Upgrading from a Zoom G3X

chickenchaser

I've had a Zoom G3x for a couple of years now, bought it to run alongside my THR10c for home use. Playing the Zoom through the Aux of the 10c, I still marginally prefer the THR tone for clean to mid gain stuff. 

I usually set the G3 up with a boost or TS, amp on clean or break up and then with reverb and the Air patch. I might add a delay, tremelo or chorus but generally thats it. 

I've been gassing for a Helix LT but i'm not sure if that's total overkill, and wondered if I'd be put off by just constantly messing about with editing patches rather than playing. 

I like the fact that the zoom has a looper, although it could do with being longer, and with a save option. I like the fact the zoom comes with simple rhythms rather than just a metronome. I also find it fairly easy to dial a sound in now that I've got the factory presets turned down from what they were on my custom patches. It also accepts audio into the unit via USB so its easy to jam along to stuff by connecting a laptop or even a phone. 

What I dont like about the zoom is the need to scroll through the footswitches in the patch (only 3 windows), and I think that the amp sims and overall tone could be better (as the THR demonstrates) 

I play through headphones and will be buying FRFR/monitors if continuing down this route. I'm strictly a home player but do like good tone to inspire me. 

I think the new Zooms seem to be a bit of a retrograde step, so looking at the other options out there and was curious as to where others have gone along a similar path. 

sweepy

You could always try a Digitech GSP1101

chickenchaser

sweepy said:

You could always try a Digitech GSP1101

Rack? I'm looking for a pedal based solution. 

I've just decided to go for a Vox Adio Air, although thats an all in one. Ideally I'd get an amp modelling pedal unit which I can use alternatively with looper etc. 

Alnico

My GT100 is still the best effects solution I've ever had.
Cost £350 new last year and it's going nowhere, I love it.

I use it in 4cm plus MIDI with a 100w Katana head. The on screen PC editor (Tone Studio) is dead easy to use and there's a world of adjustment with everything. It's a really useable and flexible unit that's built like a tank and big enough to not feel cramped. The switches are all good quality and nothing has ever let me down.

Honestly it's one of the best pieces of gear I've ever bought.

duotone

@Alnico ;

Was always intrigued by the EZ TONE feature.  I thought it looked very useful.  

Do you bother using it?

Alnico

duotone said:

@Alnico ;;;;;;;;

Was always intrigued by the EZ TONE feature.  I thought it looked very useful.  

Do you bother using it?

Never.
Using Tone Studio on the PC is so easy it's almost redundant to me.

That's not to say it's not useable it probably is but once you see TS in action it's quite simply just like looking at normal controls.

TL;DR - The GT is a great solution for home or live playing. I've never recorded direct so I can't tell you whether it's good or not. For playing live and home use, for the money it's 50 - 60% of a Helix and will be great for a 1st 'Big' Muti-FX or as a budget solution.

An in-depth explanation, as best I can;

In Tone Studio, every parameter can be adjusted using the rotary controls which,  if your mouse doesn't have a scroll wheel can be hit and miss but Boss have included a slider function which will act on every adjustable parameter, all you have to do is click on the parameter you want and then adjust using the slider. *That* is absolutely perfect to use.

You can also drag and drop everything where you want it in the signal chain. Everything!

It will operate with two signal chains that split and then mix back together or leave it split and output in stereo, there are more amps and effects than I could ever wish for and they all sound great playing live.

I can't comment on recording because I know FA about that and I've never used it that way.
I've heard the odd few negative things about COSM modelling and this *is* the previous "Gen" compared with what's out there now so I'm not saying it will compete in all areas with a Helix.

What I will say is if a Helix feels like overkill or if you're just looking for a solid, reliable, simple unit that has lots to offer, it's a great choice and in 90% of live situations you won't hear anything bad from the COSM modelling that anyone will care about, it sounds great at gig volume.

Nothing is stopping you using this as FX only and for that it's absolutely great quality sounds.

As always factory preset patches aren't great but they can be if you tweak them to suit your guitar and amp. I found it was the EQ on each patch that's not set very well but then what would Boss set it to so that it sounds good on every guitar and amp?
It needs some time putting in to sound good and Helix is no different in that respect. 

I've never seen it as "Option Paralysis" I simply see it as "Lots of options without spending thousands on pedals" but I can set up a simple patch in just a few minutes so it's only as complicated as you want to make it.

If your priority is ultra quick and easy, buy pedals and don't go for this or anything like it.

If you've got time and some small amount of patience and you want something with a Toys R Us style UI  (User Interface) that sounds like a really great board full of pedals 90% of the time and is a joy to operate, use and store away then something like this is ideal.

Similarly, if you want to get most of the experience of Helix but you can't stretch to one in terms of money or it's your first go at a big multi fx and you're not sure about dropping a huge amount of money on one, I'd say this is ideal.

Real world restrictions are:

No XLR outs. (Use a DI box.)

Only 1 FX loop which is taken up by using it in 4 cable mode. (Put pedals before or after the GT or its FX loop depending on what they are, as you would with any normal pedal board.)

