Fender Flavours ?¿?

ChrisMusic

There is lots of expertise on the forum, so help me out here please.  

  ~ What are the different 'flavours' of Fender amps ?
  ~ And what makes the different sonic fingerprints of the family ?

I love the sound of a Twin Reverb, but they could level small villages, and weigh more than my house, so I really need to learn what the other amps they have produced over the years have to offer.  I am thinking more of the clean sounds here really, but a bit of O/D is always a welcome, if not entirely necessary option.


And on a related note

    ~ what do the boutique brands bring to the party ?
       Sonic differences, more variety, extended functionality.
       Are they really worth the extra price tag ?

Are there any good YouTube channels for getting a good idea of what the amps really sound like ?  It is so much easier to do some preliminary research this way, there is nowhere close to me to check anything out, and at the moment I am car-less too, so recommendations welcome...

Gassage

A good way of thinking abut this is by aligning the finishs of the amps to the tone!

Tweed- rough and saggy
Brownface: a little less rough, but still a bit messy and saggy.
Blackface: pristine but with a dark undercurrent
Silverface: sparkling, no darkness.

Jonathanthomas83

This ^ is my experience too, spot on!

ChrisMusic

Cheers @Gassage , nice simple review there  


What about the various boutique offerings, do they follow a similar pattern or have more divergence ?

Also does the pattern hold true across the wattages and OP valve options ?

i.e. I assume that Princeton, Deluxe, Twin have a different 'flavour' as well as different wattages, or are they essentially louder versions of each other ?

Gassage

ChrisMusic said:

Cheers @Gassage , nice simple review there  


What about the various boutique offerings, do they follow a similar pattern or have more divergence ?

Also does the pattern hold true across the wattages and OP valve options ?

i.e. I assume that Princeton, Deluxe, Twin have a different 'flavour' as well as different wattages, or are they essentially louder versions of each other ?

Pretty much so, but there's a few curve balls- e.g. TK Imperial is exctly what you'd expect from a great Blackface Deluxe but looks like a Bush TV.

I'd say that in terms of Tweeds, Viccie are a tad cleaner and Lazy J a tad dirtier than their inspirations.

@riftamps are very close to originals, possibly a little hotter.

Fender RI's pretty much nail it- I mean the VVRI is spot on as is the DRRI and esp the 57 Deluxe which is a hero.

ChrisMusic

Yes, I've noticed some slightly dodgy 'retro' styling on some, what's all that about?   :-\"

crunchman

With the black/silverface type amps the smaller amps (Princeton, Deluxe Reverb etc.) aren't just smaller versions of the Twin.  They do have slightly different sound.  It might be partly the 6V6 vs 6L6 thing, but I think it's also partly down to the cab and speakers as well.

ChrisMusic

I had a feeling that might be the case, thanks @crunchman ;;


Any ways of describing those differences, or quality YouTube resources to get a better idea ?

I guess another question is whether it is just EQ contouring differences which can be matched to a large extent, amp wise at least, or whether it is more subtle component and topology changes.
edit:  I should have said that EQ question applies to the different 'black/silver face' flavours as well as the different models within.

crunchman

For me, I think the smaller amps aren't as big in the low end, and sound a bit warmer when they start to break up.

ChrisMusic

Thanks @crunchman  

JonHosker

Carr Sportsman...black face/silver face not sure which but puts me a smiley face!!!

BintyTwanger77

Gassage said:

ChrisMusic said:

Cheers @Gassage , nice simple review there  


What about the various boutique offerings, do they follow a similar pattern or have more divergence ?

Also does the pattern hold true across the wattages and OP valve options ?

i.e. I assume that Princeton, Deluxe, Twin have a different 'flavour' as well as different wattages, or are they essentially louder versions of each other ?

Pretty much so, but there's a few curve balls- e.g. TK Imperial is exctly what you'd expect from a great Blackface Deluxe but looks like a Bush TV.

I'd say that in terms of Tweeds, Viccie are a tad cleaner and Lazy J a tad dirtier than their inspirations.

@riftamps are very close to originals, possibly a little hotter.

Fender RI's pretty much nail it- I mean the VVRI is spot on as is the DRRI and esp the 57 Deluxe which is a hero.

The Custom 57 Deluxe is indeed just beautiful. A very loud 12W as well.

ChrisMusic

Thanks for that @BintyTwanger77  &  @JonHosker ;

relic245

Gassage said:

Tweed- rough and saggy

What does saggy actually mean? I hear a lot about sag but zero idea what its all about. 

mr-mac

ChrisMusic said:

There is lots of expertise on the forum, so help me out here please.  

