Acid attacks in London

Drew_TNBD

Emp_Fab said:

Just to play a bit of devil's advocaat, say these people had been targeting only Asian men who had themselves disfigured women by acid attacks.  To give them a 'taste of their own medicine' so to speak.  Would anyone here feel less angry about it?

What's the point in asking that sort of question?

Fretwired

The latest attack was about robbery, not revenge. Still very rare when compared to gun and knife crime in London. One was man stabbed to death and shot last night and many more wounded. Typical Friday in London.

Figures showed a 42 per cent rise in the number of overall offences of gun crime and an increase of 24 per cent rise in the number of knife crime offences, with 12,074 offences last year, compared to 9,742 in 2015/16.

More worryingly, there was also a rise in the number of guns being fired on London’s streets, up from 239 cases in 2015/16 to 306 cases in the last financial year.

There was also a 20 per cent increase in the rate of knife attacks involving injuries to victims, up from 3,663 to 4,415 in 2016/17.

Emp_Fab

Drew_TNBD said:

Emp_Fab said:

Just to play a bit of devil's advocaat, say these people had been targeting only Asian men who had themselves disfigured women by acid attacks.  To give them a 'taste of their own medicine' so to speak.  Would anyone here feel less angry about it?

What's the point in asking that sort of question?

What's the point in asking that sort of question?

I think it's fairly obvious why I'm asking that sort of question.

Drew_TNBD

Emp_Fab said:

Drew_TNBD said:

Emp_Fab said:

Just to play a bit of devil's advocaat, say these people had been targeting only Asian men who had themselves disfigured women by acid attacks.  To give them a 'taste of their own medicine' so to speak.  Would anyone here feel less angry about it?

What's the point in asking that sort of question?

What's the point in asking that sort of question?

I think it's fairly obvious why I'm asking that sort of question.

It's not obvious. Just say what you mean.

Emp_Fab

OK.  I'm curious about the possible double standards of people who, on one hand, express revulsion at the acts committed by these criminals in London yet on another day might support an "eye for an eye" form of punishment for people who disfigure women (almost exclusively) in this manner.

professorben

Emp_Fab said:

OK.  I'm curious about the possible double standards of people who, on one hand, express revulsion at the acts committed by these criminals in London yet on another day might support an "eye for an eye" form of punishment for people who disfigure women (almost exclusively) in this manner.

No you are looking to pour petrol on the fire and cause yet another thread where you can walk away wringing your hands crying "why does everyone hate me?"

The answer is of course no, none has either the right to dispense or deserve to receive vigilante 'justice' we have professionals for that.

otherwise cases such as Bijan Abrahimi will become more common.

mellowsun

Another acid attack last night, this time in Dagenham

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/london-acid-attacks-suspects-arrests-latest-moped-robbery-dagenham-victim-police-investigation-a7842501.html

robgilmo

Sweet mother of god, the fuck is wrong with people?

ToneControl

octatonic said:

bodhi said:

Placidcasual79 said:

A more effective solution is to endeavour to ensure young people feel included and valued and able to achieve 

I agree.  But if you throw acid in someone's face, then sorry - you have no place in civilized society no matter what your excuse is.

Agree.
This isn't dealing drugs to people that want them, or nicking something in order to sell it to get some money.
I can kinda see the reasoning behind doing that- even if I don't agree with it.
Throwing acid in people's faces is premeditated by definition and it is just beyond the pale- the consequences for victims is lifelong and IMHO the punishment should be a life sentence.

it is, as far as I know:
GBH with intent can be given a "life" sentence 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grievous_bodily_harm#Section_18_2

I'd assume a severe sentence will be given for these attacks

Jez6345789

It amazes me that so many substances are controlled in the UK in comparison to some other countries but you can buy high molar strength acid on Ebay and other sites. You have to question what is really the personal need for these chemicals there are few situations I can think of.

Grunfeld

mellowsun said:

Another acid attack last night, this time in Dagenham

Sod that -- just 5 minutes away. 

Blaendulais

Emp_Fab said:

Perhaps everyone should carry some bicarb on them, in case.  It would help to increase the pH of the acid.  Certainly better than the detergents suggested earlier.

Water better Emp.  Same goes for acid in eyes.  Adding alkaline generates heat from the reaction.  

Blaendulais

bodhi said:

Placidcasual79 said:

My point was that I don't think sentences of that nature act as a deterrent.   

Well, whatever the penalty currently is, it sure as hell didn't deter these two little bastards.

But I do imagine that the thought of being arrested, hauled into court, and ending up in prison might actually help to keep most people in line if/when their thoughts turn to committing a spot of crime.  It works on me, in any case.

But you are normal !!!

bodhi

Blaendulais said:

bodhi said:

Placidcasual79 said:

My point was that I don't think sentences of that nature act as a deterrent.   

Well, whatever the penalty currently is, it sure as hell didn't deter these two little bastards.

But I do imagine that the thought of being arrested, hauled into court, and ending up in prison might actually help to keep most people in line if/when their thoughts turn to committing a spot of crime.  It works on me, in any case.

But you are normal !!!

I must admit that my thoughts turned to crime on two occassions:  Once when I considered punching my sister-in-law in the head, but then changed my mind and considered punching her in the head twice instead.

Funkfingers

Blaendulais said:

Emp_Fab said:

Perhaps everyone should carry some bicarb on them, in case.  It would help to increase the pH of the acid.  Certainly better than the detergents suggested earlier.

Water better, Emp.  Same goes for acid in eyes.  Adding alkaline generates heat from the reaction.  

Flushing with water is the first course of action.

Industrial sites where substances hazardous to health are routinely used will have safety showers, eye baths and, sometimes, full immersion baths.

Calcium Bicarbonate might be applicable for neutralising Hydro-fluoric acid burns. It is a bit of a sledgehammer to crack a nut but, then, HF acid is seriously scary. Any source of calcium that combines with the HF acid instead of your bones is good. 

mellowsun

London acid attacks in East London continue:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jul/25/two-hospitalised-in-east-end-acid-attack

chillidoggy

Emp_Fab said:

Perhaps everyone should carry some bicarb on them, in case.  It would help to increase the pH of the acid.  Certainly better than the detergents suggested earlier.

What happens if you get hit with a strong alkali, though? Do you need to carry a strong acid too?

crunchman

There are a lot of calls for controls, but surely they could just go nick a car battery and drain the acid.

Rather than put massive controls in place and introducing more bureacracy and costs for legitimate users, they might better putting big penalties on people who carry it the same as they do with knives.  If I'm a butcher and have a knife, or if I have a knife in my kitchen at home then it's not a problem.  If I carry it on the street there are massive penalties these days.

57Deluxe

they should all be deported to the colonies....

capo4th

57Deluxe said:

they should all be deported to the colonies....

On a large boat perhaps ?