Amp Sim vs Modelling Amp?

BRISTOL86

Hi All

Please excuse the probably silly question but could someone please enlighten me on the differences between using a modelling amp and using an amp sim?

Long story short I currently have a Yamaha THR10 - I only play at home, in a spare bedroom, so have no need for a larger amp. 

Ive jut started looking into the world of recording myself and so just started digging around with the world of 'virtual' instruments etc. 

The question im now asking is do I actually need a physical amp at all given my usage? Is the Yamaha doing anything that can't be done through the audio interface with amp sims? 

Presumably id need some monitor speakers to output the sound but then in essence is that doing the same job as the Yamaha is doing? 

Sorry this probably sounds like a stupid question but this is all pretty new to me. I don't want to be constantly switching between amp and audio interface every time I want to go from playing to recording, so if I buy an interface am I essentially making the THR redundant?

siraxeman

Pretty much in 99% of cases the exact same thing. There have been some amp sims that weren't said to be digital modelling but these days rare to none existent.

Amp sim programs/software allow you to do it all inside your pootah without a real physical amp, or you can USB from a modeller or go old school and mic it up and patch that into your IE. Up to you really, but with decent software you don't need hardware amps or amp modellers.

siraxeman

oops double post.

Teetonetal

Before I got a helix, I was playing exclusively at home through the laptop. 

Guitar into interface into Laptop running S-gear, listening through headphones and occasional speakers. Now I do the same thing really, just the interface and Sgear has morphed into helix.

I much prefer this to having an amp. I live in a flat, with two kids under 3, volume is just not possible. The modelling enables me to be flexible, I can record into a daw, play over itunes or the internet. I love it. I have got into soft synths in a big way too. Without this method, I just wouldn't be playing at all.

Amps are reserved for rehearsal and gigs where I can crank up and be loud. 

IMO a VST/SIM plus speakers / headphones will be 10000 times more flexible and enjoyable than the Yamaha.

Fretwired

I have a THR10 and I use Amplitube as a VST plugin. To answer your question it depends on the guitar tone you're after. The THR10 is perfectly capable of providing you with a decent recorded guitar tone. However, the amps, FX, mics and cabs are limited. I tend to like Fender amps so have the Amplitube Fender pack (endorsed by Fender) which is great. It boils down to your personal taste. If you're happy with the tone from your THR10 then save your money and don't buy a plugin.

You can connect your THR10 to your PC and tweak the tone with a Yamaha app that gives you deep editing options with things like compressors. Not sure if you've seen this:

BRISTOL86

Thanks all. Seems like the computer based approach is a viable option then. 

So in theory if I were to do away with the Yamaha and do it all through the Mac it's just a case of hooking up a pair of speakers to the audio interface? Do you have a recommendation for a set of small desktop speakers that would do the job? Anything in particular I need to know, or would most mid range computer speakers be reasonable? 

Like I said I only play at home so don't need ear bleeding levels of volume!

@fretwired I need to buy an interface anyway as I need to hook up a mic to record vocals and acoustic guitar so that's why I'm questioning whether I actually need the THR or not. 

dindude

Teetonetal said:

Before I got a helix, I was playing exclusively at home through the laptop. 

Guitar into interface into Laptop running S-gear, listening through headphones and occasional speakers. Now I do the same thing really, just the interface and Sgear has morphed into helix.

I much prefer this to having an amp. I live in a flat, with two kids under 3, volume is just not possible. The modelling enables me to be flexible, I can record into a daw, play over itunes or the internet. I love it. I have got into soft synths in a big way too. Without this method, I just wouldn't be playing at all.

Amps are reserved for rehearsal and gigs where I can crank up and be loud. 

IMO a VST/SIM plus speakers / headphones will be 10000 times more flexible and enjoyable than the Yamaha.

How would you rate Helix directly compared to Sgear for quality of tones btw. I've tried Sgear but haven't tried Helix.

nick79

All my playing at home these days is through my pc using Amplitube, its so much less hassle than setting my amp and pedals up, they are saved now for band practise and gigs. As @Teetonetal says you can play along with youtube or mp3's or GuitarPro (which is another great program). I've got the Fender and Mesa Boogie add ons and they are really really good. It's not a cheap package but it's the best i've found (for me) of all the amp sims. 

I'm tempted to look into maybe getting the tablet version and using it at gigs through the PA if my main amp ever goes down.

BRISTOL86

Thanks all for your input, much appreciated.

Can someone point me in the right direction in terms of the sort of speakers I'd need for a bedroom setup going down the Amplitube (or similar) route? Id like to be able to play music directly from the PC to them as well, presumably this is possible

Thanks

BRISTOL86

Ok so I downloaded the Amplitube demo and it seems great (well as great as it can through a MacBooks built in speaker...) 

Only thing is there's just an ever so slight delay between what I strum and what I hear - this is what's referred to as the latency, yes?

I'm guessing this is because I'm using the THR10 as the interface - which isn't really what it's designed for - and a dedicated audio interface would eliminate that issue?

Teetonetal

I just have some cheap behringer speakers the ms16 I think. They do the job well and are £60 ish.

Teetonetal

dindude said:

Teetonetal said:

Before I got a helix, I was playing exclusively at home through the laptop. 

