Amp "Sweet Spot" Question

paulnb57

I keep reading about Amp Sweet spot, but what is it? I have no idea what it means!.....

Will I be able to find it or is it like 'er indoors G Spot?

ThePrettyDamned

It's just when an amp sounds best. 

As this depends on the volume, room, guitar used, player playing, player's ears and pedals it's very subjective. Thus, if someone says, "the sweet spot is with the equipment set just above noon on everything" it might sound horrible to you. 

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

equalsql

The Fender Blues Junior gets quite a bit of stick on here, but put the master volume on full, roll off​ some mids add a splash of reverb and then bring up the preamp to room volume, keeping it clean.. and it is just about one of the sweetest tones l have ever heard from any amp.. especially when using a Telecaster.

ICBM

The odd thing is that - although I can't work out what the technical basis is - the 'where the controls do the most' method actually does seem to have some merit, at least as a good way to start. I think the point being that most of the useful range of the controls is around there - going further beyond it doesn't usually make that much difference.

I would say the 'sweet spot' is more than that though, it's where the amp really seems to open up and become extra-responsive - usually at a particular volume as well as tone setting. It can be as much of a curse as a blessing if you don't have any other means of controlling the volume and it's too loud (or quiet) for the band situation.

EricTheWeary

ThePrettyDamned said:

It's just when an amp sounds best. 

As this depends on the volume, room, guitar used, player playing, player's ears and pedals it's very subjective. Thus, if someone says, "the sweet spot is with the equipment set just above noon on everything" it might sound horrible to you. 

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

I'm not too sure I understand this last bit - what some people do is try to find the flat point ( where it's not cutting or boosting) for each eq knob so you have the flattest sound that amp will make. That then becomes the easiest place to adjust from for taste from or the platform for a fly rig style approach.
Not the same as the sweet spot though which is really just where you think an amp sounds best. 

Sassafras

There's not much point in starting off with all the controls set at minimum so I generally set them at max and work from there.
I've got a strange knack of making all amps sound the same with this method.

ICBM

EricTheWeary said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

I'm not too sure I understand this last bit - what some people do is try to find the flat point ( where it's not cutting or boosting) for each eq knob so you have the flattest sound that amp will make. That then becomes the easiest place to adjust from for taste from or the platform for a fly rig style approach.

No, it's when you try to find the point where the control makes the biggest difference over the smallest turn range. Most amps do this - it's rare to find one where the control is perfectly even throughout the turn. If you find that spot on each control - and obviously set it to the part of that small range where you think it sounds best - then it does often seem that the amp sounds particularly lively and good.

I thought it was BS when I first read about it too - but having tried it a lot, with a huge number of different amps, I really think there is something in it. It doesn't *always* work, not least because some amps just don't have enough tone range on the controls to achieve what you want, and sometimes because they're very interactive so the setting on one changes the most-effective point on another, but more often than not it does.

At the very least, it will make you listen properly to what each control is actually doing, so you've got a better chance of dialling it in by the sound, rather than just setting it to your favourite numbers.

normula1

I learned this method from a magazine interview with Matt Schofield.
My JMP Marshall has a real sweet spot on the volume control just above 7 where it comes alive and above that it compresses too much.

ThePrettyDamned

EricTheWeary said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

It's just when an amp sounds best. 

As this depends on the volume, room, guitar used, player playing, player's ears and pedals it's very subjective. Thus, if someone says, "the sweet spot is with the equipment set just above noon on everything" it might sound horrible to you. 

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

I'm not too sure I understand this last bit - what some people do is try to find the flat point ( where it's not cutting or boosting) for each eq knob so you have the flattest sound that amp will make. That then becomes the easiest place to adjust from for taste from or the platform for a fly rig style approach.
Not the same as the sweet spot though which is really just where you think an amp sounds best. 

But you can't make a guitar amp sound flat, so that's fruitless imo. Just make it sound good for the kit you use. 

