JCM2000 DSL50 - thinking of buying one. Any advice?

MatthewShreddery

I've been interested in buying one of these for a while and a good deal (I think) has come up for the head + 2x12 Marshall 1936 cab (V30's). 

Ive heard they're a bit unreliable so what should I look out for if I go to view the amp?

the reverb is not working either - why might that be?

I've put together a rock covers band and although I love my Roland Cube, I think the DSL will have the sound I need and the power too. 

Thanks all. 

ICBM

Don't.

MatthewShreddery

Haha! Fair enough. 

timmysoft

I toured them for years with no issues, most of the bands I tech'ed for too had them and they were a good workhorse. 

Lestratcaster

I owned one about 4 years ago. I never had a problem with it and it got those rock tones everyone loves, and it helped I played a Gibson lol. The crunch channel surprised me in a pleasant way, I almost always used the clean and dirty channels without the button pushed in but when I did use it I really liked it when playing AC/DC type chords!

I do regret selling it for a 6505+ not cos I don't like the Peavey but the fact I am looking to get into cover band stuff and the Marshall would be better suited for more vintage type tones.

MatthewShreddery

This is the thing. I really like the sound of them, but don't want to buy a lemon. My cube never lets me down and has all the sounds I need. GAS needs to go away. 

ICBM

I've think I've seen more dead DSL50s than any other Marshall model I can think of. (And more than many other entire product ranges, both from Marshall and other companies.) What's worse is the type of failures - not usually trivial or valve-related, it's normally something serious and expensive caused by one of the numerous design faults.

That said, a dead reverb is probably just the tank.

I don't doubt that a good proportion of them don't break down, but if you're worried about potentially buying a lemon then I would strongly advise you to steer clear since there's a higher risk than with most other amps. If you do want a DSL, the new Vietnamese-made ones actually seem better-made.

For what it's worth I currently own a TSL100 combo - which is essentially the same amp, it uses the same main PCB with two more power valves and a different control board. If any of you optimists wants it, it comes with a 30-minute guarantee...

siraxeman

Mine has served me well for the last 6yrs of gigging...with only 1 minor fault needing a repair in all that time. They sound great and were for years Marshalls most popular valve head and were used by Gary Moore, Jeff Beck and Richie Sambora to name just a few 'name' players using them. Reliability wise ICBM may know his onions, but that aside I guess that 'high' fail rate is still a -10% of the DSLs out there serving their owners trouble free for many years.........

if you have one already then just enjoy it!! When you get them at gig volumes they come into their own. The green channel with an OD in front is really great. Many folks think better than the the red channel however you run it.

kennedydream1980

The newer DSL100H is made in Vietnam and seems to be much more reliable. They are 100watts but they have a half power switch on the back to knock it down to 50watts. They seem to pop up on the various buy and sell Facebook groups regularly for around £300-£350. I loved the sound of the clean and crunch modes on the one I briefly owned, but I think Marshall missed a trick not designing the amp so you could footswitch between these 2 modes (Although there is an aftermarket mod that can be done to achieve this).

The lead channels seemed very thin compared, probably down to the shared eq.

Alot of people who own DSL's treat them as single channel amps in use rather than multi channel and I would have to say I can see why.

clarkefan

Agree with thinking of them as single channel amps rather than switching.  I typically stay on the red Lead 1 channel but the green Crunch is great as well for earlier Marshall sounds.

I really like mine.  I installed the replacement main PCB Marshall sell which sorts some issues.  Stick a volume control in the loop and crank it, sounds great.  

Oh yeah, snip the bright cap on the red channel gain knob, makes the amp more ballsy (the C12 mod talked about on the net).  I auditioned various other values in that position but decided no cap at all sounds best there.

The green clean channel is very clean, very useful.

jpfamps

My grandad smoked 40 Woodbines a day and lived until he was 97.

Thus cigarettes are not bad for you.

Modulus_Amps

I have one that I am probably going to be selling soon, I think its a 2004 model that has run faultlessly since I have had it, bar valve changes. I used to gig with it every week so it has been well used. They really are single channel amps and they cover a decent amount of ground tonally, but if I was gigging with it again I would be opening it up to change a few things, but then I would probably do that with every production amp out there now.....

