D Dorian over F13? EH?

matthewrlockyer

Hey everyone,

I have a musical conundrum that if someone could spread some light on would be great.

I am working on this great tune by The Marcus King Band called Rita is Gone, in particular the solo section which starts here: https://youtu.be/emQiYCr_XZI?t=4m47s

The chords seem to be Dm7 to F13 with a passing note of a Ab in between, when Marcus rips into the solo he seems to be using D Dorian, but I can't work out why this works. I am writing the Ab off as a passing note but in a D Dorian progression the III chord should be a Fmaj7 and the Eb in the F13 chord should be clashing with the home tone of D. What am i missing here?

stratman3142

I'm not sure if this is the bit you're referring to, but at 5:30 I don't hear an Eb in the chord.
Looking at the keyboard player's hands, I think he's playing something like E G B and D, while the bass player is hitting an F.

octatonic

Only had a quick listen- I don't hear that as F13.
Sounds like an Fmaj7 family chord- there seem to be a maj9 and maj13.

So with Dm7 to F maj7- you could think of it as a ii to IV chord progression in the key of C Major.
D Dorian would fit fine.

Even if it were an F 13 the only note to avoid out of D dorian would be the E and only over the F13 chord.
That shouldn't pose much of a problem.

Have a jam on Dm7 to Fmaj7 and Dm7 to F7, mixing between Fmaj7 and F7 on alternate passes, even playing Dmin7 F7, Fmaj7 on occasion.
Hear how the F7 tries to pull up to the Fmaj7.

OP- how familiar are you with the concept of secondary dominants?

viz

In terms of the soloing, the song is in d minor and he plays a raised 6th - ie d Dorian, as you pointed out. The solo starts at 5:28 and goes for 4 rounds, each of which lasts approx 20 seconds over 8 bars; ie the rounds start at 5:28, 5:48, 6:08 and 6:28 ish (though the last round's only 4 bars). 

In each round of 8 bars, he plays almost exclusively in d Dorian (apart from the odd passing note such as Ab, and with heavy emphasis on the 2nd degree (E) and the 5th degree (A)) - until the last bar of each of the rounds 1 and 2, ie for the turnaround at 5:45 and 6:05 approximately, when he throws in a C#. The C# gives it that unexpected jazzy colour, as it is in both the scales of d melodic minor, and a# melodic minor (ie A superlocrian), both of which are jazztastic. 

Although he uses this 'outside' note very sparingly it has an amazing impact on the taste of the groove. I think of this C# as being part of A superlocrian rather than d melodic minor, because in jazz it's very common to use superlocrian over the dominant, and even though his turnaround is not strictly speaking on the dominant chord, it's still a turnaround, so you can pick out any notes from a superlocrian and it will have the same effect, though the C# is particularly effective. But it's a moot point, you could just as easily say he's adding a major 7th, ie playing d melodic minor for an instant amongst the Dorian. Of course d melodic minor differs from d Dorian by only one note (C# instead of C) - the thing about A superlocrian is that it has a C as well as a C#, as per his playing. 

One incredibly easy way of achieving this effect is, you know when you're soloing in the blues box around fret 10 for d minor, and you're playing d Dorian - ie on the B string you're playing A B C on frets 10, 12 and 13 - classic Dorian material; well, when the turnaround happens and you need that C#, you simply slide up a semitone and play frets 11, 13 and 14, just for a sec, just before the beginning of bar 1 of the next round. Instant superlocrian. It's always astonishing to me that those special notes, the A#, B# and C# are so within easy reach of the blues box, just a fret away from the standard Dorian, and yet it might well be the very first time you've ever played them in a minor blues solo! It's like the guitar has a hidden section of notes you've never found before. At least that's what it was like for me the first time.

mellowsun

I think you are seeing an F13 shape from the video rather than using your ears - it does look like he is playing that shape but the b7 is not being played - maybe F6 ?

viz

mellowsun said:

I think you are seeing an F13 shape from the video rather than using your ears - it does look like he is playing that shape but the b7 is not being played - maybe F6 ?

Yes it's based on F Lydian, the relative of D Dorian. It doesn't have an Eb, it has F G A B C D E F, same as D Dorian. F6 and Fmaj7 both work. 

Dominic

good looking bunch of lads !

Veganic

Dominic said:

good looking bunch of lads !

This, to my shame, is the one that made me click the link.

All that time wasted trying to use my little finger!