Yet more new PRS for 2018.

SimpleSimon

Strat54 said:

Whitecat said:

Other than that 24-08 no new Core models or major revisions... just a few new colours. Lean times at PRS towers?

Its been that way for a long time. They had to lay off staff and expand the SE range which had basically saved the company from folding. They simply would not have survived if they had just stayed with the core USA range. 

Is that right? Following the goings on via the PRS official forum they always seem to be on recruitment drives for staff rather than laying folk off. I always suspected the moves in the SE range are more likely to do with CITES, using maple boards to avoid rosewood issues and spalted tops using (relatively considered) gash woods previously overlooked in traditional guitar construction.

Strat54

Yep they laid a lot of staff off a few years back. Paul himself said he was sad to see good friends go in an interview a while back. 

rico

Nope, still do not want a PRS

Whitecat

Strat54 said:

Yep they laid a lot of staff off a few years back. Paul himself said he was sad to see good friends go in an interview a while back. 

That was like 2008 though - all around the time of the credit crunch. Am wondering how things are now - could still be “not great” but there’s little insider word...

edit: 2009, sorry - http://www.stardem.com/news/article_90b19ef0-bb9b-59a9-9a13-d132fe332897.html

they also got an expansion grant a couple years ago, partly to take on more people - https://open.maryland.gov/2015/04/marylands-prs-guitars-plans-expansion-new-hires/

Strat54

Don't think any guitar company is doing great now. Surviving..yes.

jeztone2

Whitecat said:

Other than that 24-08 no new Core models or major revisions... just a few new colours. Lean times at PRS towers?

Well I think it’s lean times everywhere. Let’s be honest have people’s disposable incomes really recovered post 2008? Given the massive increases in living costs?

Personally if I ran PRS. I’d investigate the thinner type top they did on the new CE. I’d put together a US build S2 singlecut with that type of top. Less fancy wood. More solid colours. Jumbo fret it & get it out there for £1500. The new range doesn’t have anything in it I’d want. So it’s cheaper to buy used & mod it. 

Im a bit curious as to who guitarmakers think we are. I’m 48. I grew up on Kramer, Ibanez etc. I like guitars with jumbo fretwire. Yet no one seems to offer it as stock? I see gear rundowns on the internet. There’s very often references to a tech putting bigger frets in at a players request. 

So so why don’t the guitar makers do it in the first place?

mynamesnotbob

jeztone2 said:

Let’s be honest have people’s disposable incomes really recovered post 2008? Given the massive increases in living costs?

No, but credit is far easier to get and the fear has gone away - it seems that so many higher end guitars are offered first with finance, it seems the first question when negotiating price. In 2008 credit dried up, or people became more cautious - thats diminished somewhat, meaning new prices creep up (it's only a few quid a month extra type discussion).

Jonathanthomas83

Was looking at the core range, jumbo frets are mentioned on the Custom 24 Floyd Rose page but doesn’t mention what fretwire is used on the standard Custom 24. 

ADP

PRS use Jescar 47104 on almost all of their guitars and 57110 on the DGT and Custom 24 Floyd Rose. They're similar to Dunlop 6150 and 6100 respectively.

Jonathanthomas83

Thank you @ADP I assume 57110 is jumbo. For such a forward thinking company, it amazes me that they don’t use stainless steel jumbo as standard (although, I know SS isn’t for everyone - personally, I love it).

Jez6345789

I think of any of the US manufacturers PRS have done pretty well in the last few years. They now have product in 3 price points. 

They have had a lot of love for recent stuff like Vela/594 S2.
new amps etc.

but guitars are a tough market being number 3 in a condensing market  overall guitar sales are declining your only option is to steal sales from your competitors. Hence 594 strategy targeting Gibson custom shop and the R8/r9 customer.

if anything this may be a consolidation year let everything settle a bit. The current idea of products on an annual refresh 2018 models is not a great one for guitars. Although it's how a lot of markets have gone. Before you have got the new models into full production you are behind the scenes ready the next years ideas. 

As for stainlesd frets i see PRS asked on a number of interviews. Why not and his answer was pretty honest that they have no experience of it as a material how it sounds is it good how do you integrate it into the current range. Does it really make a difference. He feels the wire they use is good and does a great job.(would say that) I don't think you would want to offer two options as a business so you are either in or out and what does that do to your current customer base.

i reckon maybe they will pick one model say custom 24 and do custom 24 SS to test the water.

Jez6345789

I think of any of the US manufacturers PRS have done pretty well in the last few years. They now have product in 3 price points. 

