WORLD CUP 2018

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  • underdogunderdog Frets: 5723
    Just realised that @underdog is Welsh, so I must actually support you as I said I always support the Underdog.

    Oddly enough part of the reason I use that name is to do with football and one of the few things I remember of my father from childhood which was along the lines of always supporting the underdog
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 18238
    underdog said:
    Just realised that @underdog is Welsh, so I must actually support you as I said I always support the Underdog.

    Oddly enough part of the reason I use that name is to do with football and one of the few things I remember of my father from childhood which was along the lines of always supporting the underdog
    That'll be Wales then (football not rugby) .. ;-)
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • underdogunderdog Frets: 5723
    Fretwired said:
    underdog said:
    Just realised that @underdog is Welsh, so I must actually support you as I said I always support the Underdog.

    Oddly enough part of the reason I use that name is to do with football and one of the few things I remember of my father from childhood which was along the lines of always supporting the underdog
    That'll be Wales then (football not rugby) .. ;-)

    It was Liverpool v Wimbledon FA cup final, nothing to do with Wales, unless you count that legendary Welsh man Vinnie Jones
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  • BellycasterBellycaster Frets: 2614
    underdog said:
    Just realised that @underdog is Welsh, so I must actually support you as I said I always support the Underdog.

    Oddly enough part of the reason I use that name is to do with football and one of the few things I remember of my father from childhood which was along the lines of always supporting the underdog
    Same here, my Dad did too. The first example I recall was cheering for West Ham in the 1980 FA Cup Final and I was delighted they won. Through the successive years, the Underdog wins have been few and far between, but still enough to enjoy. I suppose it's better when it's only now and again.
    Conformity is the new Rebellion.
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  • BigBearKrisBigBearKris Frets: 1088
    Modric has more caps for Croatia than most of our players on the pitch had for England between them.

    Our teams average age was significantly lower than Croatia’s.

    This is their golden age team and this was their last shot at it before they will be too old for it. 

    Our inexperience showed more than anything tonight. Kane was pointed at as leader and was expected to do the right thing and lead like a lion. 4 years ago he was on loan to Norwich and was a nobody. Even two years ago it was a “Harry who?”

    Much as I hate to agree with pundits, it’s actually a couple of simple questions for England now...

    1. Can we find a creative midfielder to make play?
    2. Can we build this team and continue to rise and improve - given the improvement from 2016 - so we go into 2020 and 2022 with more of everything?

    Personally, if everyone stays supportive of Southgate and gives him a good run of it then I say we can.

    I’m not a man who likes to predict, but this all feels very Andy Murray to me... you need to fail near the top to get the mentality you need to win. 

    2020 - finalists. 
    2022 - ??

    As much as I appreciate this year's effort I think you may be a little too optimistic.
    ENG was quite lucky in tournament stages - even getting CRO in semis was a blessing. Weird tournament it is though mind, and I will say first - there may be more of those to come...

    There are some major positions to be filled in the team, midfield and some defense too - CRO made adjustments in 2nd half and they pretty much dominated since. There's talent in that young team, but I wouldn't be quick to jump into ''we're back as contenders'' as the commentators said on the broadcast.

    Good run though, in my opinion they have exceeded expectations by a mile. Well done lads!
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  • beed84beed84 Frets: 1277
    My only consolation for England losing is I've got France in the work sweepstake and a couple of quid on Croatia to win...

    But stowing my selfishness to one side, I'm gutted we couldn't hold it together after Trippier's sweet free kick. After that, Croatia got stronger in the second half and we slowly fell apart.
    "We are all just actors trying to control and manage our public image, we act based on how others might see us" – Erving Goffman
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  • BridgehouseBridgehouse Frets: 16263
    Thing about tournament football is success breeds success - if it’s managed correctly. 

    In 1990 we lost momentum when Taylor came in. Southgate building on a semi final with his first outing could be a turning point for us. 

    Course, we could revert to type and be shit once more but I hope the FA have learned that a manager who is suited to tournament national management can over time build a team that can do good things. I really do think that’s what the Germans get right so often.
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 4056
    Modric has more caps for Croatia than most of our players on the pitch had for England between them.

    Our teams average age was significantly lower than Croatia’s.

    This is their golden age team and this was their last shot at it before they will be too old for it. 

