New upgraded Fender Amps

ICBM

MattFGBI said:

ICBM said:

Blues Deluxe ... discontinued it again ... there seem to be quite a few left in the shops.

The Blues Deluxe is not discontinued.

Ah... found it. It's just in a different place on the website now. Sorry about that .

MattFGBI

StefB said:

MattFGBI said:

Funkfingers said:

ICBM said:
Blues Deluxe ... discontinued it again ... there seem to be quite a few left in the shops.

My nearest Fender dealership has one of the "limited edition" tweed-covered ones with the Jensen loudspeaker. The small price differential between this and a regulation black Tolex HRD3 probably explains why the latter is the one that sells.

The Blues Deluxe is not discontinued. Neither is the lacquered tweed Blues Junior. Those remain unchanged. 

Looks like the 4x10 HRD has bitten the dust altogether though?

Yes, the 4x10 has gone. 

thebreeze

p90fool said:

ICBM said:

Fretwired said:

That Pro Junior sounds great .... better than the Blues Junior IMHO.

Much better. It always has.

Despite only having a single tone control and a smaller speaker it sounds bigger and more open than the Blues Junior.

Very true, I loved my first Pro Jr so mail ordered a Blues Jr thinking that with full tone controls, reverb and a 12" speaker it would be my dream amp. 

Um, nope.

It's the usual thing of we're all different.  Although not totally crazy about either amp I think the BJ sounds much nicer from that video.  The PJ sounds tinny to me until the delay pedal is used, which sounded nice, or it's turned right up and even then I'm not wild about it.

ICBM

MattFGBI said:

StefB said:

Looks like the 4x10 HRD has bitten the dust altogether though?

Yes, the 4x10 has gone. 

That's a shame, I always thought it was the better-sounding of the two. The 2x12" just sounds like a louder Deluxe, but not in a particularly good way - it seems to bring out the shouty midrange more. The 4x10" sounds halfway to a '59 Bassman - I accept that it might not have sold as well though. And it was a big heavy thing, which I know is not popular now...

dindude

Mildly breathed on rather upgraded me thinks - but why mess too much with a winning formula I guess

Fenderman53

Made to a price point and not up to a quality perhaps(?)
These popular (with the masses) amps could be better but are Fender 'bean counters' really bothered.
Questionably weak PCBs with solder tracks that lift under the heat of operation, tube sockets not mounted on a solid chassis, the issues are often well reported. To put them right? How much? Does Fender want its amps to be long lived and reliable in every day gigging use? 

StefB

Fenderman53 said:

Made to a price point and not up to a quality perhaps(?)
These popular (with the masses) amps could be better but are Fender 'bean counters' really bothered.
Questionably weak PCBs with solder tracks that lift under the heat of operation, tube sockets not mounted on a solid chassis, the issues are often well reported. To put them right? How much? Does Fender want its amps to be long lived and reliable in every day gigging use? 

I bet they haven’t addressed the cardboard rear panels either, but then they never will on any future version either I suppose. 

ICBM

Fenderman53 said:

Made to a price point and not up to a quality perhaps(?)
These popular (with the masses) amps could be better but are Fender 'bean counters' really bothered.
Questionably weak PCBs with solder tracks that lift under the heat of operation, tube sockets not mounted on a solid chassis, the issues are often well reported. To put them right? How much? Does Fender want its amps to be long lived and reliable in every day gigging use? 

Not true of the Hotrods, although I will agree that the Blues Junior does have issues with the valve sockets and PCBs (hence the 'fire' comment above ).

It's true that the earliest ones did have some known faults, but the Hotrods are now well-engineered, reliable amps which although they do still have a couple of minor issues, the rest have largely been ironed out - probably the most common fault I see now is filter cap failure, which is more a component quality issue than a design and build quality problem. (Admittedly they could use better caps... but today I just saw the same type in a £2K+ boutique amp!)

This is why I think the Hotrods are great, well-priced amps - but the Blues Junior is a quite average, overpriced amp... it simply isn't built anywhere near as well. (Even ignoring the tone difference.) The construction differences are hard to see from outside but include the power valve sockets being directly PCB-mounted on the BJ rather than chassis-mounted with standoffs as they are on the HRD, and the pots having no support frames.

How they can justify over £600 for the 15W, single-channel, questionably-built BJ when the 2-channel+boost, 40W, better reverb, FX loop and much better built HRD is only just over £800 I don't know.

rico

Fretwired said:

chromatuna said:

Does this affect all small combos though or is it something particular about the BJr? I have wondered if it might have something to do with the speaker tucked in the corner rather than being central with more air around it?

It depends what the small combo does. The Pro Junior sounds great and it's smaller than the Blues Junior - however it could be argued that its only good at one thing.

