Anyone else agree Terminator 3 ruined the series

Rayza1983

Stupid comedy (Talk to the hand etc) , lack of good story, copy and pasted ideas from Terminator 2. I mean where's the original Terminator music? The intense music that builds up the tension. I so wish James Cameron had directed it. Could of ended it as an amazing trilogy. Bah

darthed1981

There are two great Terminator films, and three bad ones.

Geniyasysysys is so bad it's almost a "so bad it's good" movie.

Three does get some bonus points for its ending.  I'm still not sure what Salvation was all about.

TheMarlin

It stacks up better than any Star Wars film outside the original trilogy. 
Between Lucas and Disney, they’ve take a big dump on those movies. 

octatonic

I only really love the first one.

T2 was a mass market CGI-fest, although Linda Hamilton was pretty great in it.
T3- ugh- would rather they didn't bother with that.

Haven't seen anything since.

MrTurnip's

Yeah it did although I didn't mind salvation.. Hoping we get one more really good one

munckee

I liked one, can't remember where 2 stops and 3 starts, quite liked salvation, I liked genisys if its the one I think, is that where John Connor is the terminator?

Winny_Pooh

It wasn't done by Cameron (concept, script, direction for T1 & T2) so it's to be expected. Besides T2 resolved the whole series so no sequel should have been possible.

It's a stupid load of shite.

darthed1981

munckee said:

I liked one, can't remember where 2 stops and 3 starts, quite liked salvation, I liked genisys if its the one I think, is that where John Connor is the terminator?

Yup, it's actually quite dumb fun.

crunchman

I've only seen 1 and 2.  Not planning to watch the others.

Likewise, I have only seen the first Matrix film and am not planning to watch the others.

munckee

crunchman said:

I've only seen 1 and 2.  Not planning to watch the others.

Likewise, I have only seen the first Matrix film and am not planning to watch the others.

Controversially I quite like the other 2 matrices, not as good as the promise of the first but the whole story is clever I think

Cols

It certainly was the start of a slippery slope.  I skipped Salvation as any film directed by McG makes me want to stab my own eyes out.  Genysis was woeful - all it did was remind me how much better The Terminator and T2 were than it.  It’s a sign of how bad it was when I can truthfully say that, of all the actors in the film, Schwarzenegger delivered the most subtle and nuanced performance.

boogieman

1 was excellent. A clever idea well realised.

 2 was almost as good, but had inevitably lost the shock value of the first film. 

The rest are just turgid rehashes of the original, dumbed down to get a 12 certificate. The one with Sam The Plank Worthington is the worst of the bunch. 

Musicman20

T1 and T2 were awesome. As was the Universal Studios experience in Orlando. I watched the rest purely because they followed on. 

ICBM

Rayza1983 said:

Anyone else agree Terminator 3 ruined the series

No.

Terminator 2 ruined the series.

Cols

ICBM said:

Rayza1983 said:

Anyone else agree Terminator 3 ruined the series

No.

Terminator 2 ruined the series.

Burn the heretic!

Fretwired

ICBM said:

Rayza1983 said:

Anyone else agree Terminator 3 ruined the series

No.

Terminator 2 ruined the series.

T2 was the best film in the series.

The good news is Cameron gets the film rights back next year. He has a script and he's going to direct a new film .. the old cast (Arnie and Linda) are reuniting to pass on the torch and he has a new lead and will move the franchise into a new era. He's dumping all backstory from T3 onwards.  Sounds interesting.

Philly_Q

Fretwired said:

The good news is Cameron gets the film rights back next year. He has a script and he's going to direct a new film .. the old cast (Arnie and Linda) are reuniting to pass on the torch and he has a new lead and will move the franchise into a new era. He's dumping all backstory from T3 onwards.  Sounds interesting.

How's he going to fit it in with his infinite sequence of no-one-cares-anymore Avatar sequels?  It could be Cameron's Chinese Democracy.

Teetonetal

ICBM said:

Rayza1983 said:

Anyone else agree Terminator 3 ruined the series

No.

Terminator 2 ruined the series.

Absolutely.
T1 was where it should have stopped.

axisus

T2 didn't ruin the series as it was a good film, but what it did do was devalue the first film - which is a crime in my eyes!

Same with Aliens 2.

Both damaged the original concept.

Teetonetal

axisus said:

T2 didn't ruin the series as it was a good film, but what it did do was devalue the first film - which is a crime in my eyes!

Same with Aliens 2.

Both damaged the original concept.

Yup agree with that. Not a bad film, but ruined the original concept and therefore the series.

darthed1981

axisus said:

T2 didn't ruin the series as it was a good film, but what it did do was devalue the first film - which is a crime in my eyes!

Same with Aliens 2.

Both damaged the original concept.

That's almost an issue with sequels.  You either retread the original and get bashed, or try something new and get bashed for the direction you chose.  That's why they get judged on financial terms (well that and that's why they are made), you can't please all of the people all of the time.

Alien and T1 are both survival horror films.  You couldn't have made identical sequels, so in both cases James Cameron went "full-on action" with fairly spectacular results.  Neither franchise has made a great movie since.  You can argue that some of them are OK, but that's it.

Sequels are a huge part of Hollywood, and when they strike gold, like Marvel did, the returns are enormous. That's why they keep trying to relaunch these franchises.

Terminator Geniyasysysys actually had a decent concept behind it, but the execution was very lacking.  I remember seeing the scene where Arnold goes "sometimes some people can remember different timelines" and thinking, well of course you can, because it's the only way the story you wrote out works. 

They agreed a concept for a trilogy of films, and budgeted for set pieces, then wrote a script for the first film to fit those two things.  The guy who said "what if we write characters, explain their motivations and have story developments flow from there..." got sacked, probably.

The other problem is a rush to finish and incorporate studio notes. There is probably a good cut of Suicide Squad lurking in the material they actually shot, but it was edited together like a music video and not a film, and is almost unwatchable more than once. 

Seriously, scenes like Viola Davis going "we were lucky with Superman, he shared our values" followed half an hour later by her shooting all her staff for no reason at all...  well he didn't share your values did he?  That's one result of shooting at least two different movies and sticking them together, one scene is from a cut where her character was written as the villain.  Very clearly at one stage the Joker was written as the villain, etc. etc.  They cocked up at the last hurdle.

Point being, a Suicide Squad movie is a good idea, and it was well cast, but it still failed to be any good.  Hollywood has a low hit rate with original or newly adapted concepts and they know it, so when they get one they go a bit mad.