    Our inexperience showed more than anything tonight. Kane was pointed at as leader and was expected to do the right thing and lead like a lion. 4 years ago he was on loan to Norwich and was a nobody. Even two years ago it was a “Harry who?”

    Much as I hate to agree with pundits, it’s actually a couple of simple questions for England now...

    1. Can we find a creative midfielder to make play?
    2. Can we build this team and continue to rise and improve - given the improvement from 2016 - so we go into 2020 and 2022 with more of everything?

    Personally, if everyone stays supportive of Southgate and gives him a good run of it then I say we can.

    I’m not a man who likes to predict, but this all feels very Andy Murray to me... you need to fail near the top to get the mentality you need to win. 

    2020 - finalists. 
    2022 - ??

    As much as I appreciate this year's effort I think you may be a little too optimistic.
    ENG was quite lucky in tournament stages - even getting CRO in semis was a blessing. Weird tournament it is though mind, and I will say first - there may be more of those to come...

    There are some major positions to be filled in the team, midfield and some defense too - CRO made adjustments in 2nd half and they pretty much dominated since. There's talent in that young team, but I wouldn't be quick to jump into ''we're back as contenders'' as the commentators said on the broadcast.

    Good run though, in my opinion they have exceeded expectations by a mile. Well done lads!
    There is definitely stuff to build with going forward.  Southgate made the best of what he had (or close to it), but Walker isn't a centre back, and it showed on the first goal.  We can probably bring someone through to play that position. If not, then Walker will get better as he plays more games.

    There are other positions that can be improved.  Young isn't the best left back.  He's a converted winger and doesn't have the best defensive instincts.  Having him at left back also meant we were unbalanced without a single left footed outfield player in the team.  Personally I would have started Rose ahead of him.  There are young left backs around who will be an improvement on Young long term.

    @Bridgehouse is right though that we don't have a creative central midfielder.  England have struggled to find that kind of player for 30 years though.  We've really only had Gazza and Scholes in that time, and both of them were liabilities.  Scholes was a red card waiting to happen with his tackling.

    A lot of the current players should improve as well.  They are young and it showed in the lack of composure.  Rashford ran around like a headless chicken at times, and Alli doesn't always take the best option.  Assuming they have brains then they will improve.
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  • BridgehouseBridgehouse Frets: 16263
    Still think the age and experience is a big factor. 

    What’s changed?

    - A manager that can manage his players 
    - A team that appears to want to wear the shirt, have pride on the pitch and seem to put country before their own pride
    - A group of young players with more experience than our golden generation in the early 2000’s
    - At least 8 years more out of the core of this team
    - A country that’s remembered how to get behind the national team rather than throwing shit at it
    - A set of players already managed by Southgate before who, as a youth team did go all the way and who will be itching to do the same with the big boys
    - An FA that might possibly get it’s thumb out of it’s arse and put some thought into how to build on this because they took a risk on Southgate and it paid off
    - The press have changed. It’s subtle, but they do actually seem to want to do the right thing this time. It won’t last forever, but 2020 will be a crucial test. 
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  • I'll take it. We'll be there on the last weekend of the Tournament, I'd have bitten your hand off to be in that position at the start. 

    Croatia out foxed us, they looked like the warhorses they are, I can only wish them well in the final..it was their night. Well played.

    England...played their part in what has been a smashing month of football, I've really enjoyed the whole thing. 



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  • Philly_QPhilly_Q Frets: 4961
    underdog said:
    Oh that dude who had his England world cup winners 2018 tattoo last week has got to be angry right now.

    Oh well, he can go on Tattoo Fixers and get it turned into a huge skull with snakes in its eye sockets.  Or a wolf howling at the moon.  Or something equally imaginative.
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  • Emp_FabEmp_Fab Frets: 13766
    Bellycaster said: K9
    Emp_Fab said:
    What's worse than England losing is being in a pub full of pissed Yorkshiremen barking about what England's tactical mistakes were as if they were the world's greatest managers instead of builders from Bradford.
    No need to single out and make general sweeping statements about people from Yorkshire. Armchair Managers from Yorkshire are no different from the 100000's of Armchair Managers from all the other Counties.

