The Colourbox - Two Teas, No Sugar. Feedback please?!

thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
edited June 25 in Making Music
After much deliberation, procrastination, and technical frustration, I've finally "finished" my EP. I won't say too much by way of backing info but basically I was bought a studio experience by my old work mates as a 30th birthday gift which was interesting, though most of what is in this I've done myself, at home. If anybody wants to know I can give some details of what kit I used and what not.

Would love some feedback. The originals are "Sheena is a Monster", " I'm sorry Suarez ", " Wait" and "If". The others are covers - " Pale Blue Eyes" Velvet Underground, "Red Light Blue Light" Harry Connick Junior, "Wild Fire" Laura Marling. All instruments and vocals played, programmed and sang by me (with a few spoken samples from internet).

Without further ado:

Listen to Two Teas, No Sugar by thecolourbox #np on #SoundCloud


Oh and I did an acoustic demo type version of Wild Fire too:

Listen to Wild Fire - Acoustic (Laura Marling Cover) by thecolourbox #np on #SoundCloud


Many thanks in advance for your thoughts

Water, come drown me, I'm done

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Comments

  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 3415
    Lashings of ginger beer reverberation. So much that it sounds as you are performing in a tunnel. 
    "It's no wonder the Pacific Ocean is blue."
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Lashings of ginger beer reverberation. So much that it sounds as you are performing in a tunnel. 
    Ha yes I do like a lot of reverb and it's possibly a bad habit of mine, using reverb to cover up the playing and vocals a bit. I've maybe not learnt how to be more subtle with it yet as I tried a couple without any or much and it sounded rather jarring. Does monitoring on headphones make a difference as well do you think? As I find when playing guitar through them I need a bit more air in the sound to make up for the lack of room ambience

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    edited June 25
    Lashings of ginger beer reverberation. So much that it sounds as you are performing in a tunnel. 
    I agree .. there's a decent song in there but too much reverb, especially on the vocals.

    Wild fire was good .. no reverb to detract from the playing and singing.
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Fretwired said:
    Lashings of ginger beer reverberation. So much that it sounds as you are performing in a tunnel. 
    I agree .. there's a decent song in there but too much reverb, especially on the vocals.

    Wild fire was good .. no reverb to detract from the playing and singing.
    With my singing and playing though there is good reason to detract from it Haha but thanks guys, point taken on board. I'll be looking to read up on a few things as a conclusion to this project - I've taught myself thus far and I still don't understand half of the stuff the software can do, or how to fix some niggling tech issues I keep having, so I hope to improve on that in future (and set up preset templates more than likely!!)

    Is it a case of the input needing to improve, do you think, so that I don't have to cover it in compression, reverb and overdrive? If I turn off the fx it just sounds dry and bare and my mistakes or shortcomings show up a lot more. 

    Another thought that may or may not be valid that somebody else has commented on, and this is in general not specific to the reverb thing, is that the music I listen to and enjoy playing is not reflected in these songs, mainly because my vocals do not lend themselves to those styles. So I have to do more generic styles of music which I'm not so used to listening to in order to pick up styles and ideas. 

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • flying_pieflying_pie Frets: 429
    I'll get a listen on my commute home but here are some thoughts for now:

    Why not post a drier version for us to hear? You can obsess about perfection but plenty of famous tracks have mistakes or imperfections which make them. What might seem a mistake to you could be different to others. Or you might be told to stick with the reverb! But people are friendly and honest here. 

    And why not try recording what you want to play? You can adapt it to go with your vocals if need be but don't play/sing stuff that's not you.
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    Fretwired said:
    Lashings of ginger beer reverberation. So much that it sounds as you are performing in a tunnel. 
    I agree .. there's a decent song in there but too much reverb, especially on the vocals.

    Wild fire was good .. no reverb to detract from the playing and singing.
    With my singing and playing though there is good reason to detract from it Haha but thanks guys, point taken on board. I'll be looking to read up on a few things as a conclusion to this project - I've taught myself thus far and I still don't understand half of the stuff the software can do, or how to fix some niggling tech issues I keep having, so I hope to improve on that in future (and set up preset templates more than likely!!)

    Is it a case of the input needing to improve, do you think, so that I don't have to cover it in compression, reverb and overdrive? If I turn off the fx it just sounds dry and bare and my mistakes or shortcomings show up a lot more. 