  ~ What are the different 'flavours' of Fender amps ?
  ~ And what makes the different sonic fingerprints of the family ?

I love the sound of a Twin Reverb, but they could level small villages, and weigh more than my house, so I really need to learn what the other amps they have produced over the years have to offer.  I am thinking more of the clean sounds here really, but a bit of O/D is always a welcome, if not entirely necessary option.


And on a related note

    ~ what do the boutique brands bring to the party ?
       Sonic differences, more variety, extended functionality.
       Are they really worth the extra price tag ?

Are there any good YouTube channels for getting a good idea of what the amps really sound like ?  It is so much easier to do some preliminary research this way, there is nowhere close to me to check anything out, and at the moment I am car-less too, so recommendations welcome...

Quadraverb   if you think twinreverb is heavy hahahahaha

richardhomer

relic245 said:What does saggy actually mean? I hear a lot about sag but zero idea what its all about. 

You've clearly never met my ex-wife then?

menamestom

crunchman said:

With the black/silverface type amps the smaller amps (Princeton, Deluxe Reverb etc.) aren't just smaller versions of the Twin.  They do have slightly different sound.  It might be partly the 6V6 vs 6L6 thing, but I think it's also partly down to the cab and speakers as well.

Also bias type, cathode or fixed, Phase invertor type and negative feedback.  Also rectifier valve type and the size of the output transformer.  Some things are synonymous with others, like alnico speakers and cathode bias, I think it's quite hard to isolate any one factor from another.  Even cab type has so many variables, wood type, baffle type (fixed vs floating), size etc.  So many factors.  

Edit:  sorry some of my factors are general Fender factors and don't apply to specifically blackface / silverface.

Richardj

First proper amp was a Blues Deluxe, thought a Mesa should be better, it wasn't. Have since had lots of decent amps, Cornford, Koch, Rivera etc. but none of them have really come near what I want. Each time I've gone back to a Fender amp. Pro Juniors, Deluxe Reverb, Twin.

I'm back with my old Hot Rod Deluxe again and it seems that for me a Fender 6L6 powered amp is tonal heaven.  I really want another '68 Custom Twin, that was just epic.

impmann

Richardj said:

First proper amp was a Blues Deluxe, thought a Mesa should be better, it wasn't. Have since had lots of decent amps, Cornford, Koch, Rivera etc. but none of them have really come near what I want. Each time I've gone back to a Fender amp. Pro Juniors, Deluxe Reverb, Twin.

I'm back with my old Hot Rod Deluxe again and it seems that for me a Fender 6L6 powered amp is tonal heaven.  I really want another '68 Custom Twin, that was just epic.

Nothing wrong with a HRD. In fact, I went a 'jam' recently where the other player had a posh silverface ProReverb (1970s job) and I prefered the sound of my HRD (mine is a Mk3) - literally swapped cables from the pedal boards and the HRD sounded bigger, warmer and clearer. Obv. no idea on valve ages etc in the ProReverb but the owner even commented on how good the HRD sounded.

jpfamps

impmann said:

Richardj said:

First proper amp was a Blues Deluxe, thought a Mesa should be better, it wasn't. Have since had lots of decent amps, Cornford, Koch, Rivera etc. but none of them have really come near what I want. Each time I've gone back to a Fender amp. Pro Juniors, Deluxe Reverb, Twin.

I'm back with my old Hot Rod Deluxe again and it seems that for me a Fender 6L6 powered amp is tonal heaven.  I really want another '68 Custom Twin, that was just epic.

Nothing wrong with a HRD. In fact, I went a 'jam' recently where the other player had a posh silverface ProReverb (1970s job) and I prefered the sound of my HRD (mine is a Mk3) - literally swapped cables from the pedal boards and the HRD sounded bigger, warmer and clearer. Obv. no idea on valve ages etc in the ProReverb but the owner even commented on how good the HRD sounded.

The late 70's ultra-linear Pro Reverbs aren't that great, and I would expect a HRD to be at least as good.

I would take an early 70's Pro Reverb over a HRD though.

ChrisMusic

richardhomer said:

relic245 said:What does saggy actually mean? I hear a lot about sag but zero idea what its all about. 

You've clearly never met my ex-wife then?

 Anthea Turner once remarked about how her once nice pert breasts had turned into something reminiscent of a boiled egg in a sock...

I guess that's gravity for you...     :-\"