Windows 10 hasn't been good for me

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  • victorludorumvictorludorum Frets: 217
    The forced updates seem to be the thing that is getting people annoyed more than anything else. If they worked well then users would probably be happy to accept them, but it doesn't seem to be the case as problems seem extremely common.
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  • robertyroberty Frets: 536
    The forced updates seem to be the thing that is getting people annoyed more than anything else. If they worked well then users would probably be happy to accept them, but it doesn't seem to be the case as problems seem extremely common.
    You have to pay for an enterprise license to properly manage your W10 updates.  The logic goes that home users can't be trusted to keep on top of security updates
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 3829
    Hattigol said:

    Windows 10 hasn't been good for me anyone

    FTFY, mate.
    Speak for yourself.  I like Win 10.
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  • HattigolHattigol Frets: 1231
    crunchman said:
    Hattigol said:

    Windows 10 hasn't been good for me anyone except Crunchman

    FTFY, mate.
    Speak for yourself.  I like Win 10.
    FTFY
    "Anybody can play. The note is only 20%. The attitude of the motherf*cker who plays it is  80%" - Miles Davis
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  • victorludorumvictorludorum Frets: 217
    This is going off topic a bit now, but trying to install Linux and have a dual boot system is no longer easy! It seems that the old style BIOS system has changed and that now there is a thing called UEFI.

    I've now spent hours trying to get Linux to dual boot, but the UEFI/BIOS just keeps overriding it in favour of Microsoft which is the only 'authorised' system. Having ploughed through countless sites and tried countless pieces of advice, i am still no further forward. Cheers Microsoft and Intel!
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  • Danny1969Danny1969 Frets: 3580
    What machine is it ? you need to enter the bios to change the UFI to legacy 

    Dell F2
    HP \ Compaq F11
    Clone Delete key is common or F2 after escape

    www.2020studios.co.uk 
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  • victorludorumvictorludorum Frets: 217
    I haven't tried that step yet, mainly because the posts that I have seen on this say that it doesn't work. It's an Acer. I don't want to totally kill the machine, which has happened to some users it seems, so I'm doing this very gingerly. To be honest, I'm not even sure that that option is available to me as the editing possibilities on my BIOS are very limited indeed.
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  • olafgartenolafgarten Frets: 1390
    I haven't tried that step yet, mainly because the posts that I have seen on this say that it doesn't work. It's an Acer. I don't want to totally kill the machine, which has happened to some users it seems, so I'm doing this very gingerly. To be honest, I'm not even sure that that option is available to me as the editing possibilities on my BIOS are very limited indeed.


    You shouldn't have to switch to Legacy because then Windows will stop working. 

    You just need to change the efi boot settings. 

    From within Lubuntu, do the following in the terminal:
    1. sudo apt-get install efibootmgr
    2. Now we need to inspect the current settings so type: sudo efibootmgr
    This will display the current settings, and all of the boot devices, the important things you have to look for are Timeout, Boot Order and the ID's of both the Windows Boot Manager and Lubuntu (might be called Ubuntu)

    3. Now we need to change the settings, first the timeout, sudo efibootmgr -t 10

    4. Now just to be safe you want to change the boot order to put Lubuntu before windows.

    As an example if you have the following boot settings:
    Boot0001: Windows
    Boot0002: Lubuntu
    Boot0003: CD Drive
    Boot0004: USB
    You usually want to keep USB and CD before all of the others. So then do the command sudo efibootmgr -o 4,3,2,1
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  • olafgartenolafgarten Frets: 1390
    A little bit off topic, but I have Windows 10 on both an original Surface Book and my Custom Build PC and have had very few problems.

    The last thing was happened was due to my bootloader being corrupted on my PC and refusing to load the OS, but I managed to fix that with a recovery disk, still not sure what caused it.

    The Surface Book had some issues earlier on but it's really solid now. 
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  • victorludorumvictorludorum Frets: 217
    @olafgarten Thanks for the detailed guide :-) Sadly I tried this and Ubuntu doesn't even show up in the list. When I ran EasyEFI (I think that's what it's called), it said that Ubuntu was 'hidden/disabled'.
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  • olafgartenolafgarten Frets: 1390
    @olafgarten Thanks for the detailed guide :-) Sadly I tried this and Ubuntu doesn't even show up in the list. When I ran EasyEFI (I think that's what it's called), it said that Ubuntu was 'hidden/disabled'.

