Band members playing the wrong chords..

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  • hotpickupshotpickups Frets: 665
    viz said:
    ICBM said:
    I've always thought it was in G major.

    Ed King says it is too :).
    Phew, I was starting to think that it was just me that thought that.
    Eh I thought you were a D-er, no?
    I think of Sweet Home Alabama as based around a key centre of G major (Ionian) but it could equally be viewed as  D Mixolydian. Same difference because they both provide the same palette of notes.

    The first solo seems more D centric to me, whereas the second solo seems more G centric.

    I'm sure the 2nd solo when I played it many years ago was E pentatonic but that could be E major pentatonic which would make sense if it was in G I guess. If you know what I mean?
    Link to my trading feedback:  http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/59452/
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  • stratman3142stratman3142 Frets: 568
    edited October 2
    viz said:
    ICBM said:
    I've always thought it was in G major.

    Ed King says it is too .
    Phew, I was starting to think that it was just me that thought that.
    Eh I thought you were a D-er, no?
    I think of Sweet Home Alabama as based around a key centre of G major (Ionian) but it could equally be viewed as  D Mixolydian. Same difference because they both provide the same palette of notes.

    The first solo seems more D centric to me, whereas the second solo seems more G centric.

    I'm sure the 2nd solo when I played it many years ago was E pentatonic but that could be E major pentatonic which would make sense if it was in G I guess. If you know what I mean?
    Did you mean to say E minor pentatonic, which happens to have the same notes as G major pentatonic? Although the notes would work, I wouldn't view it as E minor pentatonic. But if it works for you.
    It's not a competition
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  • hotpickupshotpickups Frets: 665
    viz said:
    ICBM said:
    I've always thought it was in G major.

    Ed King says it is too :).
    Phew, I was starting to think that it was just me that thought that.
    Eh I thought you were a D-er, no?
    I think of Sweet Home Alabama as based around a key centre of G major (Ionian) but it could equally be viewed as  D Mixolydian. Same difference because they both provide the same palette of notes.

    The first solo seems more D centric to me, whereas the second solo seems more G centric.

    I'm sure the 2nd solo when I played it many years ago was E pentatonic but that could be E major pentatonic which would make sense if it was in G I guess. If you know what I mean?
    Did you mean to say E minor pentatonic, which happens to have the same notes as G major pentatonic? Although the notes would work, I wouldn't view it in that way. But if it works for you.
    Yeah. I guess I do mean that. Theory isn't my strong point but I do have an exceptionally good ear and it's seemed to have got me by ;)
    Link to my trading feedback:  http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/59452/
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  • CirrusCirrus Frets: 3275
    Danny1969 said:
    Danny1969 said:
    It's amazing how many people don't know what key they are playing in ..... a lot of people i've played with other the years assumed it was the first chord of the song
     


    But what key is "Sweet Home Alabama” in? 
    Ah, I have a concept I call the Home key and the home key of that song is G to me. However I do tend to widdle away in D pent the first 2 bars before switching to G maj when I solo.

    I could be wrong though, that song does tend to polarise people 
    Sorry, a bit late to the party. It's in G. Imagine you're playing it live, you get to the end and do a cadence that goes D.... C.... G...... Where does it want to go from there? Nowhere. If it was in D, the cadence wouldn't sound complete (or 'perfect') unless you went back to finish on D. But if you try that, you feel like you're leaving home ground (G) and going back to the 5th, leaving it unresolved. Try it. Plus, humming it in my mind, the vocal melody keeps resolving to B which would be maj3rd in G, and relatively stable. If it was in D, that'd be a much less satisfying thing.
    Captain Horizon (my band);
    Very (!) Occasional Blog
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  • vizviz Frets: 4269
    edited October 29
    Cirrus said:
    Danny1969 said:
    Danny1969 said:
    It's amazing how many people don't know what key they are playing in ..... a lot of people i've played with other the years assumed it was the first chord of the song
     


    But what key is "Sweet Home Alabama” in? 
    Ah, I have a concept I call the Home key and the home key of that song is G to me. However I do tend to widdle away in D pent the first 2 bars before switching to G maj when I solo.