57Deluxe

The 'Sweet Spot' will depend on which guitar/fx/location too so are so many variables. Best thing is to constantly take pics of any particular setting scenario  that hits the spot inc pedal settings and print out and keep in a go-to folder for quick reference. Don't forget to add in a description or will all merge into an Altzeimic haze...

http://i66.tinypic.com/noj995.jpg

richardhomer

Where the headroom/compression characteristics combine perfectly for the way you play - so it is (to some extent) - is player-dependent.

EricTheWeary

ThePrettyDamned said:

EricTheWeary said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

It's just when an amp sounds best. 

As this depends on the volume, room, guitar used, player playing, player's ears and pedals it's very subjective. Thus, if someone says, "the sweet spot is with the equipment set just above noon on everything" it might sound horrible to you. 

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

I'm not too sure I understand this last bit - what some people do is try to find the flat point ( where it's not cutting or boosting) for each eq knob so you have the flattest sound that amp will make. That then becomes the easiest place to adjust from for taste from or the platform for a fly rig style approach.
Not the same as the sweet spot though which is really just where you think an amp sounds best. 

But you can't make a guitar amp sound flat, so that's fruitless imo. Just make it sound good for the kit you use. 

As flat as it can be ; the sound of that amp (+ speaker) with the least eq boosted or reduced. Not necessarily leaving it like that but that gives you a base to work from. 

Vaiai

ICBM said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

No, it's when you try to find the point where the control makes the biggest difference over the smallest turn range. Most amps do this - it's rare to find one where the control is perfectly even throughout the turn. If you find that spot on each control - and obviously set it to the part of that small range where you think it sounds best - then it does often seem that the amp sounds particularly lively and good.

I watched a vid about this and tried it on my own amp - it gave me a better starting point than my usual 12 o'clock.
What I wasn't sure about was if there is any difference depending on the guitar you use or if those spots are unique to the amp - does the amount of input hitting it (i.e from Single Coils or HBs) affect it? Or will they have the same area no matter how loud or quiet you have the amp - or how cranked the channel is....lots of factors in play!

I think there is that EQ process but for me the term sweet spot is about where the amp starts to cook/breakup and sounds "better" which is of course subjective!

Vaiai

I guess guys that demo amps a lot would be able to give good advice on this subject: Not saying it's the right way but I tried it and there is definitely a point on each of my EQ knobs where the sound changed as in the vid. 

mburekenge

Vaiai said:

I guess guys that demo amps a lot would be able to give good advice on this subject: Not saying it's the right way but I tried it and there is definitely a point on each of my EQ knobs where the sound changed as in the vid. 

He says no effects, but there is clearly loads of echo?

ThePrettyDamned

EricTheWeary said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

EricTheWeary said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

It's just when an amp sounds best. 

As this depends on the volume, room, guitar used, player playing, player's ears and pedals it's very subjective. Thus, if someone says, "the sweet spot is with the equipment set just above noon on everything" it might sound horrible to you. 

Some people twiddle eq knobs and set them just at the point where they have most effect - again, a nonsense way to dial in an amp and yet plenty of pros endorse it. What if you do that but there is too much treble and not enough bass in the tone? Just set them where you like it.

I'm not too sure I understand this last bit - what some people do is try to find the flat point ( where it's not cutting or boosting) for each eq knob so you have the flattest sound that amp will make. That then becomes the easiest place to adjust from for taste from or the platform for a fly rig style approach.
Not the same as the sweet spot though which is really just where you think an amp sounds best. 

But you can't make a guitar amp sound flat, so that's fruitless imo. Just make it sound good for the kit you use. 

As flat as it can be ; the sound of that amp (+ speaker) with the least eq boosted or reduced. Not necessarily leaving it like that but that gives you a base to work from. 

But what if it uses a passive tone circuit? Most amps do, so technically just maxing them all out is the point at which they've not been cut or boosted (as they can't be boosted, only cut) as much as possible per control. But that sometimes (though not always) sounds a bit rubbish. 