    In that case try running

    sudo efibootmgr -a [whatever the code for ubuntu is]
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  • quarkyquarky Frets: 2289
    edited June 1
    I've recently installed PiHole on my network and I couldn't believe the number of blocked attempts to contact Microsoft's telemetry servers. When I also looked at the other stuff it wants I just thought "fuck it, I'm not having this". There's NO REASON why Microsoft would need this unless they want to sell me something or use my data to sell to other people who want to sell me stuff.
    Yep. 

    Well, apart from collecting information on application, driver, and website compatibility, which they can then use to provide (for free) information for customers to assist in running and upgrading Windows without having to do compatibility testing on every single application, or spend weeks testing all the different drivers (and different versions) within an environment of thousands of PCs. 

    But yep, I don't use telemetry data for anything else

    And forced updates? Lets not forget that the many of the malware and virus attacks (such as the one at the NHS) happened because people didn't update, so were not patched against vulnerabilities that were found YEARS before. So do you think that suddenly people would start patching when they didn't in the past? 
    roberty said:
    You have to pay for an enterprise license to properly manage your W10 updates.  The logic goes that home users can't be trusted to keep on top of security updates
    Lots of companies patch Windows 10 Professional. Why do you think you need Enterprise edition to manage your updates?

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  • darthed1981darthed1981 Frets: 2136

    roberty said:
    You have to pay for an enterprise license to properly manage your W10 updates.  The logic goes that home users can't be trusted to keep on top of security updates
    Lots of companies patch Windows 10 Professional. Why do you think you need Enterprise edition to manage your updates?

    Indeed, I patch my Win 10 Pro PCs with WSUS, works just fine.

    Office 365 on the other hand cannot be patched with WSUS without having the expensive system center configuration manager as well.

    Which is a pain.  However, on a small network it is liveable with.

    98% of all malware attacks vulnerabilities that have already been patched, updates may be annoying but they do serve a purpose.
    Warning: this post may contain overtly affectionate references to Mary Spender
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3210
    edited June 1
    quarky said:

    And forced updates? Lets not forget that the many of the malware and virus attacks (such as the one at the NHS) happened because people didn't update, so were not patched against vulnerabilities that were found YEARS before. So do you think that suddenly people would start patching when they didn't in the past? 

    Yes but drinking water is a good idea for humans, however not if it is forced upon us when least expected, and it's full of salt

    And if there's anything good about me, I'm the only one who knows

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  • quarkyquarky Frets: 2289
    quarky said:

    And forced updates? Lets not forget that the many of the malware and virus attacks (such as the one at the NHS) happened because people didn't update, so were not patched against vulnerabilities that were found YEARS before. So do you think that suddenly people would start patching when they didn't in the past? 

    Yes but drinking water is a good idea for humans, however not if it is forced upon us when least expected, and it's full of salt
    Well, apart from the recent Intel debacle, most attacks have been on vulnerabilities patched long before. So why do you suddenly think people are going to start patching when all evidence points to the contrary? In fact, Microsoft had to extend support for version 1511 of Windows 10 because IT departments are in some cases still struggling to come to terms with the requirement to do so. And those companies which are still not patching, are storing data about customers. Personal data about people like you and me.

    Thanks, but I would rather that the significant percentage of people who "don't see the need" to patch, are strong-armed into it, if it means that more devices (and the data that is on them) is more secure.

    I didn't have to patch my Amstrad CPC-464 either, but the world has moved on. Pretending that "she'll be right" and trusting all users and customers to suddenly patch regularly is (IMO) irresponsible.
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 3829
    quarky said:
    I've recently installed PiHole on my network and I couldn't believe the number of blocked attempts to contact Microsoft's telemetry servers. When I also looked at the other stuff it wants I just thought "fuck it, I'm not having this". There's NO REASON why Microsoft would need this unless they want to sell me something or use my data to sell to other people who want to sell me stuff.
    Yep. 

    Well, apart from collecting information on application, driver, and website compatibility, which they can then use to provide (for free) information for customers to assist in running and upgrading Windows without having to do compatibility testing on every single application, or spend weeks testing all the different drivers (and different versions) within an environment of thousands of PCs. 

    But yep, I don't use telemetry data for anything else

    And forced updates? Lets not forget that the many of the malware and virus attacks (such as the one at the NHS) happened because people didn't update, so were not patched against vulnerabilities that were found YEARS before. So do you think that suddenly people would start patching when they didn't in the past?
    Not quite the same thing.  I'm pretty sure that they were still on XP. It wasn't just a few uninstalled patches.  It was an OS that was way past end of life, and completely unsupported.