    Another thought that may or may not be valid that somebody else has commented on, and this is in general not specific to the reverb thing, is that the music I listen to and enjoy playing is not reflected in these songs, mainly because my vocals do not lend themselves to those styles. So I have to do more generic styles of music which I'm not so used to listening to in order to pick up styles and ideas. 
    I always record dry or just a touch of reverb on an FX channel that I can delete. I suggest you maybe look at mixing. For example I use Cubase which allows me to create FX channels that can be applied to recordings. In the case of vocals I could add a touch of warm saturation and reverb and then mix to taste with the dry signal to create warmth, space and ambiance.

    Music Radar have tutorials on mixing as does Steinberg (you don't need the company's products - you can pick up the basics). YouTube is full of videos.
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324

    @flying_pie I could do alternate less-reverb versions yes, though would probably be next week before I get time. Re perfection & mistakes it's not so much that, "Mistakes" probably isn't the word, more "shortcomings" I think. I'm happy to leave little mistakes in (as evidenced by these recordings haha) as they generally add to the vibe as you say.

    My next project may well be to make music I like, though it will have to be instrumental as honestly, my voice would not work for it. That's not self deprecating, it just does not fit. I like listening to and playing White Stripes, Strokes, Yeah Yeah Yeahs. I don't have the vocal range (high or low) to go with that type of guitar playing, and playing up a 5th makes the guitar sound like the smurfs are playing it. Playing up a 5th and doubling down an octave with a POG would become a tedious gimmick after a few songs I think. I don't have any musical friends I could steal to sing for me either, as the few I have play and sing only MoR Dad rock or choral stuff! Cheers for your thoughts though, I appreciate the differing viewpoints.

    @fretwired I too use Cubase, I could not understand how to do even the most basic stuff in Reaper or Pro Tools. I did try to use FX tracks on a couple of them but I don't think I fully understood what to do with them as I could not hear any difference with it switched on or off even with two or three tracks sent to it. I've never read any tutorials or watched any videos as my vocab of what things are is so low, I get quite lost very quickly, have to stop and then look up the thing I was confused about so it's a bit of a rabbit hole and as ever, time is the enemy.


    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 7296
    edited June 25
    I haven’t listened to anything yet but, based on the comments, if you wanted my son to attempt a mix ( not entirely random this, it’s what he studies at college and is top of his class) he’s hanging around college until the end of next week. He’d need the raw stems though ( no, I don’t know what that means). 
    If it’s rubbish no harm done I guess. 
    I’ll listen to the tracks later and compare them to some obscure sixties band you’ve never heard of... :innocent: 

    Dum dum dum, dum dum de dum, dum dum dum, dum dummmm.
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  • spark240spark240 Frets: 965
    I haven’t listened to anything yet but, based on the comments, if you wanted my son to attempt a mix ( not entirely random this, it’s what he studies at college and is top of his class) he’s hanging around college until the end of next week. He’d need the raw stems though ( no, I don’t know what that means). 
    If it’s rubbish no harm done I guess. 
    I’ll listen to the tracks later and compare them to some obscure sixties band you’ve never heard of... :innocent: 

    Already asked ....he doesnt have the stems ....unless someone can advise how to export multi track from Cubase?


    Mac Mini i7, 2.3Ghz.
    Presonus Studio One Pro.
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 7296
    spark240 said:
    I haven’t listened to anything yet but, based on the comments, if you wanted my son to attempt a mix ( not entirely random this, it’s what he studies at college and is top of his class) he’s hanging around college until the end of next week. He’d need the raw stems though ( no, I don’t know what that means). 
    If it’s rubbish no harm done I guess. 
    I’ll listen to the tracks later and compare them to some obscure sixties band you’ve never heard of... :innocent: 

    Already asked ....he doesnt have the stems ....unless someone can advise how to export multi track from Cubase?
    Ahh. My son said he could also work on it if was in Logic Pro or had the ableton project file (?).

    Dum dum dum, dum dum de dum, dum dum dum, dum dummmm.
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  • flying_pieflying_pie Frets: 429
    @thecolourbox you could play that style of music but just sing lower. Adapt the melody to suit. It's the intention that makes the style not the pitch. 