    I could make sweeping statements about how all the Welsh "Sheep Shaggers" would have been in the Boozer tonight spitting Bile to the English team on TV and will now all be celebrating our demise and singing in close harmony about how Green their Valley is.
    Er....   It wasn't a "sweeping statement".  I was in a pub near Worcester and it WAS full of Yorkshiremen banging on about how England could have won if only they'd done X. Y or Z

    It wasn't an attempt to cast aspersions  about a regional stereotype.  It was the truth.
    Anything too stupid to be said..... is sung.

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 19288
    Cheer up chaps, you could still get the bronze. :)
    I am the juice of four limes.
    Trading Feedback

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  • valevale Frets: 1039
    octatonic said:
    Cheer up chaps, you could still get the bronze. :)
    & there's still curling in the winter olympics. all to play for.
    hofner hussie & hayman harpie. what she said...
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  • p90foolp90fool Frets: 9330
    Anyway, back to the football from a neutral perspective, just take a step back and think what it means for a country like Croatia to be in the World Cup Final. 

    Here's a list of previous finalists, and you have to go back a very long way indeed to avoid the big names.

     https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_FIFA_World_Cup_finals

    Croatia have been punching well above their weight since their recent formation as a tiny country, but this is a big deal and healthy for the tournament IMO. 
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  • ThePrettyDamnedThePrettyDamned Frets: 3845
    I was not very happy to see England time wasting so early in the second half - such daft play with 40 minutes to go, who's idea was that? 

    However, no doubt it went to the better team and it was nice to really enjoy the world cup :) 
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  • KilgoreKilgore Frets: 1421
    Never mind, there's still Wimbledon.

    Come on Tim!
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  • boogiemanboogieman Frets: 5302
    England didn’t play well after the first half. We looked short of ideas and just kept doing the same thing time and again.. wide to the fullbacks, hopeful cross, Kane surrounded by defenders, no one on the end of it. Rinse, repeat. They didn’t have the midfield players with the skill (or imagination) to do much else sadly. 
    Still much better than we’ve managed for many years, so well done boys. 

    And well done Croatia......now go and stuff the Frenchies. 
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  • monkey42monkey42 Frets: 144
    All I ever hope for in a tournament is that each player plays with a freedom and expression to make us proud. In this tournament, to a degree, these young lads have achieved that.
    We are lacking in one or two areas and I hope that a few of the under 17 and under 20 stars come through to add to an excellent nucleus. Game management only comes with experience. Modric coasted through the game that many thought he may be dead on his feet.

    well done guys, really proud of your efforts 
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  • proggyproggy Frets: 2212
    FOR SALE: 1 lucky waistcoat......
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  • Creed_ClicksCreed_Clicks Frets: 69
    That Ian Wright is a gobby pr*ck as well. Mocking Roy Keane’s accent when all else failed ..
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  • guitars4youguitars4you Frets: 4762
    Morning after

    hope Gareth continues for at least 4 more years and tries to build on his start. 12 months ago and no one would have believed that a semi final was achievable. No he knows what to build on. Alas he may have few options. Especially as a Modric style linch pin to control the game and conduct the team. Wilshire  is/was the closest we had and not wanted, so not sure who will come through for this roll

    out but in truth we can't be disappointed 

    sod 3rd place play off. Surely it will be the B team as only 2 days off in between matches 
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  • JAYJOJAYJO Frets: 921
    Missed massive opportunity. The draw was on our side and we cocked it up. Harry one eye on the golden boot and no trust in sterling. Southgate no trust in his substitutes. The changes made us weaker. why have 23 players. We beat Tunisia  Panama Columbia and Sweden. Lost to Belgium and Croatia and could still lose to Belgium again on Saturday. 
    IMO The Manager got it wrong. It was there for the taking and He did nothing he played it as safe as could be. The goals were soft. Walker off Alexander Arnold on. Lingard off Vardy on. Half time changes. Lovren was on the ropes and we let him off. Croatia now go to the final and we go home having made the Country Proud.... of what?   Having experience of losing to help us going forward....By the way Me and the Mrs are not talking today and it has everything to do with the football.  Wonder what was going to be for tea tonight... Another missed opportunity lol.

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  • VimFuegoVimFuego Frets: 6275
    I don't follow football, so this observation may be off, but one of the things that concerned me was there seemed to be a basic lack of skills in our players, things like accurate passing, able to control the ball when it was passed to you, the Cro players seemed much more in control of the ball when they had it, they seemed to find space to pass into more often. I'd love to see the stats, but I reckon our players ran a lot more than theirs, so instead of them fatiguing it was ours who looked tired after ET.

