N***** in a Woodpile.

Snap

57Deluxe said:

I can actually remember being taken to C&As in Kingston as a small child and my Mother buying me a pair of Nigger Brown trousers... they were actually labelled on the racks as such. Was then also an official BS colour as P(ost) O(ffice) Red is still today.

I was only talking about this sort of thing with a friend last week. Its really not that long since glaringly racist terminology was socially acceptable. Jim Davidson's Chalky White- well into the 1980s.

My grandma, who ironically was a non English speaking Irish immigrant in the 30s, would see Moira Stuart on the news and say " my, she's done well getting that job, being a darkie and that"

Didn't blink an eye at it, as in her experience (probably exacerbated by seeing her family persecuted as Irish catholics in Ireland) it was an actual statement of fact.

The N word is undoubtedly offensive though. Is "paki" as offensive? Cos that is used a lot, especially in my homeland of Blackburn. But then I grew up there, and we as white kids were always called honky, and my kids have had a bit of this from Somalian kids at school. It does work both ways,

Fretwired

Lewy said:

An elected MP addressing a meeting to discuss Brexit found herself unable to express her point of view without using the N-word. Suspension is the minimum acceptable response for that moment of professional and personal incompetence.

To what end? Are MPs expected to be perfect? Wouldn't an apology and the knowledge thatshe'd made herself look like a twat to millions of people suffice? Why wasn't Diane Abbott called out over her racist comments?

This is being blown out of all proportion.

57Deluxe

So if Paki is offensive when it is really just and abbreviation of Pakistani, shouldn't we equally now all rise up and socially outlaw the term BRITS??

And what do the Americans think about being called YANKS now too?

RocknRollDave

Fretwired said:

Lewy said:

An elected MP addressing a meeting to discuss Brexit found herself unable to express her point of view without using the N-word. Suspension is the minimum acceptable response for that moment of professional and personal incompetence.

To what end? Are MPs expected to be perfect? Wouldn't an apology and the knowledge thatshe'd made herself look like a twat to millions of people suffice? Why wasn't Diane Abbott called out over her racist comments?

This is being blown out of all proportion.

She was. Thing is, most of the comments in question were before the internet, or at least before the popularity of social media, so there wasn't the same level of backlash available

holnrew

capo4th said:

holnrew said:

I don't really find the word offensive

Mmmmm not really sure what to make of that statement maybe just wanting to incite more hatred. 

Not at all, I hear it all the time in the music I listen to, see it written now and again, doesn't bother me. Words only have power if you give it to them. I find it curious everybody's censoring it. We all know it's nigger.

prowla

Drew_TNBD said:

robgilmo said:

Drew_TNBD said:

robgilmo said:

Drew_TNBD said:

And so... we arrive at the point where Rob wanted to get to several pages ago. Go on mate... just say it.. you know you want to. Here... I'll help:

<puts on SJW retard hat>

You can't be racist towards white people

</takes off SJW retard hat>



There you go! Feel better?

Of course you can , I am White (does that surprise you?) and I have been subject to quite severe racism by other white people, and even when I got myself out of that situation that was happening daily I still get subject to it occasionally, racism isn't just about the colour of your skin.

I'm curious - what have you experienced?

Because I'm not English I've held more than one job where my colleagues thought it Ok to think that because I'm not English I was somehow going to be the focus of their ignorance,in one job it got to the point where I was being introduced to customers in a way that both racially embarrassed me and the customer, and this was my ex boss, in the workshop the ''banter'' would single me out because of my race and wouldn't stop, there was never any other ''banter'' than me being singled out. I've had it in most jobs I've worked in this country but since moving to Suffolk it seems to be the ''norm'' here, I grow tired of it very quickly and I did try and say look, this isn't cool but that made it worse.
I worked a job here where my boss ''thought'' my name was Patrick, he fucking knew what my name was but for some reason continued to call me ''Patrick'' , I clicked when I realised that I was being given the workload of the other two employees who got to go home early every other day and I had to work, with no breaks, no lunch, no rest breaks sometimes 12 hours a day, You might think it doesn't happen in this day and age, but I can assure you, it does.
So I have a very strong dislike to anyone who believes it Ok to exercise racial ignorance, which probably for me makes things worse as I may be a little more sensitive to it than most. My latest job, the lads started with the ''banter'' but I'm fucked if I'm going to let it get to the point where it makes me feel like I don't want to go into work so I pretty much nipped it in the bud there and then, it did take me to be very up front and forward, and it still crops up and I still have to get up front and forward so as not to allow it to progress, and to be perfectly fucking honest I shouldn't have to be put in that situation, but I am, and I'm dealing with it. But I have a very strong understanding that race shouldn't be something a person has to defend, ever, so maybe I'm over sensitive, but I don't think I am.

Okay, so you're Irish and you've taken a bunch of shit over the years from English fannyholes who want to pick on you because you're Irish....

... that's not racism bud. That's xenophobia, ignorance, shitty human behaviour, or at the very least crossed wires, miscommunication, misunderstanding, or people just not gelling very well.