    I've no problem with security stuff updating automatically, but I'm not so keen on all the other "features" they keep adding.  I want a minimal OS, without all the bloatware.  I can't be bothered with the effort of going the Linux route at the moment though.  Overall though, Win 10 is easily the best version of Windows.
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  • quarkyquarky Frets: 2289
    edited June 1
    Most were, but Windows 7 was also affected if not patched. Windows 7 is also way past the end of mainstream support, but many companies still use it. Hell, our company only moved (most) PCs from Windows XP to Windows 7 last year, and that is unfortunately not uncommon. That can't continue for companies, or end users.

    Obviously it can cause pain for some people though given the massive range of device types and ages that run Windows..

    Depending on the manufacturer, they may be able to ship a USB or image with less of the vendor bloatware (that is what we are planning to deploy), but yep, I agree it is the best version. There is plenty of pain to drag the rest of IT in some cases (I would bet that less than half of our IT team run W10 at home), but if companies can make the shift to intelligence led deployments, it should be easier. Certainly easier than the boom/bust style migrations of the past (going from XP to Vista, or Win7, or to Win8, 8.1, etc.).
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  • Emp_FabEmp_Fab Frets: 13423
    Every version of Windows is exactly the same...  all the bastards do is change the appearance then rename and relocate all the things you need    B)
    Birds are meant to fly free...  Open every cage you see.

    https://www.peta.org/about-peta/why-peta/caged-birds/
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  • TTBZTTBZ Frets: 607
    Other than the forced updates that seem to happen every few days and take an age to process, I don't mind Windows 10. I've been looking to get a new laptop for recording recently and wondering if I'd be better off with Windows 7 though. I know it's rock solid and won't have any update issues. I have a Win7 Pro disc and serial so it should just be a case of formatting the win10 laptop and starting fresh, right? Any real downsides to this?
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 3829
    TTBZ said:
    Other than the forced updates that seem to happen every few days and take an age to process, I don't mind Windows 10. I've been looking to get a new laptop for recording recently and wondering if I'd be better off with Windows 7 though. I know it's rock solid and won't have any update issues. I have a Win7 Pro disc and serial so it should just be a case of formatting the win10 laptop and starting fresh, right? Any real downsides to this?
    You might find that hardware might start to become incompatible.  I was forced to "upgrade" from Snow Leopard on my old MacBook pro because Kemper Rig Manager need a later version of the OS X.  Not sure what will happen with Windows, but full support for Win 7 ended more than 3 years ago.  Extended support has just over a year and half to run now (Jan 2020).  After that, I doubt that hardware manufacturers will bother with Win 7 drivers for new products.

    I wouldn't be putting Win 7 on a new PC at this point in time.  For audio stuff, I'm running Reaper on Win 10 these days and it's solid.
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  • prowlaprowla Frets: 1022
    Windows 10 has two good features:
    1. It boots quickly (except for when it's decided to do an update).
    2. It's not Windows 8.
    Windows 10 has a a few bad features:
    1. It slurps your data (even if you turn off most of the options).
    2. The ugly squared non-transparent flat window borders (which came from a desire to be compatible with the crappy Windows Phone software).
    3. The regular updates can be huge and take hours to install.
    If you have got legacy apps, you may be able to install a VM on the machine (VMware Player or Virtualbox) and install an older version of Windows in that; I've previously had XP running in a Window to drive an old scanner and one or two other things.
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 3829
    prowla said:
    Windows 10 has two good features:
    1. It boots quickly (except for when it's decided to do an update).
    2. It's not Windows 8.
    Windows 10 has a a few bad features:
    1. It slurps your data (even if you turn off most of the options).
    2. The ugly squared non-transparent flat window borders (which came from a desire to be compatible with the crappy Windows Phone software).
    3. The regular updates can be huge and take hours to install.
    If you have got legacy apps, you may be able to install a VM on the machine (VMware Player or Virtualbox) and install an older version of Windows in that; I've previously had XP running in a Window to drive an old scanner and one or two other things.
    Not with an SSD.  They do take a long time on my wife's laptop (although hours is probably an exaggeration), but on the 2 desktops in the house that have SSDs, they don't take too long.  One of those is a second gen i3 processor so it's not like it's the latest state of the art thing.  If you are getting a new computer now without an SSD you need your head examining so that's not that much of an issue going forwards.