    All that said, we got to the semi's, when a lot of folks (including me) were predicting disaster. 

    I'm not locked in here with you, you are locked in here with me.

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  • p90foolp90fool Frets: 9330
    JAYJO said:
    Missed massive opportunity. The draw was on our side and we cocked it up. Harry one eye on the golden boot and no trust in sterling. Southgate no trust in his substitutes. The changes made us weaker. why have 23 players. We beat Tunisia  Panama Columbia and Sweden. Lost to Belgium and Croatia and could still lose to Belgium again on Saturday. 
    IMO The Manager got it wrong. It was there for the taking and He did nothing he played it as safe as could be. The goals were soft. Walker off Alexander Arnold on. Lingard off Vardy on. Half time changes. Lovren was on the ropes and we let him off. Croatia now go to the final and we go home having made the Country Proud.... of what?   Having experience of losing to help us going forward.

    Here's a perfect example of the English sense of entitlement this World Cup has largely and healthily swept away. 

    They have done pretty well this time against similar level countries, and eventually ran out of steam and imagination against classier opposition. 

    They got a very long way on tenacity and tactics but there are obvious shortcomings in terms of flair and creativity against better teams. 

    This is in no way a criticism, but when England progress to a semi- or a final these are FREAK EVENTS, not England's rightful and God-given place in the world. England are, and always have been footballing minnows, and a realistic and honest utilisation of the assets at their disposal has got them a very long way this year. 

    I honestly fear for them at the Euros, the press gave the coach and squad an easy ride this year, but their success will have them baying for a 6-0 win in the Euro final or they'll tear them to shreds. 
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  • rlwrlw Frets: 1723
    The only comment I have to make, as a non-football fan, is that, rather than sitting around dejectedly at the end and wallowing in the grief, the team, should have been on their feet, waving to the fans and putting out the message, didn't we do well.  Wallowing like that is very very negative for everyone concerned.
    Save a cow.  Eat a vegetarian.
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  • BigLicks67BigLicks67 Frets: 527
    Last night England seemed to revert to type in that they hit the ball long and stopped playing the ball out from the back. I think our early goal made us look for long ball over top quick counterattack far too often. Whereas, Croatia played like the experienced top players they are, worked their way into the game and progressively dominated the game.
    The end result is that we've given France a weary and battered team to destroy in the final.
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  • JAYJOJAYJO Frets: 921
    p90fool said:
    JAYJO said:
    Missed massive opportunity. The draw was on our side and we cocked it up. Harry one eye on the golden boot and no trust in sterling. Southgate no trust in his substitutes. The changes made us weaker. why have 23 players. We beat Tunisia  Panama Columbia and Sweden. Lost to Belgium and Croatia and could still lose to Belgium again on Saturday. 
    IMO The Manager got it wrong. It was there for the taking and He did nothing he played it as safe as could be. The goals were soft. Walker off Alexander Arnold on. Lingard off Vardy on. Half time changes. Lovren was on the ropes and we let him off. Croatia now go to the final and we go home having made the Country Proud.... of what?   Having experience of losing to help us going forward.

    Here's a perfect example of the English sense of entitlement this World Cup has largely and healthily swept away. 

    They have done pretty well this time against similar level countries, and eventually ran out of steam and imagination against classier opposition. 

    They got a very long way on tenacity and tactics but there are obvious shortcomings in terms of flair and creativity against better teams. 

    This is in no way a criticism, but when England progress to a semi- or a final these are FREAK EVENTS, not England's rightful and God-given place in the world. England are, and always have been footballing minnows, and a realistic and honest utilisation of the assets at their disposal has got them a very long way this year. 

    I honestly fear for them at the Euros, the press gave the coach and squad an easy ride this year, but their success will have them baying for a 6-0 win in the Euro final or they'll tear them to shreds. 
    mmmm i may feel differently when i sober up a bit. This is a good post.
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  • munckeemunckee Frets: 2140
    I was really pleased with the first half the speed and accuracy of our passing was genuinely world class and anyone would have struggled with us, had we got a second I think we would have held the lead.  Second half their midfield was too good for us as most people suspected.

    Overall great showing at the tournament, if we can find a gazza we'll be as good as anyone.
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