    I could be wrong though, that song does tend to polarise people 
    Sorry, a bit late to the party. It's in G. Imagine you're playing it live, you get to the end and do a cadence that goes D.... C.... G...... Where does it want to go from there? Nowhere. If it was in D, the cadence wouldn't sound complete (or 'perfect') unless you went back to finish on D. But if you try that, you feel like you're leaving home ground (G) and going back to the 5th, leaving it unresolved. Try it. Plus, humming it in my mind, the vocal melody keeps resolving to B which would be maj3rd in G, and relatively stable. If it was in D, that'd be a much less satisfying thing.
    The thing is, a lot of people find the home is D. Like in Back in Black they find a home in E. In SHA it's all to do with whether you can hear a turnaround in the twiddle on the G chord (like in Back in Black), or can't (like in Maggie May). The reasons SHA is more ambiguous are many but include the slight shift in emphasis as the song progresses, certain rythmic cues deployed inconsistently, the fact that the D chord is mixolydian, the fact that live performances have a different emphasis from the studio version, etc.
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 2951

    I think in some cases the key gives us an idea about what chords and scales are gonna be used in the song but it's not an absolute rule. 
    With SHA it always rest on the G for 2 bars, every other chord including the D is used for one bar only, a passing tone if you will ..... that's how I hear it and if you counted out the bars on the G major they would outnumber the D by some margin 

    There is something odd with it though because you can't just solo using Gmaj over it, I have to try and bend to the chords when I solo over it
    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • vizviz Frets: 4269
    edited October 29
    Danny1969 said:

    I think in some cases the key gives us an idea about what chords and scales are gonna be used in the song but it's not an absolute rule. 
    With SHA it always rest on the G for 2 bars, every other chord including the D is used for one bar only, a passing tone if you will ..... that's how I hear it and if you counted out the bars on the G major they would outnumber the D by some margin 

    There is something odd with it though because you can't just solo using Gmaj over it, I have to try and bend to the chords when I solo over it
    Lol yep it's fun. I have studied this in immense detail, from many perspectives -  structural, rhythmical, phrasal (is that a word?), melodic, you name it. There are just sooo many aspects that you can draw on to decipher the key, and as can be shown from contrasting Back in Black with Maggie May, you can't tell just from the chords - I bVII IV vs. V IV I. 

    The starting chord doesn't help. The duration on each chord doesn't help. What helps is HOW you interpret it, even how you WISH to interpret it. It's quite possible to play it in either key, by using any number of rhythmic and melodic devices. 

    I could devote a whole thread to it. Oh I have.

    But here's one interesting thing that you may not have thought of. Check out what little melody you mind's ear plays along to the chords, and I'll guarantee you'll fall into one of three camps:

    Either at some point you'll find your mind has put in a little semitone-descending duplet of C---B--- over that D-C-G---, in which case you'll be landing on G as your tonic. Because you're resolving from the unstable 7th of the D to the stable major 3rd of the G. You can almost HEAR backing vocalists singing those notes, toggling back and forth between the V and the I -"oooooooh-yeahhhh", and again "oooooh-yeahhh". You'll be a staunch G-er and won't understand how others can possibly want to go back to what you think of as the V and stop there on the ooooooh!

    OR your mind will be inserting the same little descending duplet, except it'll be an augmented 4th higher - ie F#---F---, in which case you'll be wanting to resolve to the D, because the F# is the stable major 3rd of the D and the F is the unstable 7th of the G. You'll also be imagining backing singers going oooh-yeah, but for you the yeah is a turnaround ready for the final oooooh on D. You'll be a firm D-er who can't bear to leave it unresolved, hanging, on that G, it NEEDS to return home to the D!

    OR like me you'll have both pairs simultaneously, like playing xxxx78 followed by xxxx67, repeating endlessly over the 2 bars, ie playing the 3rd and 7th over D (and C), followed by the 3rd and 7th over G, and you'll be able to flip from V IV I to I bVII IV, and have to look for other cues to determine the key. Like downbeats vs upbeats, turnarounds vs settled notes, etc. 

    THIS is why nobody can agree. In both cases the resolution is strengthened by a 7th to a 3rd, but which is the right one? Muahaha. 
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  • hotpickupshotpickups Frets: 665
    viz said:
    Danny1969 said:

    I think in some cases the key gives us an idea about what chords and scales are gonna be used in the song but it's not an absolute rule. 
    With SHA it always rest on the G for 2 bars, every other chord including the D is used for one bar only, a passing tone if you will ..... that's how I hear it and if you counted out the bars on the G major they would outnumber the D by some margin 

    There is something odd with it though because you can't just solo using Gmaj over it, I have to try and bend to the chords when I solo over it
    Lol yep it's fun. I have studied this in immense detail, from many perspectives -  structural, rhythmical, phrasal (is that a word?), melodic, you name it. There are just sooo many aspects that you can draw on to decipher the key, and as can be shown from contrasting Back in Black with Maggie May, you can't tell just from the chords - I bVII IV vs. V IV I. 

    The starting chord doesn't help. The duration on each chord doesn't help. What helps is HOW you interpret it, even how you WISH to interpret it. It's quite possible to play it in either key, by using any number of rhythmic and melodic devices. 