Y'know what - I never twigged RG was Irish! Really! I read the post and thought "Oh, I wonder where he's from?". What a doilum!

holnrew

57Deluxe said:

So if Paki is offensive when it is really just and abbreviation of Pakistani, shouldn't we equally now all rise up and socially outlaw the term BRITS??

And what do the Americans think about being called YANKS now too?

I think those from the southern states do find yank offensive, because it's short for yankee.

prowla

Snap said:

57Deluxe said:

I can actually remember being taken to C&As in Kingston as a small child and my Mother buying me a pair of Nigger Brown trousers... they were actually labelled on the racks as such. Was then also an official BS colour as P(ost) O(ffice) Red is still today.

I was only talking about this sort of thing with a friend last week. Its really not that long since glaringly racist terminology was socially acceptable. Jim Davidson's Chalky White- well into the 1980s.

My grandma, who ironically was a non English speaking Irish immigrant in the 30s, would see Moira Stuart on the news and say " my, she's done well getting that job, being a darkie and that"

Didn't blink an eye at it, as in her experience (probably exacerbated by seeing her family persecuted as Irish catholics in Ireland) it was an actual statement of fact.

The N word is undoubtedly offensive though. Is "paki" as offensive? Cos that is used a lot, especially in my homeland of Blackburn. But then I grew up there, and we as white kids were always called honky, and my kids have had a bit of this from Somalian kids at school. It does work both ways,

True story: I went to my local shop up the road and commented to the chap behind the till that it was a bit "parky" out; he looked at me quite intently and said "What did you just say???" - I then had to explain that it was P-A-R-K-Y, a term meaning quite chilly; we then had a bit of a laugh about it...

Snap

@robgilmo

you aren't being over sensitive at all mate. There's a reason you don't hear many Engish Irishman Scotsman jokes anymore: cos they aren't funny, and are usually told by gits.

Possibly THE most offensive word I heard recently, used in a derogatory way without it being given second thought was a chap referring to black people as "coons". That is extremely offensive IMO. I genuinely was gobsmacked to hear that. A real "you fkin what mate?" moment.

Fretwired

RocknRollDave said:

Fretwired said:

Lewy said:

An elected MP addressing a meeting to discuss Brexit found herself unable to express her point of view without using the N-word. Suspension is the minimum acceptable response for that moment of professional and personal incompetence.

To what end? Are MPs expected to be perfect? Wouldn't an apology and the knowledge thatshe'd made herself look like a twat to millions of people suffice? Why wasn't Diane Abbott called out over her racist comments?

This is being blown out of all proportion.

She was. Thing is, most of the comments in question were before the internet, or at least before the popularity of social media, so there wasn't the same level of backlash available

Abbott wasn't really called out. Andrew Neil had a go .. she didn't apologise, nor was she suspended. I agree with you regarding social media. Mob rule is a dangerous way to make decisions ... rather than suspend her the party should have had her on a BBC news bulletin apologising ... all academic now. The Times comment section is full of racist Tory bigot-like comments.

Lewy

57Deluxe said:

So if Paki is offensive when it is really just and abbreviation of Pakistani, shouldn't we equally now all rise up and socially outlaw the term BRITS??

Come on, it's not "just an abbreviation" though is it. Do you actually think that uppermost in the mind of someone who uses that term is conversational brevity?

Fretwired

Snap said:

@robgilmo

you aren't being over sensitive at all mate. There's a reason you don't hear many Engish Irishman Scotsman jokes anymore: cos they aren't funny, and are usually told by gits.

Possibly THE most offensive word I heard recently, used in a derogatory way without it being given second thought was a chap referring to black people as "coons". That is extremely offensive IMO. I genuinely was gobsmacked to hear that. A real "you fkin what mate?" moment.

You won't be going to Cape Town's Coon Carnival in a hurry then .... :-)

Lewy

Fretwired said:

Lewy said:

An elected MP addressing a meeting to discuss Brexit found herself unable to express her point of view without using the N-word. Suspension is the minimum acceptable response for that moment of professional and personal incompetence.

To what end? Are MPs expected to be perfect? Wouldn't an apology and the knowledge thatshe'd made herself look like a twat to millions of people suffice? Why wasn't Diane Abbott called out over her racist comments?

This is being blown out of all proportion.

I don't think MPs should be expected to be perfect, but they should be expected not to bring the office, and their party, into disrepute. And they should be expected to set an example. You say looking like a twat in front of millions of people should be punishment enough. If the number of onlookers has any bearing on things, as you imply it does, then you also have to consider the impact that millions of people seeing a politician say the N-word without serious consequence would have on those millions of people. That's seems to be a bigger thing to me.

Whether the press coverage is blowing it out of proportion or not is a different matter, the punishment by her party is proportionate.