Don't buy an amp where something doesn't work on it, all that shows is it has not been looked after properly and the owner can't be bothered to pay to get it sorted..... or buy it at a really low ball price and don't be upset if it does not last ICBM's 30min warranty

MatthewShreddery

Ok, so a good deal has come up on a DSL100 with 4x12 cab. It was made in 2002 so it's  from the 'problem era'. However, I've heard that the older ones sound best. 

When i I go to inspect it, is there anything I can easily check to establish if it's going to be a complete dud or not?

The price I'm paying seems like a good deal and would leave cash from my budget to get it looked at by a tech. What would cost to have someone modify the amp to safeguard against future problems?

MatthewShreddery

Gonna go look at it in a few hours.

ICBM

MatthewShreddery said:

When i I go to inspect it, is there anything I can easily check to establish if it's going to be a complete dud or not?

No, not unless you know whether it's had a new main PCB fitted. You can't tell this by looking from the outside or testing it, the owner would have to know.

MatthewShreddery said:

The price I'm paying seems like a good deal and would leave cash from my budget to get it looked at by a tech. What would cost to have someone modify the amp to safeguard against future problems?

You can't. Replacing the PCB is a must if it hasn't been done already - but even that won't guarantee it since there are other failures. To go through the whole thing and upgrade everything I can think of which I've ever seen cause trouble could be at least £100 or so on top of the PCB - which is about £100 itself - and *still* won't guarantee it won't fail, it's just an inherently flawed design.

On top of that you should have the cabinet rewired to remove the switching PCB and hardwire it for 16 ohms - faults in the switching are a known cause of arcing and blown transformers in the amps.

So does whatever price it is, plus about £250, for an amp you still can't be sure won't die, sound like a good deal?

To be honest I probably wouldn't bother - it's just throwing good money after bad. If it hasn't already blown up it's probably in the percentage of less prone ones. Get the cabinet switching checked or preferably removed, only use the amp at 16 ohms, and you've eliminated the biggest hazard other than the PCB. If the PCB fails, replace it when you have to cross that bridge...

MatthewShreddery

Damn, thanks @ICBM. I think I'm going to give the amp a miss. I always trust your opinion on these things. Can't be assed with another expensive lemon. 

clarkefan

In case you change your mind the pcb you'd need is issue 20, it's printed on it. Yeah 100 from Marshall but a relatively easy fit if you know how to be safe inside an amp.

@ICBM , what would you set the amp's output impedance to if your cab is 8 ohms (two 16s in parallel)? Still better to have it set to 16 ohms?

ICBM

clarkefan said:

@ICBM , what would you set the amp's output impedance to if your cab is 8 ohms (two 16s in parallel)? Still better to have it set to 16 ohms?

No, you need it set to 8 ohms - but in that case you need two mods done to the rear PCB, for safety - the switch in the ground path of the 16-ohm jack needs to be bypassed, and the switch poles of the 4/8-ohm selector paralleled. What's so ridiculous about both these faults is that they were intentionally designed into the PCB. Even worse, although paralleling the switch poles could possibly be forgiven as an oversight (and is the less likely to cause trouble), using the switch in the 16-ohm jack to break the signal path must have been a deliberate choice… one which can blow the output transformer if the contact goes bad while the amp is running at 4 or 8 ohms. Stupid, and as far as I know they never corrected it.

clarkefan

Thank you.  I'm familiar with the ground path issue but I don't know what paralleling the 4/8 ohm switch means.

ICBM

clarkefan said:

I'm familiar with the ground path issue but I don't know what paralleling the 4/8 ohm switch means.

Connecting both sides of the switch in parallel, using three short wires - this stops a bad contact in the switch interrupting the signal path. Given that both sides of the switch are already soldered to the PCB, it's daft to deliberately only use one half of it.

Both these design faults are the work of someone who doesn't have much experience with things that can go wrong with valve amps...

clarkefan

Thanks @ICBM I'll get on that, appreciate it.