I had a Cornford Harlequin which was a 6 watt amp in a full-sized cabinet with a 12 inch speaker. Sounded great ...

There's a guy on YouTube who but a Pro Junior in a bigger cabinet with a 12 inch speaker. Sounds like a different amp.

What a fucking plonker that guy is. 

jpfamps

Hopefully they've also cured the self oscillation in the Blues Junior. Only requires a component value change.

I'm sure we'll find out soon!

p90fool

jpfamps said:

Hopefully they've also cured the self oscillation in the Blues Junior. Only requires a component value change.

I'm sure we'll find out soon!

I don't care what they've done with it. Although the sound it makes is obviously subjective, it's a cheaply-made, thrown together practice amp with very limited features, whose development has been paid for a million times over.

That's absolutely fine, we all have space in our lives for something similar, but it's SIX HUNDRED AND NINE QUID! That's only a few packs of strings away in price from this;

https://www.andertons.co.uk/guitar-dept/electric-guitar-amps/prs-sonzera-20w-1x12-combo-sonzera20c

...which is in a totally different league in terms of sound, features, quality and even brand name. 

olafgarten

Most of the Fender Amps are overpriced, the Pro Junior is £529 for a 1x12 combo with basically no features.

Compare that to the Laney Cub 12R which is only £319 and has reverb, a low power input and a full tone stack. 

crunchman

olafgarten said:

Most of the Fender Amps are overpriced, the Pro Junior is £529 for a 1x12 combo with basically no features.

Compare that to the Laney Cub 12R which is only £319 and has reverb, a low power input and a full tone stack. 

Give me the Fender any day.

Full tone stack can be overrated.  Look at something like a Lazy J 20.  Just a tone but sounds stunning.

I'd rather use a pedal for reverb than the cheap digital reverb you will get in the Laney.

You don't see Jeff Beck using Laney Cub 12Rs but you do see him using Pro Juniors.

p90fool

crunchman said:

olafgarten said:

Most of the Fender Amps are overpriced, the Pro Junior is £529 for a 1x12 combo with basically no features.

Compare that to the Laney Cub 12R which is only £319 and has reverb, a low power input and a full tone stack. 

Give me the Fender any day.

Full tone stack can be overrated.  Look at something like a Lazy J 20.  Just a tone but sounds stunning.

I'd rather use a pedal for reverb than the cheap digital reverb you will get in the Laney.

You don't see Jeff Beck using Laney Cub 12Rs but you do see him using Pro Juniors.

I love Pro Juniors, but c'mon, it's a £199 amp. 

crunchman

The only way you are going to get a valve amp at £199 is made in the far east with very cheap components and corners cut.

If you look at something like Jet City, even their little Custom 5 head is £185.  If you made that into a combo, with the extra cost of a speaker and complexity of build I'm sure that would be around £250 minimum - more if you use a decent speaker.  That's for a 5W amp with a single power valve.

For a US made amp, £529 isn't ridiculous.  Even if they are a bit expensive new, they will hold their value well.

p90fool

It hasn't been US made for decades,  and I'd honestly say £350 would be a fair retail price.

I'd probably get another for that, and having done it before I know a pair of them are excellent in stereo, but not at nearly 1,100 quid! 

olafgarten

crunchman said:

olafgarten said:

Most of the Fender Amps are overpriced, the Pro Junior is £529 for a 1x12 combo with basically no features.

Compare that to the Laney Cub 12R which is only £319 and has reverb, a low power input and a full tone stack. 

Give me the Fender any day.

Full tone stack can be overrated.  Look at something like a Lazy J 20.  Just a tone but sounds stunning.

I'd rather use a pedal for reverb than the cheap digital reverb you will get in the Laney.

You don't see Jeff Beck using Laney Cub 12Rs but you do see him using Pro Juniors.

I'm not saying it's a bad amp, it's just overpriced compared to other amps. You can't compare it to a Lazy J which is fully handmade by one person. 

I've played a Pro Junior and they are really good amps, but they aren't good enough to justify being almost double the price of the Laney which is also a good amp. 

jpfamps

olafgarten said:

Most of the Fender Amps are overpriced, the Pro Junior is £529 for a 1x12 combo with basically no features.

Compare that to the Laney Cub 12R which is only £319 and has reverb, a low power input and a full tone stack. 

More knobs = better value for money.

jpfamps

p90fool said:

I don't care what they've done with it. 

I do, I have to fix them!

I think Fender is probably a better brand for amps than PRS.........

Danny1969

I watched the Andertons's video today featuring the new Hot Rod. Apparently they haven't addressed the volume pot issue so I'm quite pleased about that