Fretwired

The phrase has been 'officially' changed to Tory in a woodpile ..... :-)

Dominic

I live in a predominantly Cypriot part of North London.......Greek and Turkish and also a lot of Kurdish .....I am one quarter English so don't take offence but they regard the English with some derision . Anything lazy, small-minded or unrelaxed and uptight and particularly families that are not very tight and unmarried mothers is joked about as typical " Ingles ".
 The various East Europeans have exactly the same attitude regarding the laziness of the English.
I lived in Hong Kong/china where any european is a Gwei lo - a derogatory term
 BUT -there is no ill- will or evil sub-text in any of these cases .Is it racism ? I really wouldn't profess to know.
 The point is that humans are tribal  animals despite all the multi-cultural guff - I think it is inevitable that amongst communities there will be differentiation ,nick -names or impolite reference. Even micro-communities are the same ie Clan v Clan in 18th century Scotland .Sometimes it is blindly ludicrous; Example ;
 Warren Mitchell ,the actor told a story of his days in Rep when walking home from a theatre in Belfast in the 1960s late at night and was accosted by a gang with the question " Catholic or Protestant". He played his joker by saying he was Jewish(which he was ) only to be asked " So Are you a Catholic Jew or a Protestant Jew ? " !
 There is a difference between impolite or insensitive reference and nasty spiteful bigotry that wishes harm or misfortune upon those who are different from themselves.
One is bad mannered ignorance the other is vicious Racism.

Lewy

Fretwired said:

The phrase has been 'officially' changed to Tory in a woodpile ..... :-)

...presumably there because their sedan chair crashed....

proggy

I used to work with a Greek Cypriot (born here in London) who had nothing but contempt for the English. Every time there was something in the paper regarding someone from an ethnic background getting into trouble by breaking the law, maybe an Asian drug dealer or an Eastern European rapist, his answer would always be, "They're just becoming like the English."

He was the biggest arsehole I've ever met in my life.

octatonic

proggy said:

I used to work with a Greek Cypriot (born here in London) who had nothing but contempt for the English. Every time there was something in the paper regarding someone from an ethnic background getting into trouble by breaking the law, maybe an Asian drug dealer or an Eastern European rapist, his answer would always be, "They're just becoming like the English."

He was the biggest arsehole I've ever met in my life.

Well you did nick their marbles.

proggy

octatonic said:

proggy said:

I used to work with a Greek Cypriot (born here in London) who had nothing but contempt for the English. Every time there was something in the paper regarding someone from an ethnic background getting into trouble by breaking the law, maybe an Asian drug dealer or an Eastern European rapist, his answer would always be, "They're just becoming like the English."

He was the biggest arsehole I've ever met in my life.

Well you did nick their marbles.

Ok, I'll give you that.

robgilmo

Drew_TNBD said:

robgilmo said:

Drew_TNBD said:

robgilmo said:

Drew_TNBD said:

And so... we arrive at the point where Rob wanted to get to several pages ago. Go on mate... just say it.. you know you want to. Here... I'll help:

<puts on SJW retard hat>

You can't be racist towards white people

</takes off SJW retard hat>



There you go! Feel better?

Of course you can , I am White (does that surprise you?) and I have been subject to quite severe racism by other white people, and even when I got myself out of that situation that was happening daily I still get subject to it occasionally, racism isn't just about the colour of your skin.

I'm curious - what have you experienced?

Because I'm not English I've held more than one job where my colleagues thought it Ok to think that because I'm not English I was somehow going to be the focus of their ignorance,in one job it got to the point where I was being introduced to customers in a way that both racially embarrassed me and the customer, and this was my ex boss, in the workshop the ''banter'' would single me out because of my race and wouldn't stop, there was never any other ''banter'' than me being singled out. I've had it in most jobs I've worked in this country but since moving to Suffolk it seems to be the ''norm'' here, I grow tired of it very quickly and I did try and say look, this isn't cool but that made it worse.
I worked a job here where my boss ''thought'' my name was Patrick, he fucking knew what my name was but for some reason continued to call me ''Patrick'' , I clicked when I realised that I was being given the workload of the other two employees who got to go home early every other day and I had to work, with no breaks, no lunch, no rest breaks sometimes 12 hours a day, You might think it doesn't happen in this day and age, but I can assure you, it does.
So I have a very strong dislike to anyone who believes it Ok to exercise racial ignorance, which probably for me makes things worse as I may be a little more sensitive to it than most. My latest job, the lads started with the ''banter'' but I'm fucked if I'm going to let it get to the point where it makes me feel like I don't want to go into work so I pretty much nipped it in the bud there and then, it did take me to be very up front and forward, and it still crops up and I still have to get up front and forward so as not to allow it to progress, and to be perfectly fucking honest I shouldn't have to be put in that situation, but I am, and I'm dealing with it. But I have a very strong understanding that race shouldn't be something a person has to defend, ever, so maybe I'm over sensitive, but I don't think I am.

Okay, so you're Irish and you've taken a bunch of shit over the years from English fannyholes who want to pick on you because you're Irish....

... that's not racism bud. That's xenophobia, ignorance, shitty human behaviour, or at the very least crossed wires, miscommunication, misunderstanding, or people just not gelling very well.

WTF seriousley?