

ICBM said:

Come to think of it, scaremongering people into not buying new diesels while not actually penalising those who have already bought them would be quite a good compromise for now… although it's unlikely for politicians to be that clever.

I agree on both counts. I see the meed to migrate away from diesel, and then from ICEs altogether, but there's a sensible pace.

Sporky

VimFuego said:

tho the main issue I find with wood burners is getting up to a decent speed on the motorway.

You're probably using woods that aren't sufficiently energy dense.

Brazilian rosewood and old-growth Honduras mahogany are the high performance firewoods.

Evilmags

Sporky said:

VimFuego said:

tho the main issue I find with wood burners is getting up to a decent speed on the motorway.

You're probably using woods that aren't sufficiently energy dense.

Brazilian rosewood and old-growth Honduras mahogany are the high performance firewoods.

Ironwood burns at ridiculous temperatures. 
Brother managed to melt a fireplace with the stuff. (Factory offcuts not decent bits) Stuff is so dense it sinks. 

ICBM

Sporky said:

You're probably using woods that aren't sufficiently energy dense.

Brazilian rosewood and old-growth Honduras mahogany are the high performance firewoods.

Sadly that's all too true, especially the mahogany. Vast quantities of it were burned for railway locomotive fuel in central America.

notanon

Diesel cars with improved performance - side effect: particulates are crossing the air blood barrier of the lung! Those particulates are inside your system - blood, brain, heart, . . . 

That is quit rightly where the fear comes from. This is not the only micro particle produced from modern living.

notanon

I hope to God they aren't talking about the grime crap from old diesel vehicles in that article?? They are actually 'less of a problem'

Evilmags

Any high compression engine will produce more dangerous particulates than a lower compression one of the same power. One the temperature amd pressure in the cylinder gets above a certain temperature it converts nitogen molecules into nitrogen free radicals. Because diesel burns more slowly their is more time for these to react with it.

Sporky

notanon said:

Diesel cars with improved performance - side effect: particulates are crossing the air blood barrier of the lung! Those particulates are inside your system - blood, brain, heart, . . .

Making me even more powerful.

Fretwired

notanon said:

Diesel cars with improved performance - side effect: particulates are crossing the air blood barrier of the lung! Those particulates are inside your system - blood, brain, heart, . . . 

That is quit rightly where the fear comes from. This is not the only micro particle produced from modern living.

Got any scientific data to back that up?

HAL9000

ICBM said:

Sporky said:

You're probably using woods that aren't sufficiently energy dense.

Brazilian rosewood and old-growth Honduras mahogany are the high performance firewoods.

Sadly that's all too true, especially the mahogany. Vast quantities of it were burned for railway locomotive fuel in central America.

Yup, a locomotive can get nearly a week's running from Honduran mahogany, but only twenty-four hours from balsa!

Bucket

Keep thinking diesel might be the way to go for my next car, but if that were the case I'd only be looking at newer ones, finances permitting. Any older and I'd look at petrol, although ironically that would likely pollute more than many new diesels.

Lots of newer diesel hatchbacks produce so little CO2 they qualify for zero road tax - will this change too?

ICBM

Bucket said:

Keep thinking diesel might be the way to go for my next car, but if that were the case I'd only be looking at newer ones, finances permitting. Any older and I'd look at petrol, although ironically that would likely pollute more than many new diesels.

Lots of newer diesel hatchbacks produce so little CO2 they qualify for zero road tax - will this change too?

Yes, because the government has finally realised that the CO2 isn't the bigger problem - it's the NOX and the particulates which are.

Stevepage

Every time the government comes across a problem they're having difficulty solving, they seem to always settle for taxing the shit out of it. 

This isn't how problems are solved surely? 

Sporky

ICBM said:

Bucket said:

Keep thinking diesel might be the way to go for my next car, but if that were the case I'd only be looking at newer ones, finances permitting. Any older and I'd look at petrol, although ironically that would likely pollute more than many new diesels.

Lots of newer diesel hatchbacks produce so little CO2 they qualify for zero road tax - will this change too?

Yes, because the government has finally realised that the CO2 isn't the bigger problem - it's the NOX and the particulates which are.

And next they go for the Euro IV petrols (and earlier) which produce more particulates than a Euro VI diesel...

Axe_meister

Well we just changed our diesel Civic to a new 1l petrol.
So nice not to be driving a tractor.
Performance is about the same and so much smoother to drive.
With out driving (mainly city) the diesel doesn't use that much less fuel (about 6mpg less).
Talking to the dealer Honda may never bring in a Diesel replacement and the second hand market for diesels in pretty much dead. Thankfully we had a guaranteed trade in value on our PCP.
Even the fear of extra tax is working.