New band, electronic drums, need PA advice

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andy1839andy1839 Frets: 832
I've finally got myself into gear and started off a new band.  Just standard rock covers, just for a laugh. 

Its a four piece, two guitars, bass and drummer, now the drummer has an extensive electric kit.  He also drums, along with the bass player in an 80's party band.  Their other band owns a really decent 4.5kw PA system and they sound class with it, but that's not available for our use as it's owned by all of their other band. 

I'm absolutely clueless when it comes to PA, having either left it to someone else or hired in PA from a mate who also did the FOH mixing stuff. 

Does anyone else have experience of gigging with an electric drummer? What PA did you use? Did you have a couple of 12"s for the vox and something separate for the drums, or run it all through one system?

Are bass bins a necessity due to the punch and low frequencies needed? 
Any advice gratefully received. 

Ta!
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  • LegionreturnsLegionreturns Frets: 5423
    I use an electric kit through my PA for my youth club sessions, along with a couple of guitars and 3 mics. 

    Because I'm mobile with my gear I wanted compact, so I use one of those little Yamaha Stagepas rigs but with an added speaker to use as a monitor. I don't use a sub, but everything sounds great and is more than loud enough for us to do little shows with parents there. I don't have it above half volume. I reckon getting a sub would make a big difference if you're actually gigging on reasonable sized venues but the rig itself is a great starting point because it has more than enough inputs and punch

    My Trading Feedback    |    You Bring The Band

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  • andy1839andy1839 Frets: 832
    ILegionreturns said:
    I use an electric kit through my PA for my youth club sessions, along with a couple of guitars and 3 mics. 

    Because I'm mobile with my gear I wanted compact, so I use one of those little Yamaha Stagepas rigs but with an added speaker to use as a monitor. I don't use a sub, but everything sounds great and is more than loud enough for us to do little shows with parents there. I don't have it above half volume. I reckon getting a sub would make a big difference if you're actually gigging on reasonable sized venues but the rig itself is a great starting point because it has more than enough inputs and punch
    I'll have a look at them mate cheers, it's a minefield.  So much choice and I don't really understand how things like crossovers work, especially with, say, different makes of tops and bins. 
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  • sw67sw67 Frets: 59
    Our drummer uses a electronic kit sometimes - he brings a roland keyboard amp and a powered pa speaker for his sole use. Transport dictates we cant use bass bins / tops so it works for us
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  • andy1839andy1839 Frets: 832
    sw67 said:
    Our drummer uses a electronic kit sometimes - he brings a roland keyboard amp and a powered pa speaker for his sole use. Transport dictates we cant use bass bins / tops so it works for us
    Ah, ok that's not too bad then.  Is his active speaker a 12 or 15? Plenty of thump from it?

    So for a start we could probably get away with something similar.  For vocals are you going through a mixer & speaker or straight into a powered speaker, then adjusting the bass and guitar backline to match? 
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 7391
    I was in a band with an electronic kit and the drummer also had his own backline thingy, louder than our main PA if he wanted it to be. He could also use it as a monitor for the vocals. Just took a feed from that to put a bit of spread through the PA IIRC. 

    Dum dum dum, dum dum de dum, dum dum dum, dum dummmm.
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  • sw67sw67 Frets: 59
    andy1839 said:
    sw67 said:
    Our drummer uses a electronic kit sometimes - he brings a roland keyboard amp and a powered pa speaker for his sole use. Transport dictates we cant use bass bins / tops so it works for us
    Ah, ok that's not too bad then.  Is his active speaker a 12 or 15? Plenty of thump from it?

    So for a start we could probably get away with something similar.  For vocals are you going through a mixer & speaker or straight into a powered speaker, then adjusting the bass and guitar backline to match? 

    Vocals and guitar x 2 into mixer then 2 x Yamaha dsr 12 speakers - bass amp - acoustic or electronic drums into roland kb amp and makie thump 15
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  • Rowby1Rowby1 Frets: 371
    Done a couple of gigs recent with ekit and it’s hard work. All or nothing, either too much drums dominating the whole sound or nothing but the noise of sticks hitting the mesh. Not a big fan, get your drummer to learn to play an acoustic kit at a sensible volume, it’ll be way better for everyone.
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  • vasselmeyervasselmeyer Frets: 2415
    Because of the venues we play, our drummer often uses an electronic kit through a PA head into a 15" cab with a tweeter. We also take a feed into the full PA just for the spread.

    I much prefer playing with an acoustic kit but sometimes it's just not an option.
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  • andy1839andy1839 Frets: 832
    Rowby1 said:
    Done a couple of gigs recent with ekit and it’s hard work. All or nothing, either too much drums dominating the whole sound or nothing but the noise of sticks hitting the mesh. Not a big fan, get your drummer to learn to play an acoustic kit at a sensible volume, it’ll be way better for everyone.
    I have no idea whether you're joking or not. 


    Because of the venues we play, our drummer often uses an electronic kit through a PA head into a 15" cab with a tweeter. We also take a feed into the full PA just for the spread.

    I much prefer playing with an acoustic kit but sometimes it's just not an option.
    Yep, it's the first time I've played with an electronic kit in a band, I've got two electronic kits at home but only play through headphones so have no real reference as far as amplifying it goes. 
    I'll drop the thought during next practice, see if he's got something that'll do small gigs squirrelled away somewhere. 
    Just seems like a massive faff... shame he's such a good drummer!

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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 34000
    andy1839 said:

    Are bass bins a necessity due to the punch and low frequencies needed? 
    Yes, either a separate proper drum kit amp or subs for the PA are essential. Don't try putting kick drum though normal top cabs, you will overload them and it will not only sound poor, it will reduce the available power and headroom for the rest of the mix and if you're really unlucky, overstress the amp or the bass drivers - even if they're 15s. You need to separate out the 'thump' frequencies so they aren't conflicting with everything else and put them through a cab specifically designed to reproduce them. (This applies as much to mic'ing a conventional kick drum, for that matter.)

    The good news is that if you're putting it through the PA and you're on a tight budget you probably only need one sub because they're very un-directional - although it can still be better to have two so you can use them as the stands for the top cabs.
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • andy1839andy1839 Frets: 832
    Cheers @ICBM ;I’ll sow the seeds at next practice that this needs sorting out. 

    I’ve got a Yamaha DXR12 for my Kemper, maybe one more of them and a sub and we’re good to go for Vox and drums?
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 34000
    andy1839 said:

    I’ve got a Yamaha DXR12 for my Kemper, maybe one more of them and a sub and we’re good to go for Vox and drums?
    And a mixer :).
    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone."
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  • andy1839andy1839 Frets: 832
    ICBM said:
    andy1839 said:

    I’ve got a Yamaha DXR12 for my Kemper, maybe one more of them and a sub and we’re good to go for Vox and drums?
    And a mixer :).
    Gaaaah!
    where does it end?!?

    Im sure there’s a rule somewhere that the PA is solely the singers problem. 

    Saying that, at least with electric drums you only have one output rather than six drum mic inputs to mix. 

    Chances are it’ll be like my last few bands where we get to a gigging stage and then someone throws a fit and ragequits and then it won’t be a problem!

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