The Martin D35...

Moe_Zambeek

I've been refining my preferences in the acoustic domain and trying a pile of guitars to see what I prefer. Contrary to my own expectations, I've ended up back in the Martin-sounding camp. After running the racks at my local GAS emporium it was the Martin D35 that I came back to. It wasn't 'perfect' but it was close, and I much preferred it to the D28, with a D18 coming in second place. All of the Gibsons (*all* of the Gibsons) were dead as doornails and less well made than the Yamahas, and the Matons seemed crude and stiff. The Taylors all sounded like Taylors...can't afford a Collings (and they had none in stock anyway) so back to the D35. 

My concern is the legendary 'whumpiness' much discussed with these - to my ears the D35 had a big, open bass and fairly strong trebles but with a quite restrained midrange. I need it for open mic acoustic stuff with a male and / or female vocal, and also for acoustic full band sessions (i.e. playing smaller sessions with the rock band in a fully acoustic mode). In other words, yer bog standard acoustic playing, lots of picked full chord strumming with some fingerstyle and partial chords etc. I can't stretch to a D35 retro with the Fishman Aura so it would probably be a used D35 with a Baggs or similar or the Martin thinline gold thing and possibly a preamp pedal. Whatever I can pull together roughly in line with what I can sell my Lowden for.

Am I going to run into problems controlling the D35s bottom end on a stage? What are the known drawbacks / things to look out for with these?

crunchman

If you want Martin style but can't stretch to an HD28V that has the pre-war style "forward shifted" bracing then I'd seriously look at a Furch/Stonebridge.

richardhomer

Probably the best sounding Dreadnought I've ever played was a '73 D35. If you like the guitar, I wouldn't hesitate.

Jalapeno

Maybe @Lewy can help ?

I had an HD35 - victim of said whumpiness - apparently due to scalloped barcing. 

I *think* Lewy said than plain D model wouldn't be prone to this.

Lewy

My experience is only with the HD35 - and as @Jalapeno pointed out I think scalloped 1/4" bracing is a step too far on a dread and the bass sounds washy and undefined. But the D35 isn't scalloped so should be a different kettle of fish. I'd go for it. Didn't seem to trouble Johnny Cash too much.

Moe_Zambeek

Thanks all. Would love a Johnny Cash style all black D35 but not many of those around!

ICBM

The D35 is deeper and more scooped-sounding than the D28, even without scalloped bracing - it's the 3-piece back which does that.

[stuck record] Don't get one with a built-in pickup/preamp anyway. Get a plain acoustic and retro-fit it with a simple pickup, no onboard preamp, and do the rest offboard. That way you aren't tied to a technology which will be obsolete in ten years and with the reliability problems of internal preamps and batteries. [/stuck record]

The K&K Pure Mini is an excellent passive internal solution, although it can be a *bit* bassy, which might be more of an issue on a 35… but you can always EQ it, and it just flat-out sounds better than an undersaddle pickup in the first place.

Moe_Zambeek

Message received and understood

RandallFlagg

The 'whumpy' bass issue is why I chose my D28 over an HD28. When compared side by side with an HD28 (scalloped bracing) my ears told me the HD28 was louder, fuller and better sounding. But after going back and forth between the 2 for a couple of days I realised the HD28 was stronger in bass and treble and the D28 was more balanced and so the mid range came through. The bass on the HD28 was almost overwhelming when I tried to sing over it and I would expect it to be tricky to record in a mix.

I haven't been lucky enough to try a D35 but with it's straight braced like the D28 so shouldn't has as prominent bass response as a scalloped braced Martin but I would expect it to have more than a D28. It should be just about right, but's that's just my speculation.

Let your ears decide...

crunchman

RandallFlagg said:

The 'whumpy' bass issue is why I chose my D28 over an HD28. When compared side by side with an HD28 (scalloped bracing) my ears told me the HD28 was louder, fuller and better sounding. But after going back and forth between the 2 for a couple of days I realised the HD28 was stronger in bass and treble and the D28 was more balanced and so the mid range came through. The bass on the HD28 was almost overwhelming when I tried to sing over it and I would expect it to be tricky to record in a mix.

I haven't been lucky enough to try a D35 but with it's straight braced like the D28 so shouldn't has as prominent bass response as a scalloped braced Martin but I would expect it to have more than a D28. It should be just about right, but's that's just my speculation.

Let your ears decide...

Position of bracing is more important than whether it's scalloped or not.  Compare a D28, and HD28 (scalloped), and an HD28V (scalloped "forward shifted" pre-war style) and the HD28 will sound closer to the D28 than the HD28V - at least that's my experience.

BigLicks67

I tried a D18V recently which sounded really alive and had a tremendous tone. That aside I do like the balanced sound of a D28 for all types of playing. I think scalloped bracing would be a bonus for finger style playing but I imagine most people use a dreadnought for strumming/flatpicking.

rustneversleeps

A Martin M 36 will take some beating if you can find one.

artiebear

rustneversleeps said:

A Martin M 36 will take some beating if you can find one.

Always a good call in this kind of debate, or even the much overlooked J40 which is effectively a dread depth M series guitar, both great.

To the OP
If it's got to be a D I would tend to go with head over heart and agree that forward shifted / scalloped bracing in a D can lead to an instrument that suits some, but not all. I have a D28 that I gigged for nearly 20 years during the 80's /90's (less since ) and a D41 that is 17 years old but not played half as much. When played finger style the D28 is much warmer and some would say "opened up" while the D41 is sounds tighter but with an interesting chime and compression. Personally,  I love them both .  I know that I'm saying nothing you don't already know but don't make a judgement on how it sounds in the store (if new) but think about how it will develop down the line. If it's lower mid heavy new it will only get more so, if it's slightly brassy (but full) now it will mellow out . 

Personally, I would die to keep the Lowden and find something to scratch the more American sound on the side

Good luck and enjoy the search 

richardhomer

Just my view on the standard/HD issue. HDs tend to sound quintessentially 'Dread-like' - lots of heavy bass and forward trebles. Standards are more balanced - a sort of half-way house between HD and 000s. Or to put it another way - better all rounders.

Moe_Zambeek

Too many options in acoustics @artiebear I was playing the Lowden earlier, it does sound great. In fact it sounds so much 'more' than the Martins but that's part of the problem, I think. That and I still don't like the neck.... 

i wonder if i can use an eq / preamp to make my little 00-16 sound a bit more dread-like in a live application...

artiebear

Moe_Zambeek said:

Too many options in acoustics @artiebear I was playing the Lowden earlier, it does sound great. In fact it sounds so much 'more' than the Martins but that's part of the problem, I think. That and I still don't like the neck.... 

i wonder if i can use an eq / preamp to make my little 00-16 sound a bit more dread-like in a live application...

And there is the rub I'm just back from 10 days of acoustic gigs, not touched the 2 guitars I had with me (apart from cleaning etc) now got a couple more out and thinking about an addition (potential Lowden) trouble is we love them all

TBH  plugged in, the feel still matters but the sound between a dread and an 0 narrows so much to be more about the pick up / sound system . I remember seeing Fairport Convention about 80 years ago,:)  Simon Nicholl was using a parlour ( Bill Mates, I think ? ) 2K plus in the hall. a full band, and it sounded huge.