    Having listened I'd agree with the comments about reverb. You've got some good stuff in there though. Don't shy away from vocals completely 
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    spark240 said:
    I haven’t listened to anything yet but, based on the comments, if you wanted my son to attempt a mix ( not entirely random this, it’s what he studies at college and is top of his class) he’s hanging around college until the end of next week. He’d need the raw stems though ( no, I don’t know what that means). 
    If it’s rubbish no harm done I guess. 
    I’ll listen to the tracks later and compare them to some obscure sixties band you’ve never heard of... :innocent: 

    Already asked ....he doesnt have the stems ....unless someone can advise how to export multi track from Cubase?
    There's an option called Export and you can export the individual tracks as wav files. Do you know what version of Cubase is being used?
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Sorry guys for the delay, been at a Travis gig tonight, what a band.

    Anyway! Yes the stems.... I may try to do dry stems this weekend but it takes forever and a day to do them as my version of Cubase (elements) does not have the batch export of each track, but instead you have to go through and solo one track at a time to export it. I generally only have eight tracks max at any one time, however I have about three versions of each eight also there in the background for different takes which are muted so I get rather confused as to which I have done and which I haven't when I try to do that. But, it was only about £70 instead of £400...

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Oh yes @Fretwired I do miss that option when I changed from sx6 to 8 Elements!!

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    Oh yes @Fretwired I do miss that option when I changed from sx6 to 8 Elements!!
    You can still do it in Elements .. just do it a track at a time. I think you do the full one hit export in 9.5. There was an upgrade offer from 8 for around £20. I'll check for you as I have a copy ... I use 9.5 Pro though.
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Thanks @fretwired but Elements 9.5 doesn't have the batch export either! I know i can solo a track at a time but with 7 songs at average of eight each that takes a long long time!

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 3415
    thecolourbox said:
    With my singing and playing though there is good reason to detract from it Haha 

    Is it a case of the input needing to improve, do you think, so that I don't have to cover it in compression, reverb and overdrive? If I turn off the fx it just sounds dry and bare and my mistakes or shortcomings show up a lot more. 
    Some of the world's most famous popular music vocalists are not exactly bel canto trained. This does not prevent them from getting a song across. The conviction in their delivery overcomes the shortcomings of their intonation and breath control.

    Confidence.
    "It's no wonder the Pacific Ocean is blue."
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    Thanks @fretwired but Elements 9.5 doesn't have the batch export either! I know i can solo a track at a time but with 7 songs at average of eight each that takes a long long time!
    Apologies, you are right. I was confusing Elements with Artist. Still nine tracks should only take a few minutes.
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    thecolourbox said:
    With my singing and playing though there is good reason to detract from it Haha 

    Is it a case of the input needing to improve, do you think, so that I don't have to cover it in compression, reverb and overdrive? If I turn off the fx it just sounds dry and bare and my mistakes or shortcomings show up a lot more. 
    Some of the world's most famous popular music vocalists are not exactly bel canto trained. This does not prevent them from getting a song across. The conviction in their delivery overcomes the shortcomings of their intonation and breath control.

    Confidence.
    I don't have any other gear to shift to though other than the monotone you can hear on these seven recordings! 

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Fretwired said:
    Thanks @fretwired but Elements 9.5 doesn't have the batch export either! I know i can solo a track at a time but with 7 songs at average of eight each that takes a long long time!
    Apologies, you are right. I was confusing Elements with Artist. Still nine tracks should only take a few minutes.
    I tried to do it before the studio day in order to take the project file with me in pro tools which they used, it took about 10 minutes each track to export! In the time it took to export the full songs I cooked a roast dinner and washed up, single tracks take less but I have to keep returning to the computer every ten minutes so can't really crack on with anything else while I leave it running off that makes sense