They have had a lot of love for recent stuff like Vela/594 S2.
new amps etc.

but guitars are a tough market being number 3 in a condensing market  overall guitar sales are declining your only option is to steal sales from your competitors. Hence 594 strategy targeting Gibson custom shop and the R8/r9 customer.

if anything this may be a consolidation year let everything settle a bit. The current idea of products on an annual refresh 2018 models is not a great one for guitars. Although it's how a lot of markets have gone. Before you have got the new models into full production you are behind the scenes ready the next years ideas. 

As for stainlesd frets i see PRS asked on a number of interviews. Why not and his answer was pretty honest that they have no experience of it as a material how it sounds is it good how do you integrate it into the current range. Does it really make a difference. He feels the wire they use is good and does a great job.(would say that) I don't think you would want to offer two options as a business so you are either in or out and what does that do to your current customer base.

i reckon maybe they will pick one model say custom 24 and do custom 24 SS to test the water.

Dontgiveupyourdayjob

jeztone2 said:

Whitecat said:

Other than that 24-08 no new Core models or major revisions... just a few new colours. Lean times at PRS towers?

Well I think it’s lean times everywhere. Let’s be honest have people’s disposable incomes really recovered post 2008? Given the massive increases in living costs?

Is there not an element of the big manufacturers being victims of the overall increase in quality in cheaper guitars (including their own)? The Big 3 have probably had sales cannibalised from their core US lines by their own excellent budget offerings.


Years ago a Squier or an Epiphone was something the hobbyist guitar player would have to start learning with, and you'd tolerate it until you'd saved enough to buy a 'proper' US made model. Nowadays Far Eastern and Mexican made guitars are so good, there really isn't much need for the average hobbyist/bedroom player to trade up to the more expensive ranges.

I currently have a MiM Classic Player Strat. It's great, and I can't see any reason to trade up to a US made model. For PRS, the guitars coming out of World Guitars in Korea are generally fantastic. If I had a higher end SE with the better pickups, there's no way I could justify spending > double the money on a core line.

Jez6345789

I agree I have an SE great guitars and still want an se245 as a custom platform for some ideas.

i think we will probably see a big condensing of US production over the next 5 years. Fender. Have done stuff like keep mim bodies multiple pieces. But those things only last so long before your competition passes you by.

i think PRS are aligned to take some market share on the way down from the big two.

hopefully it's all cyclical as demand and competition has given us a golden era for the last decade. I think guitar might get like synth was for a while till dance music and technology collided. 

I am hoping teenagers over over the next few years will move away from ghetto rapper bullshit, and making loops on an ipad and pickup guitars. Currently not much new to engage the youth counter culture.

hey ho

Voxman

The 24-08 looks and sounds very nice. Shame that the PRS guys aren't very bright though...how many pick-ups? (1:52)

Whitecat

Stuff goes in cycles of course.

Acoustic guitar sales are the real growth area - the grant I mentioned PRS receiving above was meant to go towards building "an affordable US acoustic model" - it was a 3-year plan, which makes spring 2018 the end of that timeline. Will we see something announced at NAMM? If it's being pushed back is there a chance they will miss out on most of that growth?

guitars4you

Whitecat said:

Stuff goes in cycles of course.

Acoustic guitar sales are the real growth area - the grant I mentioned PRS receiving above was meant to go towards building "an affordable US acoustic model" - it was a 3-year plan, which makes spring 2018 the end of that timeline. Will we see something announced at NAMM? If it's being pushed back is there a chance they will miss out on most of that growth?

Gibson have always had a good market for electric and acoustic based guitars - maybe because of the long heritage of the company and coming from an acoustic based business and later adding electrics to the line - Fender have never been successful with acoustic sales, hence one of the reasons to buy Guild a few years ago - And PRS have struggled to have any impact with their USA and SE based acoustic/electro models - Like wise Martin and Taylor have both struggled to enter the electric guitar market - It appears you are known for one market so don't try something else

Whitecat

It seems like the PRS fanatics would be into it, but that’s maybe not enough to sustain a whole production line. I imagine competing against the known entities in the midrange must be super tough, as you say. And one also wonders why anyone getting started with a super low budget would buy anything other than a Yamaha...

robbie

Revitalising an old thread, however, others had earlier asked how prs are doing and the following is worth a look (at 7.30) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9IBtlXGKJtE 
Apparently 2017 was a less than stellar year for guitar sales - brexit, trump effect et al - however, prs were their best performer.

Whitecat

robbie said:

Revitalising an old thread, however, others had earlier asked how prs are doing and the following is worth a look (at 7.30) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9IBtlXGKJtE 
Apparently 2017 was a less than stellar year for guitar sales - brexit, trump effect et al - however, prs were their best performer.

Sounds like something Lee would say to PRSh on a video for sure... remember that PRS bought him a guitar last year...

Another well-known UK retailer said on Facebook a little while ago that he could stay in business just selling Gibson, but that there was no chance of doing same with PRS.