    I could devote a whole thread to it. Oh I have.

    But here's one interesting thing that you may not have thought of. Check out what little melody you mind's ear plays along to the chords, and I'll guarantee you'll fall into one of three camps:

    Either at some point you'll find your mind has put in a little semitone-descending duplet of C---B--- over that D-C-G---, in which case you'll be landing on G as your tonic. Because you're resolving from the unstable 7th of the D to the stable major 3rd of the G. You can almost HEAR backing vocalists singing those notes, toggling back and forth between the V and the I -"oooooooh-yeahhhh", and again "oooooh-yeahhh". You'll be a staunch G-er and won't understand how others can possibly want to go back to what you think of as the V and stop there on the ooooooh!

    OR your mind will be inserting the same little descending duplet, except it'll be an augmented 4th higher - ie F#---F---, in which case you'll be wanting to resolve to the D, because the F# is the stable major 3rd of the D and the F is the unstable 7th of the G. You'll also be imagining backing singers going oooh-yeah, but for you the yeah is a turnaround ready for the final oooooh on D. You'll be a firm D-er who can't bear to leave it unresolved, hanging, on that G, it NEEDS to return home to the D!

    OR like me you'll have both pairs simultaneously, like playing xxxx78 followed by xxxx67, repeating endlessly over the 2 bars, ie playing the 3rd and 7th over D (and C), followed by the 3rd and 7th over G, and you'll be able to flip from V IV I to I bVII IV, and have to look for other cues to determine the key. Like downbeats vs upbeats, turnarounds vs settled notes, etc. 

    THIS is why nobody can agree. In both cases the resolution is strengthened by a 7th to a 3rd, but which is the right one? Muahaha. 
    So..... what key is it actually in LOL

    Link to my trading feedback:  http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/59452/
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  • vizviz Frets: 4269
    edited October 29
    hotpickups said:
    viz said:
    Danny1969 said:

    I think in some cases the key gives us an idea about what chords and scales are gonna be used in the song but it's not an absolute rule. 
    With SHA it always rest on the G for 2 bars, every other chord including the D is used for one bar only, a passing tone if you will ..... that's how I hear it and if you counted out the bars on the G major they would outnumber the D by some margin 

    There is something odd with it though because you can't just solo using Gmaj over it, I have to try and bend to the chords when I solo over it
    Lol yep it's fun. I have studied this in immense detail, from many perspectives -  structural, rhythmical, phrasal (is that a word?), melodic, you name it. There are just sooo many aspects that you can draw on to decipher the key, and as can be shown from contrasting Back in Black with Maggie May, you can't tell just from the chords - I bVII IV vs. V IV I. 

    The starting chord doesn't help. The duration on each chord doesn't help. What helps is HOW you interpret it, even how you WISH to interpret it. It's quite possible to play it in either key, by using any number of rhythmic and melodic devices. 

    I could devote a whole thread to it. Oh I have.

    But here's one interesting thing that you may not have thought of. Check out what little melody you mind's ear plays along to the chords, and I'll guarantee you'll fall into one of three camps:

    Either at some point you'll find your mind has put in a little semitone-descending duplet of C---B--- over that D-C-G---, in which case you'll be landing on G as your tonic. Because you're resolving from the unstable 7th of the D to the stable major 3rd of the G. You can almost HEAR backing vocalists singing those notes, toggling back and forth between the V and the I -"oooooooh-yeahhhh", and again "oooooh-yeahhh". You'll be a staunch G-er and won't understand how others can possibly want to go back to what you think of as the V and stop there on the ooooooh!

    OR your mind will be inserting the same little descending duplet, except it'll be an augmented 4th higher - ie F#---F---, in which case you'll be wanting to resolve to the D, because the F# is the stable major 3rd of the D and the F is the unstable 7th of the G. You'll also be imagining backing singers going oooh-yeah, but for you the yeah is a turnaround ready for the final oooooh on D. You'll be a firm D-er who can't bear to leave it unresolved, hanging, on that G, it NEEDS to return home to the D!

    OR like me you'll have both pairs simultaneously, like playing xxxx78 followed by xxxx67, repeating endlessly over the 2 bars, ie playing the 3rd and 7th over D (and C), followed by the 3rd and 7th over G, and you'll be able to flip from V IV I to I bVII IV, and have to look for other cues to determine the key. Like downbeats vs upbeats, turnarounds vs settled notes, etc. 

    THIS is why nobody can agree. In both cases the resolution is strengthened by a 7th to a 3rd, but which is the right one? Muahaha. 
    So..... what key is it actually in LOL


    Well H is "home".  
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  • VeganicVeganic Frets: 245


    So..... what key is it actually in LOL



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