So, once and for all..........definitive answer please (not personal preferences)

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bertiebertie Frets: 13564
edited August 2013 in Guitar
pickup covers on HB.  More trebbly or more bassy. ?


just because you don't, doesn't mean you can't
 just because you do, doesn't mean you should.
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  • stonevibestonevibe Frets: 7080
    Less highs with them on.

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  • ESchapESchap Frets: 1428

    Eh, you'll need to be a bit more specific!

    Will depend on the pickup type and construction, where the magnets are located, the power of the magnets, the material the cover is made from brass, German silver etc. and then coated with e.g. nickel or gold.

    Perceived wisdom is that metal covers on a humbucker will trim the highs a bit. 

    Pickup makers on here should know all ...

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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26746
    Better looking. Isn't that enough?! ;)
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  • OilCityPickupsOilCityPickups Frets: 9980
    edited August 2013 tFB Trader
    All metallic material in the flux will filter out some highs ... even nickel ... however nickel is far more 'transparent' than brass.
    As to whether that filtering is desirable on some pickups is a moot point. There are those who will use brass covers to 'tame' a harsh top end ... my argument is that it's better to build a pickup without a harsh top end than to muffle one that's been poorly designed. I only use nickel covers on my own pickups thesedays, as I want as much signal 'bredth' to come out of an amp as I can. Most of the people who dislike Tele neck pickups find that the missing part of the puzzle falls into place when they fit a nickel cover.
    Professional pickup winder, horse-testpilot and recovering Chocolate Hobnob addict.
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  • Paul_CPaul_C Frets: 7670
    fascinating - I put some chrome covers on some manky-looking humbuckers in a Westone Thunder 1-A and my feeling was that they were a little brighter sounding as a consequence - maybe I was imagining things :)
    "I'll probably be in the bins at Newport Pagnell services."  fretmeister
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71951
    edited August 2013
    Less treble, but not more bass. Even if it has no effect on the magnetic field the cover is a grounded shield and so has a capacitance to the coil, so it will cut a small amount of high-end. (This is not dependent on the material, any conductor has the same effect.)

    Sometimes the sound can be more open and less focused as well - it depends on how the cover interacts with the magnetic field, some materials do so far more than others as TheGuitarWeasel said - both due to the type of metal and the thickness of it. This can make the sound less midrangy, which can occasionally sound like a bit more bass and possibly even treble, but it isn't really.

    My experience is that covers have the most effect on higher-wound, softer-magnet pickups and the least effect on low-wound, stronger-magnet pickups. I like covers on some pickups and in some guitars, but not all. And yes, some of it is the appearance :). (eg I think covered pickups look wrong in Strats and open coils look wrong in Teles!)

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  • stickyfiddle;13581" said:
    Better looking. Isn't that enough?! ;)
    Definitely.....
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  • Adam_MDAdam_MD Frets: 3420
    stickyfiddle;13581" said:
    Better looking. Isn't that enough?! ;)
    Definitely.....
    +1.  Everytime I've had pickups wound for me though I always specify zebra bobbins and nickel covers.  No one can see them but I now they're there  :D
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  • SkippedSkipped Frets: 2371
    bertie - I don't see how they could be a definitive answer when pickup covers for humbuckers are not all the same. Different thicknesses. Some use no copper. Some use a copper flash before the nickel silver is plated with nickel/gold/chrome.

    For what it's worth - There might be a tiny bit more top end when comparing an uncovered pickup against the same pickup with a Throbak cover*. But I don't think I could pass a double blind test.


    * I think these are the best covers but it is very likely that I have been influenced by the fact that they are the best looking (most authentic shape etc) PAF covers.

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  • p90foolp90fool Frets: 31367
    Paul_C said:
    fascinating - I put some chrome covers on some manky-looking humbuckers in a Westone Thunder 1-A and my feeling was that they were a little brighter sounding as a consequence - maybe I was imagining things :)
    No, you're not imagining things. A clunky brass cover on your average Far-Eastern Tele pickup reduces the highs quite dramatically, and also reduces the overall output.

