C Sus4+9 tuning...apart from Martin Simpson, who else has used it?

Lewy

Realise this belongs in the technique sub forum really but I figure it's probably an acoustic only topic and anyone who'd know likely hangs out here...

Have been listening to Martin Simpson a lot recently (inspired by the recent thread about his pricey slide!). Love his use of this tuning on songs like Jackie & Murphy and Delta Dreams. Has anyone else recorded much with it - would like to check out some other use cases. Maybe one for @AliGorie ?

ToneControl

what notes are in that?

Lewy

ToneControl said:

what notes are in that?

It's CGCFCD, or I V I IV I II at whatever pitch.

So you could look at it as Drop D interval-wise except with the 2nd string tuned up a tone and a half.

AliGorie

wooops just read u'r later post lewy - ah - the one with the 'F' - yes an interesting tuning, sorry for the stuff bellow..
again two crappy recordings - Jeanies Tune was a tune that came too  me thinking about my mother - a highland traveling woman in the first half of last century.
switched the computer on and ’saved’ it so your listening to me ‘thinking it through in the first take.
Second is why I use this tuning, it’s a harp tune by Rory Dall Mor Morrison - from the 16 hundreds - it’s called The Lament for the Hark Key - the Key was what tuned the harp to its various tunings and Rory Dall  (Blind Rory Mor = great) was lamenting the passing of the old Gaelic Bardic tradition that had been in existence for 1,000 years - he was the last harper to the MacLeod’s Of Dunvegan Skye




if you mean CGCGCD Lewy i came to it in the later ’80’s as a means of mimicking the larger spread of notes on the clarsach ( Scots / Irish small harp) which interestingly use ’tunings’ - going back 1 Millenia !!

https://myspace.com/geordieadams/music/song/tree-of-strings-16862281-16663466


I found adding the ‘D’ introduced interesting ‘modern’ sounding (suspended) so stuck with that.

  

VimFuego

nic jones was known to use that tuning, off the top of my head not sure on what songs: https://www.folkmusic.net/htmfiles/inart_nicjones_guitarstyle.htm

Lewy

AliGorie said:

wooops just read u'r later post lewy - ah - the one with the 'F' - yes an interesting tuning, sorry for the stuff bellow..
again two crappy recordings - Jeanies Tune was a tune that came too  me thinking about my mother - a highland traveling woman in the first half of last century.
switched the computer on and ’saved’ it so your listening to me ‘thinking it through in the first take.
Second is why I use this tuning, it’s a harp tune by Rory Dall Mor Morrison - from the 16 hundreds - it’s called The Lament for the Hark Key - the Key was what tuned the harp to its various tunings and Rory Dall  (Blind Rory Mor = great) was lamenting the passing of the old Gaelic Bardic tradition that had been in existence for 1,000 years - he was the last harper to the MacLeod’s Of Dunvegan Skye




if you mean CGCGCD Lewy i came to it in the later ’80’s as a means of mimicking the larger spread of notes on the clarsach ( Scots / Irish small harp) which interestingly use ’tunings’ - going back 1 Millenia !!

https://myspace.com/geordieadams/music/song/tree-of-strings-16862281-16663466


I found adding the ‘D’ introduced interesting ‘modern’ sounding (suspended) so stuck with that.

  

That link just shows up as a photo @AliGorie but  found it on youtube - cool stuff! Yes I was asking about the one with the IV in it but your clip has lots going on that carries over. Thanks for sharing!

The 9 on the top string is a really interesting suspension, but also experimenting with the tuning, having the first and second notes of the scale on adjacent open strings makes for some fun revisiting of more melodic country blues (like Mississippi John Hurts' drop d tunes).

Lewy

VimFuego said:

nic jones was known to use that tuning, off the top of my head not sure on what songs: https://www.folkmusic.net/htmfiles/inart_nicjones_guitarstyle.htm

Thanks @VimFuego - will check it out.

Further exploration with this tuning reveals that Tom Waits piano ballads positively fall out of the guitar with it.

Which is nice.

Handled with care, the 4th on the open 3rd string is very handy for those parts of an arrangement where you want to go a little lighter and take it into a higher register.

Apart from the "classic" open tunings that I use for country blues (so, G/A & E/D) this is the first altered tuning that's kept my interest after a few days, and my Collings OM2H really seems to like it tuned up to D (DADGDE) with .012s - which means I probably won't move that guitar on like I was planning to. Plus with that arrangement I only need to retune two strings to be in standard. So fairly practical on gigs.

AuldReekie

Tony McManus uses CGCGCD quite a lot: I keep my McilRoy A30 in that tuning 

Basher

VimFuego said:

nic jones was known to use that tuning, off the top of my head not sure on what songs: https://www.folkmusic.net/htmfiles/inart_nicjones_guitarstyle.htm

I think he used it on a few things but a quick Google reveals that Canadee-i-o used these intervals but half a step down, starting with a Bb. Wonderful tune!

BigLicks67

Basher said:

VimFuego said:

nic jones was known to use that tuning, off the top of my head not sure on what songs: https://www.folkmusic.net/htmfiles/inart_nicjones_guitarstyle.htm

I think he used it on a few things but a quick Google reveals that Canadee-i-o used these intervals but half a step down, starting with a Bb. Wonderful tune!

I think Canadee I O would be C sus2(?) rather than Csus 4 mentioned by Lewy.

So CGCGCD not CGCFCD.

AliGorie

BigLicks67 said:

So CGCGCD not CGCFCD.

yeah, I recall NJ using open C with the D on the top string.
Having thought about it a little, I seem to recall part of the CGCFCD reminded me of an Appalachian banjo tuning - which I played 50 yrs ago. Same sets of intervals IIR, memory is not reliable now so cant remember the actual tuning - anyone?.
And isn't it kinda 'dadgadie' ?

Lewy

AliGorie said:

And isn't it kinda 'dadgadie' ?

Same intervals as DADGAD on the bottom 4 strings yeah, although I have never really got into DADGAD as a tuning as it's main advantages don't really appeal to me musically. I love a good slow air, and the Ulster Scots influences in American old time and bluegrass, but other than that, not really into Celtic music and that seems to be what DADGAD plays to (that and Laurence Juber-style stuff which isn't my bag either).

But this sus4+9 tuning is instantly gratifying for a much broader range of material it seems.