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    Fretwired said:
    Thanks @fretwired but Elements 9.5 doesn't have the batch export either! I know i can solo a track at a time but with 7 songs at average of eight each that takes a long long time!
    Apologies, you are right. I was confusing Elements with Artist. Still nine tracks should only take a few minutes.
    I tried to do it before the studio day in order to take the project file with me in pro tools which they used, it took about 10 minutes each track to export! In the time it took to export the full songs I cooked a roast dinner and washed up, single tracks take less but I have to keep returning to the computer every ten minutes so can't really crack on with anything else while I leave it running off that makes sense
    What spec of PC are you using? I can export a track in under a minute - something doesn't quite sound right.
    My pump-action drivel gun is smoking hot today!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    Hi all. So apart from there being too much reverb, my vocals being boring and the cymbal being too loud on "Wait" (Not quite sure why it went so loud, it wasn't that loud in mixing), may I ask if there's any other feedback you could give me? In particular on the last two tracks (Wait and If) as they are my own songs. Ignore the cover songs if you like as they were only filler as I wasn't able to write good enough quick enough to include more of my own.

    So far I've learnt -
    - I need to read up on mixing and fx tracks
    - I might be better doing instrumentals or getting somebody to sing for me (which would also allow me to write easier as I'd be writing for a more flexible vocal range)
    - Not to bother sharing with friends and family as they either won't bother listening to it (family), or will just say "yeah cool" (friends).
    - That my guitar recording set up needs resolving, I could not record direct through usb from the Digitech GSP1101 as there's a fizzing noise using this method, and plugging it into another interface adds hassle, adds cables to trip over, and loses the ability to do stereo (the whole reason I wanted to use the GSP in the first place)
    - my laptop is old and takes too long to export things.

    Thanks

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • flying_pieflying_pie Frets: 429
    Don't stop trying vocals. Of course you can write for others but your voice will get better with the right practice. Look up videos on how to sing with mix voice and breathing support. You have more range than you think (I listened back to your Chris Cornell cover and you comfortably hit an Ab - that's a very high note for most men). Okay, with all the lessons in the world you'll never sing that like Dio or Pavarotti but with practice you can learn to develop your upper register and make it more useful, even if its just to do guide vocals for someone else.
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    I can hit the odd note in isolation that's high yeah but I can't sustain that register without it sounding like I'm imitating a small child's high voice haha. The range for the garagey rock stuff I like (I think, will check my notes later) tends to be up to the B above that G#/Ab, down to the A the octave below. Plus it requires more rough edges than I'm able to produce! I can sometimes do Strokes vocals as long as there aren't any gutsy bits where the voice breaks up a bit, I can't do that at all. I don't think lessons or tutorials would really add that in, I don't have another gear to shift to in order to add any intensity

    There's also the argument that a fairly polite sounding Black Country chap trying to do that style of music, especially with a bit of blues in there, would sound utterly absurd ;)

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • ModellistaModellista Frets: 900
    The vocals on Wild Fire remind me very much of Lou Reed, that half-spoken, half-sung delivery.  I rather like it.  Yes, there's the occasional slight flat spot but nothing too drastic, and anyway it adds character.  As pointed out above, loads of famous singers have more personality than technique and it's done them no harm at all.  So definitely don't stop singing. 

    Knowing you're not American but have a strongly accented delivery would probably be my only negative, but that's just my personal bugbear.  I wish English people would sing in an English accent more.  It would let more personality through. 

    If - I really like the doubled vocals.  Very reminiscent of Brian Protheroe who used a lot of double tracking, and your voice sounds similar.  I wonder if the arrangements could perhaps be a bit more adventurous.  The best arrangers pack a lot of movement into their songs - chorus within the first minute, big shift two minutes in, three acts, reprise or devation at the end, that sort of thing.  Obviously there's no rule book and they may be meant to be more stream-of-consciousness arrangements, but packing in more movement might be something to work on for the future.

    But overall I enjoyed the stuff, there's a lot of off-kilter personality on show!
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324
    @modellista Thanks dude, some very kind words in there.

    Not heard of the double tracking man so I'll give him a listen on Spotify on the way home. I did If and Wild Fire double tracking manually rather than just copy-and-pasting with a slight delay and panning, ie I sang it twice, the second time trying to follow the first as much as possible which was interesting. There's a lot of that on Jack White songs with vocals and guitars so wanted to try that out.