Likewise, on a blackface, I wouldn't start with the treble at 3, bass at 0 and mids on 10 (out of 10) just to try to counter the scooped sound of blackface amps. 

I just play, and work out what is needed. Obviously eq controls are interactive a lot of the time, but if a sound is a bit thin and weedy I'll bring up the bass and mids a bit more, and maybe bring the treble down. Too boomy and the bass is brought back down etc. 

My current vox simplifies things - it has a 6 way tone switch and a cut knob. At home, the cut knob barely does anything as the master is low and it's a power stage control, but the 6 way knob means I just quickly flick through and it's settled. I think the reason people are starting to favour more simple amps again is because the controls don't do a huge amount - the amp either works for you or it doesn't, so more time is spent playing than tweaking. 

Much harder on something like a Boogie Mark series, though, where the controls are *very* powerful, very interactive and extremely fussy. In that case, perhaps another method works better. 

paulnb57

I think the reason people are starting to favour more simple amps again is because the controls don't do a huge amount - the amp either works for you or it doesn't, so more time is spent playing than tweaking. 

Wisdom! I totally agree having just bought a Jet City 20W single channel head, very simple,,less fiddling......along with an Esquire Partscaster equally simple.....

ICBM

ThePrettyDamned said:

But what if it uses a passive tone circuit? Most amps do, so technically just maxing them all out is the point at which they've not been cut or boosted (as they can't be boosted, only cut) as much as possible per control.

Not quite. In the standard TMB tone stack used in most guitar amps, while maxing the bass and middle does give you the least cut of those frequencies, maxing the treble doesn't - because the treble control acts as more of a balance between treble and the middle and bass, the controls are interactive, and maxing the treble will reduce the middle and bass. which is why...

ThePrettyDamned said:

But that sometimes (though not always) sounds a bit rubbish.

ThePrettyDamned

ICBM said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

But what if it uses a passive tone circuit? Most amps do, so technically just maxing them all out is the point at which they've not been cut or boosted (as they can't be boosted, only cut) as much as possible per control.

Not quite. In the standard TMB tone stack used in most guitar amps, while maxing the bass and middle does give you the least cut of those frequencies, maxing the treble doesn't - because the treble control acts as more of a balance between treble and the middle and bass, the controls are interactive, and maxing the treble will reduce the middle and bass. which is why...

ThePrettyDamned said:

But that sometimes (though not always) sounds a bit rubbish.

Huh, didn't know that! Although it does make perfect sense. 

With dialling in amps, I feel it's just something that I do quite intuitively. The exceptions are things like boogies.

professorben

ThePrettyDamned said:

ICBM said:

ThePrettyDamned said:

But what if it uses a passive tone circuit? Most amps do, so technically just maxing them all out is the point at which they've not been cut or boosted (as they can't be boosted, only cut) as much as possible per control.

Not quite. In the standard TMB tone stack used in most guitar amps, while maxing the bass and middle does give you the least cut of those frequencies, maxing the treble doesn't - because the treble control acts as more of a balance between treble and the middle and bass, the controls are interactive, and maxing the treble will reduce the middle and bass. which is why...

ThePrettyDamned said:

But that sometimes (though not always) sounds a bit rubbish.

Huh, didn't know that! Although it does make perfect sense. 

With dialling in amps, I feel it's just something that I do quite intuitively. The exceptions are things like boogies.

Agreed. 
I watched the guy in the shop demo the Mesa Preamp and he set everything at noon. 

Sounded like arse. 

I set it how John Petrucci recommends to set his boogies. 
Bass 1-2
Mids 3-4
Treble 7-8

then massive V in the post gain graphic eq. 


Sounded incredible. 

I cannot imagine any other Amp where these settings will produce anything other than an unusable sound. 

clarkefan

All I can add to the conversation is that when I get the volume (with attenuater) up to about 1 o'clock on my DSL 50 the sound lifts off, like a sudden oomph That's the sweet spot Any more and it compresses and I'm not a fan.  

So there is a point where the amp sounds superb for what I want from it, done