Gibson being sued for $50 million

Fretwired

More bad news for Gibson ... Tronical, the German firm whose Powertune automatic ‘robot’ guitar tuning systems were first introduced in 2005, has announced it is suing Gibson for $50 million.

https://www.musicradar.com/news/tronical-to-sue-gibson-for-dollar50-million

impmann

I'd say that that's a pre-emtive strike... they know Gibson is going to the wall, so they can become a creditor. ;-)

Phil_aka_Pip

Peanuts compared to what they owe other people. Stiil, not nice though.

Bridgehouse

Are they suing Gibson for making their technology universally hated by the guitar buying public?

Fretwired

impmann said:

I'd say that that's a pre-emtive strike... they know Gibson is going to the wall, so they can become a creditor. ;-)

They have a contract with Gibson. I just think they are enforcing their rights and seeking compensation. This could push Gibson into Chapter 11. This sort of thing is expensive.

impmann

Fretwired said:

impmann said:

I'd say that that's a pre-emtive strike... they know Gibson is going to the wall, so they can become a creditor. ;-)

They have a contract with Gibson. I just think they are enforcing their rights and seeking compensation. This could push Gibson into Chapter 11. This sort of thing is expensive.

I was joking, chap. :-)

Fretwired

Bridgehouse said:

Are they suing Gibson for making their technology universally hated by the guitar buying public?

They will probably add that to the lawsuit when they read your comment .. :-)

Fretwired

impmann said:

Fretwired said:

impmann said:

I'd say that that's a pre-emtive strike... they know Gibson is going to the wall, so they can become a creditor. ;-)

They have a contract with Gibson. I just think they are enforcing their rights and seeking compensation. This could push Gibson into Chapter 11. This sort of thing is expensive.

I was joking, chap. :-)

Doh!!! :-)

JerkMoans

Anything that creates employment opportunities for honest, hard-working lawyers is to be applauded, imho  

AlexC

Gibson could afford to pay that if they sold a couple of their custom shop ‘59 Les Pauls surely?

wibble

I look forward to seeing the phrase 'pre lawsuit tuners' in classifieds

WezV

Well now we know why Gibson went to the extreme step of putting them on everything in 2015 ... an effort to meet its contractual obligations perhaps?

scrumhalf

$23m as a share of profits? That's a rather large number.

Phil_aka_Pip

scrumhalf said:

$23m as a share of profits? That's a rather large number.

I didn't know Gibson had made any profit. Isn't that one of the reasons they're in the brown stuff?

I'm sure Tronic can "have their share" of a umpteen million loss if they want it!

Strangefan

Meh oh well, should have been better at business then shouldn't they. 

Fretwired

Phil_aka_Pip said:

scrumhalf said:

$23m as a share of profits? That's a rather large number.

I didn't know Gibson had made any profit. Isn't that one of the reasons they're in the brown stuff?

I'm sure Tronic can "have their share" of a umpteen million loss if they want it!

Gibson as a group lost money and is in debt.

Gibson Guitars (just the guitar making arm) has grown in terms of sales and makes very healthy profits. The Guitar making arm will survive. The future of the rest is uncertain.

Phil_aka_Pip

@Fretwired ;  OK. The guitar making arm is the only bit that I care about. Hope the rest of the group gets sold off or liquidated asap so as not to take the guitar business down with it.

crunchman

WezV said:

Well now we know why Gibson went to the extreme step of putting them on everything in 2015 ... an effort to meet its contractual obligations perhaps?

If they had kept the normal neck width, and not had that stupid Les Paul 100 logo they might have actually sold a few.  I don't mind the idea of the tuners without the other stuff that came in 2015.

guitars4you

crunchman said:

WezV said:

Well now we know why Gibson went to the extreme step of putting them on everything in 2015 ... an effort to meet its contractual obligations perhaps?

If they had kept the normal neck width, and not had that stupid Les Paul 100 logo they might have actually sold a few.  I don't mind the idea of the tuners without the other stuff that came in 2015.

might agree about the nut width and logo - but many reports of the tuners 'crashing' and as you'd expect always when you don't want them to 

digitalscream

Man, did they ever get their timing wrong...

guitars4you

I'm guessing that Gibson and Tronical agreed an exclusive period - And I dare say an agreed level of sales revenue

So how enforceable is this, if the product did not sell to the expected level - Easy answer is if you signed a deal then it is set in stone - But I dare say there are loop holes to pull out of such a deal - This then becomes the grey area where 2 teams of lawyers make their money - The world wide negative feedback regarding such tuners would help Gibson in this matter,  along with so many 'crashing' - I'm sure Gibson would utilise such negative issues to assist them

In essence Tronicals best bet of success was to have the tuners on a guitar with some major builder or another - If they had just marketed them as an aftermarket accessory, then I dare say the large majority of us would have shown no interest in removing our traditional Kluson, Grover, Schaller models, from our SG, LP or 335, for some electronic wizardry  - As such the product would have achieved little success anyway !!!!!!!!!!!!!