    Re the accent - I think I did go a bit American on Wild Fire in particular but mainly because I know the Laura Marling original version too well and she does it too! Likewise with the Lou Reed vibe on that, that's why I nicked the Wild Side bassline for it as my little joke. It is difficult to consciously change an unconsciously used accent I think, I will give it a go though. Would be interesting to find some good examples of singing in an English accent that I could get the gist from, as I am a bit of a mimic in general so need a reference point to start with most of the time. I often find it just as cringe worthy to hear an overly twee (or strong regional accented) English vocal as a fake mid-Atlantic type voice. Arctic Monkeys, Maximo Park or any English musical theatre song ever spring to mind in particular. Only person I can think of that sounds unmistakeably English and still sounds good in the styles I like is Pete Doherty (though appreciate that's not for everybody!). Laura Marling does sometimes but switches between that and the mid-Atlantic thing a lot, but she has the voice to pull it off.

    Lou Reed, Jack White and Paul McCartney are very much the holy trinity for me influence-wise. It's the Reed and White influence (and my lack of concentration) that lead to the stream of consciousness thing. I think though my next project will likely be the "back to basics" approach I failed to act upon for the last fretboard challenge.

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 7296
    Feeling a bit brain dead but got these on. That big reverb isn’t on everything, I think it’s a bit overplayed in the comments. Your vocals seem at their best when you are most relaxed such as on If ( disappointingly not a cover of the Tele Savalas song ) and there are some great bass lines. A lot of the drum programming doesn’t work well for me but it may well have been what you were going for so whaddaIknow. 

    -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.

    I’m okay with mid Atlantic accents  but I guess to hear English accents I tend to think of folk oriented musicians, like RT here:

    https://youtu.be/j0kJdrfzjAg

    I was trying to decide what accent Scott Matthews sings with, he’s a contemporary kinda folk, indie, singer songwriter ish chap from Wolverhampton. He’s been with a band when I’ve seen him live but Youtube was pulling up more of the folk ballad stuff: 

    https://youtu.be/nqwP9Y99668

    I was trying to think of famous Brummie singers but I’m not sure you could pull off an Ozzy Osbourne or Joan Armatrading impression. Dave Wakeling of The Beat is the closest I could think of as someone who still sings in Brummie.

    https://youtu.be/Z_Ti1VYUNIs



    Dum dum dum, dum dum de dum, dum dum dum, dum dummmm.
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 17381
    Hi all. So apart from there being too much reverb, my vocals being boring and the cymbal being too loud on "Wait" (Not quite sure why it went so loud, it wasn't that loud in mixing), may I ask if there's any other feedback you could give me? In particular on the last two tracks (Wait and If) as they are my own songs. Ignore the cover songs if you like as they were only filler as I wasn't able to write good enough quick enough to include more of my own.

    So far I've learnt -
    - I need to read up on mixing and fx tracks
    - I might be better doing instrumentals or getting somebody to sing for me (which would also allow me to write easier as I'd be writing for a more flexible vocal range)
    - Not to bother sharing with friends and family as they either won't bother listening to it (family), or will just say "yeah cool" (friends).
    - That my guitar recording set up needs resolving, I could not record direct through usb from the Digitech GSP1101 as there's a fizzing noise using this method, and plugging it into another interface adds hassle, adds cables to trip over, and loses the ability to do stereo (the whole reason I wanted to use the GSP in the first place)
    - my laptop is old and takes too long to export things.

    Thanks

    You don't need expensive kit. I'm running on a 12 year old Dell PC that runs Cubase just fine. Forumite @steamabacus is, I believe, still on a Win XP computer running Cubase VST. In music tech terms it's just up from the steam age. He records some excellent stuff for the various challenges which proves you don't need to shell out thousands on hardware to get decent results.

    Singing is about confidence and attitude. Don't give up or fall for the “the curse of perfectionism”. It's a phrase coined by researchers at Bath University to describe a fear of failure brought on by the internet and social media in which people inhabit a digital world awash with perfection - airbrushed images, poor singing masked with tools like Melodyne, skinny people with honed bodies and hot sex lives .. etc ..  ;-)



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  • horsehorse Frets: 583
    I think the tracks sound decent and the originals are good interesting songs.

    On the reverb, from the comments I was expecting it to be more extreme than it is. In my view it depends how mainstream you are aiming to be - if cool quirky indie is the aim then I'd say do what sounds right to your ears and don't worry about it - there's plenty of reverb on the first Great Lake Swimmers album, or say Camera Obscuras ''lloyd, I'm ready to be heartbroken'. 