    If you have an older computer that's on Win 7 and working ok, then it probably isn't worth the bother of upgrading to 10, but I wouldn't put any other version of Windows than 10 on a new PC.
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  • Emp_FabEmp_Fab Frets: 13423
    You know that learning curve you have to endure when MS bring out a new OS... where have they moved Printers to?  What have they called that app now ? Etc..

    I reached expert level with XP in that I knew where everything was, what it was called and how to use it.  Then 7 came out and the curve was shallower.  I found most things immediately and was soon back to flying around it like a pro.

    Then 8 came out and I nearly lost my mind.

    Then 10....

    I’m STILL at the stage of “How the fuck do you....   WHAT?  Why have they moved it THERE?  Oh FFS....  “

    I doubt I’ll ever be a pro with 10 because I’m too bored with fighting Microsoft all the time instead of using the computer for it’s main reasons... i.e. the other programs.
    Birds are meant to fly free...  Open every cage you see.

    https://www.peta.org/about-peta/why-peta/caged-birds/
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  • victorludorumvictorludorum Frets: 217
    TTBZ said:
    Other than the forced updates that seem to happen every few days and take an age to process, I don't mind Windows 10. I've been looking to get a new laptop for recording recently and wondering if I'd be better off with Windows 7 though. I know it's rock solid and won't have any update issues. I have a Win7 Pro disc and serial so it should just be a case of formatting the win10 laptop and starting fresh, right? Any real downsides to this?

    If you have an official disc you might be ok, but it depends on the machine. From what I've learned over the last day is that sometimes the UEFI just won't allow it and it will override it in favour of Windows 10. It seems to be mainly the cheaper machines which suffer from this. If you buy a built-to-order machine you can specify that you want to run other OSs on it and that should be ok (I think).
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  • darthed1981darthed1981 Frets: 2136
    Emp_Fab said:

    I’m STILL at the stage of “How the fuck do you....   WHAT?  Why have they moved it THERE?  Oh FFS....  “

    I doubt I’ll ever be a pro with 10 because I’m too bored with fighting Microsoft all the time instead of using the computer for it’s main reasons... i.e. the other programs.
    That's partly a symptom of MS transitioning from the old "Control Panel" to the new "Settings". menu.  They do it more and more with every version but as of now with Win 1803 all the old control panel is still there.  Just shortcut it on your desktop and do things the old way... for now.

    As it stands, it is still worth learning the new way, as I'd give good old control panel a couple of years at best before it disappears.
    Warning: this post may contain overtly affectionate references to Mary Spender
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  • victorludorumvictorludorum Frets: 217
    After 2 wasted days of fighting this I've thrown in the towel and done a refresh, but... unlike the built in Refresh option, this time I used a DVD with the latest Windows ISO on and it has refreshed my machine without erasing my other software like Cubase etc etc. I'm sure it'll corrupt again in the next few months, but if it does I'll just employ this solution again. It's a bit slow, but it works (or at least seems to be working).
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  • MickMick Frets: 94
    Emp_Fab said:
    You know that learning curve you have to endure when MS bring out a new OS... where have they moved Printers to?  What have they called that app now ? Etc..

    I reached expert level with XP in that I knew where everything was, what it was called and how to use it.  Then 7 came out and the curve was shallower.  I found most things immediately and was soon back to flying around it like a pro.

    Then 8 came out and I nearly lost my mind.

    Then 10....

    I’m STILL at the stage of “How the fuck do you....   WHAT?  Why have they moved it THERE?  Oh FFS....  “

    I doubt I’ll ever be a pro with 10 because I’m too bored with fighting Microsoft all the time instead of using the computer for it’s main reasons... i.e. the other programs.

    GodMode  will show all your settings in one place. ;)
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  • quarkyquarky Frets: 2289
    Emp_Fab said:
    You know that learning curve you have to endure when MS bring out a new OS... where have they moved Printers to?  What have they called that app now ? Etc..
    You know you can just click on the search box and enter "printers" ;) Similarly, if you want your power settings, just type "power settings".
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  • Emp_FabEmp_Fab Frets: 13423
    Yeah, I know, but I don’t like having to search for things.  It makes me feel like a noob.  I want to know where stuff is and the proper way to access it.

    One thing I’ve noticed... or think I have...  is that there appears to be several different ways of getting to the same place - which messes with my OCD.  There is a correct way and that’s that.

     I was once a power-user, now I’m just a poor sap like everyone else, scratching their heads and searching for things that should be obvious !!
    Birds are meant to fly free...  Open every cage you see.

    https://www.peta.org/about-peta/why-peta/caged-birds/
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