Guitar into interface into Laptop running S-gear, listening through headphones and occasional speakers. Now I do the same thing really, just the interface and Sgear has morphed into helix.

I much prefer this to having an amp. I live in a flat, with two kids under 3, volume is just not possible. The modelling enables me to be flexible, I can record into a daw, play over itunes or the internet. I love it. I have got into soft synths in a big way too. Without this method, I just wouldn't be playing at all.

Amps are reserved for rehearsal and gigs where I can crank up and be loud. 

IMO a VST/SIM plus speakers / headphones will be 10000 times more flexible and enjoyable than the Yamaha.

How would you rate Helix directly compared to Sgear for quality of tones btw. I've tried Sgear but haven't tried Helix.

Well... I really like sgear. The stealer is a great amp model. Especially if boosted with a Klon or a ts pedal... I also have got good tones from the custom 57..

However, it's taken me a while but I believe what I can get from helix is at least on par if not better now. Certainly more varied and defiantly more flexible. 

I'm excited to see where sgear goes next as for me it's streets ahead of the other vsts.

Let's not forget that sgear is only 100usd

dindude

Teetonetal said:

dindude said:

Teetonetal said:

Before I got a helix, I was playing exclusively at home through the laptop. 

Guitar into interface into Laptop running S-gear, listening through headphones and occasional speakers. Now I do the same thing really, just the interface and Sgear has morphed into helix.

I much prefer this to having an amp. I live in a flat, with two kids under 3, volume is just not possible. The modelling enables me to be flexible, I can record into a daw, play over itunes or the internet. I love it. I have got into soft synths in a big way too. Without this method, I just wouldn't be playing at all.

Amps are reserved for rehearsal and gigs where I can crank up and be loud. 

IMO a VST/SIM plus speakers / headphones will be 10000 times more flexible and enjoyable than the Yamaha.

How would you rate Helix directly compared to Sgear for quality of tones btw. I've tried Sgear but haven't tried Helix.

Well... I really like sgear. The stealer is a great amp model. Especially if boosted with a Klon or a ts pedal... I also have got good tones from the custom 57..

However, it's taken me a while but I believe what I can get from helix is at least on par if not better now. Certainly more varied and defiantly more flexible. 

I'm excited to see where sgear goes next as for me it's streets ahead of the other vsts.

Let's not forget that sgear is only 100usd

Cool, I think I'll give Sgear another go, like you said, it's great value

BRISTOL86

Teetonetal said:

I just have some cheap behringer speakers the ms16 I think. They do the job well and are £60 ish.

Thanks will check them out! 

Another stupid question (sorry!) but do the speakers connect to the interface or the computer?  This is all v new to me as you probably guessed 

Freebird

Helix hardware is basically also a computer. BTW, Line 6 are releasing a native version of Helix that will run on your laptop just like S-Gear/Amplitube does.

Freebird

BRISTOL86 said:

Another stupid question (sorry!) but do the speakers connect to the interface or the computer?  This is all v new to me as you probably guessed 

Headphones, speakers and the guitar connect to the audio interface.

BRISTOL86

Freebird said:

BRISTOL86 said:

Another stupid question (sorry!) but do the speakers connect to the interface or the computer?  This is all v new to me as you probably guessed 

Headphones, speakers and the guitar connect to the audio interface.

Thanks that's what I thought! I'm after speakers with a small footprint (i play in a small spare room!) - looking at the Mackie CR3 if anyone has any thoughts on them or alternatives? 

chickenchaser

Interesting discussion as I'm in the same position with a THR10c and I'm looking at continuing with home playing however I'd really like the option of a looper but with a physical pedal so that I can add in parts just with a foot controller. Is that possible with a software setup on PC? 

PonchoGreg

Yes it is really: looper. Just use it like you would on an actual amp, same for all pedals really.

I tend to agree with most above. These days I probably play 80% of the time through the pc. S-gear is tremendous, and allows me to run lovely break-up tones that are hard for me to replicate at home (even with a DRRI). Plus the option of playing on top of Spotify, YouTube, etc. Just à phenomenal tool and much nicer than any pod or modelling amp I've tried (but I haven't tried really high end stuff)

Freebird

BRISTOL86 said:

Freebird said:

BRISTOL86 said:

Another stupid question (sorry!) but do the speakers connect to the interface or the computer?  This is all v new to me as you probably guessed 

Headphones, speakers and the guitar connect to the audio interface.

Thanks that's what I thought! I'm after speakers with a small footprint (i play in a small spare room!) - looking at the Mackie CR3 if anyone has any thoughts on them or alternatives? 

Make sure the speakers are active. There are plenty of options available at all prices. Maybe you could try the used market too?

Freebird

chickenchaser said:

Interesting discussion as I'm in the same position with a THR10c and I'm looking at continuing with home playing however I'd really like the option of a looper but with a physical pedal so that I can add in parts just with a foot controller. Is that possible with a software setup on PC? 

You will have unlimited tracks on a computer using DAW software. You can even loop specific parts and choose the best take, and swap amps/fx, etc. You will probably control the process with a mouse though, unless you use a midi foot pedal. On the positive side you can easily add drums, vocals and Synths, etc.

I was watching Ed Sheering the other night, and he uses his looper in a different way (performance orientated). The method above is more akin to a recording studio setup.