    It's useful to be aware that you are fairly heavy on the reverb if you hadn't realised, but beyond that I'd make your own aesthetic choices unless you're aiming for mainstream radio airplay. That being said I do tend to pile on too much reverb myself...

    The other thing which occurred to me is the stylistic difference between the tracks in arrangement and vocal style  - it sounded to me like I could be listening to different artists across the tracks. Again, I'm in a similar boat with some tracks I'm working on myself, and I'm not sure whether it's something I want to bring more consistency to or not yet.

    Anyhow, I thought the tracks sounded cool in a slightly arty indie way.
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 3324

    Thank you all very sincerely for your feedback on this, it's been rather interesting. If nothing else, I've learnt not to bother sharing with family or friends as it's more frustrating when you get no feedback from them, people with a disconnect like you chaps have been infinitely more helpful for which I'm grateful. My dad finally admitted to having listened to "a bit of it" last night, but said he didn't bother to listen to all of it because it was boring, morose, and my voice was monotonous. Cheers dad! Amusingly I tried to play it to my partner's mom in our living room on the hifi (and her request becuase she couldn't work the "Cloud Sound Thing") and she got up half way through the second song and returned just as the vocals finished in last song, leaving me sat there with it on thinking...erm ok then...

    Anyway, yes, next steps & responses to the feedbacks above.

    I'll still try to do the stems when I can be bothered to boot up the Perpetual Windows Update Machine, sorry the laptop, so that Mr Spark and Mr TheWeary's son can have a bash at a couple of them when they are bored enough.

    Singing - I've got some youtube tutorials to watch on the train on a bit of voice training, though the one I have watched so far seemed to go against essentially everything I find to be comfortable and effective - said to stand up (I seem to sing better sat down), over pronounce the words (I find unless I mumble I sound like I'm trying to do musical theatre which is not the sound one should want!) and stuff like that. But it's good to listen to the opposite viewpoints to challenge yourself isn't it, and perhaps meet in the middle somewhere. I've tried listening for English accent voices but I'm finding very few that sound good, although having listened to my songs I'm not hearing that much of an American accent except on the cover songs. Still would be keen to hear examples of English accent singers that don't sound naff, might post a thread in the music section as recommendations are usually quite good from here. Let's be clear though I'm never going to sing like a Brummy, not least because I'm not a Brummy, but also regional accents do not work for me in British bands.

    I do like the reverb but I've also got some videos to watch on how to use Cubase (my knowledge is 80% what I learnt in a 2 day music tech course I did at Secondary School, which would have been in about 2002 using Cubasis VST, and 20% me clicking buttons until something works) so hopefully that'll help. I'm not looking for any commercial attention from these, hence why I don't particularly care if the variety of things on there removes any cohesion from the playlist as they were all pretty much experiments to see what I could come up with. Only If and Suarez are in the style I'd personally consider to suit what I like. But as I'm a rookie in terms of writing, singing, recording, and playing parts within arrangements, I don't have a consistent style to follow without basically rehashing White Stripes or Yeah Yeah Yeahs songs..

    My next project will probably be an attempt to do the styles I like - it won't be sent to any friends or family though as I hope to remove that source of frustration going forwards. For this I'll be trying to get somebody else to sing for me, a "hired gun" if you will as my voice is not up to that style. I hear what you guys say about delivery, confidence, etc etc but that will only get you so far and I don't have the right gears in my singing to do it. I'll still try to improve the voice (as I have ZERO technique whatsoever) but not for the purposes of creating the style of music I want to do. It's not a curse of perfectionism I don't think, it's just like not using a fork to eat a broth.

    Re the tech issues, I know it's possible to run these things on basic set ups, but I think personally that's based on chance of stumbling across a set up that works. My system doesn't work consistently, but I'm not in a position where I have the time and money to take punt after punt on old computers until one of them works for me unfortunately. So I'll have to stick with what I have and just stop working as and when I encounter issues rather than getting annoyed with them.

    Thank you all again for taking the time to listen and offer your thoughts. I'll be removing the songs from the public domain (ie from Soundcloud) at the end of this month, never to resurface again as a whole in all likelihood (though one song may resurface if it fits with my next project).


    Cheers all

    Water, come drown me, I'm done

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