    On a bridge humbucker, the brighter screw coil (brighter because it's nearer the bridge) remains uncovered, but the other coil not only loses some highs, but has its overall output attenuated.
    In extreme cases (ie, cheapo shite pickups with covers made out of old school bells), this can leave you with a thinner-sounding pickup.




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  • MoltisantiMoltisanti Frets: 1131
    search on youtube for the bareknuckle demo of covered vs uncovered, it's very good

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  • bertiebertie Frets: 13564
    search on youtube for the bareknuckle demo of covered vs uncovered, it's very good
    there's a flaw in that argument....................and its contained in the first three words  ;)


    :D
    just because you don't, doesn't mean you can't
     just because you do, doesn't mean you should.
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  • Adam_MDAdam_MD Frets: 3420
    search on youtube for the bareknuckle demo of covered vs uncovered, it's very good
    +1 very good vid
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  • Dave_McDave_Mc Frets: 2324
    ICBM said:
    And yes, some of it is the appearance :). (eg I think covered pickups look wrong in Strats and open coils look wrong in Teles!)
    Yeah I pretty much go by looks. :)) I prefer covered humbuckers in gibson-style guitars (les pauls, sgs etc.).
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  • Putting covers on my PRS SE made it look £500 more expensive. Same with my Les Paul Studio.

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  • Van_HaydenVan_Hayden Frets: 437
    Eddy currents for one thing. Nickel silver alloys will sound pretty transparent. Introduce plating involving more copper & eddy currents rise taking more top end away. Eddy currents more than capacitance are the issue here - capacitive losses tend to happen when you've got long signal runs parralel to ground - in a guitar lead for example.

    Another change is down to the position of the screws. When you've got a cover on you tend to have the screws further out a bit, changing the tone a bit.

    To be honest as long as you're not using brass I wouldn't worry. I don't fit brass to anything unless someone wants a vintage style Tele neck with a muffler on....
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  • OilCityPickupsOilCityPickups Frets: 9980
    tFB Trader
    Eddy currents for one thing. Nickel silver alloys will sound pretty transparent. Introduce plating involving more copper & eddy currents rise taking more top end away. Eddy currents more than capacitance are the issue here - capacitive losses tend to happen when you've got long signal runs parralel to ground - in a guitar lead for example.

    Another change is down to the position of the screws. When you've got a cover on you tend to have the screws further out a bit, changing the tone a bit.

    To be honest as long as you're not using brass I wouldn't worry. I don't fit brass to anything unless someone wants a vintage style Tele neck with a muffler on....
    There you have it in a nutshell! Brass is a suitable material for monkey gonads ... obviously not in cooler climates ... but not so cool for pickup covers :) 
    Interestingly enough - if at least one interview with Seth Lover is correct - he designed the PAF without adjustable pole screws ... simply adding them as an afterthought as the marketing people wanted added selling points in the way of things for guitarists to fiddle with! Twin slug coil humbuckers sound different to slug/screw or even twin screw coil. so history could have been quite different :)  
    Professional pickup winder, horse-testpilot and recovering Chocolate Hobnob addict.
    Formerly TheGuitarWeasel ... Oil City Pickups  ... Oil City Blog 7 String.org profile and message  

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  • bertiebertie Frets: 13564
    Eddy currents for one thing. Nickel silver alloys will sound pretty transparent. Introduce plating involving more copper & eddy currents rise taking more top end away. Eddy currents more than capacitance are the issue here - capacitive losses tend to happen when you've got long signal runs parralel to ground - in a guitar lead for example.

    Another change is down to the position of the screws. When you've got a cover on you tend to have the screws further out a bit, changing the tone a bit.

    To be honest as long as you're not using brass I wouldn't worry. I don't fit brass to anything unless someone wants a vintage style Tele neck with a muffler on....
    so, what about a Bulldog PAF/ Cool PAF  ?   ;)
    just because you don't, doesn't mean you can't
     just because you do, doesn't mean you should.
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