It's big. I personally love that, others don't. 

That's it really.

For the money, especially used, they're a bargain and a massive step up from the Zoom platform.

I buy patches from a place called Boss Tone Garage for a very reasonable price. The guy emails them and I load that file straight into the GT.

Not only does he make really great patches for specific artists but I can then study what he's done by looking at all the settings and learning from it.

I spend £10 every Friday buying 3 Artist Packs for £9.99.

For every 10 packs, I get one free.

There are 6 specific song patches in every pack so 18 song patches every weekend for £9.99 that I can store in the Librarian side of TS and load up as I want to. This means I don't clog the unit up and take up any of the user patches that I don't need to. I can save and load them as "Set lists" from the Librarian side of the TS Editor into the actual patch locations.

So far I've got:

Pink Floyd Vol 1 and 2

Iron Maiden Vol 1 and 2

Pantera

Thin Lizzy

They all sound amazing to me and the only thing I've had to minutely adjust was the presence level to fine tune each one to the preferred guitar.

That guy's name is Robert Redfern.

https://www.tonegarage.co.uk/

If anyone is near Liverpool and would like a Coffee and look around a GT100, get in touch.

QED.

TheBigDipper

I've had a GT-100 for about 6 months now and mainly use it as a MFX in 4CM, don't use the COSM preamp effects block and let my amp be the amp. I'm getting good sounds out of it and don't have any plans to upgrade to the GT-1000 or anything else, for that matter. It also records well using the COSM preamp effects block.

It's not good at being a MIDI controller to any other MIDI controlled devices you might have. So, when you change patches, your flexibility to send the right MIDI commands to other devices is limited. That's not a concern for me. 

The twin screen system works very well and you can programme the unit without needing to have a computer attached if you want to. The Boss Tone Studio software is good, though.

I agree with @Alnico that this is a great starting MFX unit if you want to find out if you want to be in the MFX game and it might turn out to be all you actually need (even if it's not all you want). 

duotone

Great reply, cheers @Alnico ;

£10 for 18 presets sounds decent value & then you have the time that week to use/learn them.

Alnico

duotone said:

Great reply, cheers @Alnico ;

£10 for 18 presets sounds decent value & then you have the time that week to use/learn them.

Absolutely that but to me, part of the real value is in the learning.

Rob knows a lot about this unit and he knows how to get the best from it, so to see what he's done and take notes adds a lot of value to the purchase (for me) and helps me to understand not only the unit itself but also my general knowledge about signal chains, the placement of effects and how they interact.

Even if I had Helix money, I'd be more than reluctant to get rid of this and I'm not a fan of the new, miniaturised GT1000 so for the foreseeable future this is staying and it's universally loved.

Forgot to mention it's absolutely stunning with headphones plugged in and as an insomnia distraction/cure it's also pretty much priceless to me.

As a useful bit of info, the power supply is a standard boss plug, 9v / 2.0 amp (2,000 mah)

I'm going to get a THON flight case for this soon.

Alnico

Probably worth mentioning again that Tone Studio has a 'Librarian' side that can store what they call "Set Lists".

The patches I buy can be stored as such and dragged over to the "User Preset Patches" as and when I like so it's not like you clog those up and then run out of space. Simply hook up to the PC, load up your set lists into whatever banks and patch numbers you want them in and store.

They remain in Librarian all the time so when you load other stuff in and overwrite those patches, you can still go back to what you had dead easily.

Each patch can be tweaked about and if you get a bit lost, just don't store what you've done, switch to another patch and then back again and you're back to your original settings. However, if you do change the settings, what's stored in Librarian WON'T change and you need to put the new patch back either in place of the old one in the set list or save it as a  tweaked copy in Librarian. Think of Librarian as a Depository, or indeed, a Library.

Ultimately if you've gone the route of buying patches, they remain in your email as attachments and can be reloaded again and again so your money isn't wasted at any time.

I love this flexibility and that's a big part of why I'm keeping mine but I'm very sure the GT1000 does this and lots more.

It's as always down to what you want from it in terms of performance and what you want to spend.

Alnico

Sorry to keep banging on here but other "Bits" keep occurring to me...

In Librarian you can use the "MEMO" function to make notes on each patch saved there so when you're loading and unloading patches or complete setlists, you can refer to notes which are written directly under each patch name, so for example, if you've tweaked one patch to alter the EQ for 2 different guitars but all the rest of the settings are the same, you can make a note of that right on the screen, in the patch and see it immediately to stop you from loading the wrong one. This is a very useful feature when you really start using the Librarian software.

To answer a seemingly obvious question but I will anyway, all patches stored in LIbrarian are actually stored on your PC in Tone Studio. That's how it doesn't clog up the user presets in the machine itself.

All stored user presets are in the machine so you do NOT need to take your laptop to a gig however I do, just in case.

As a complete aside, you can edit the sounds in a live context so if you really wanted to, you *could* have your mate sat at the laptop and have him alter your sound dynamically as you play.

You can also set the phrase looper to "Edit Mode" and use it to record a clean phrase as the first thing in the signal chain, then put your guitar down and use that to play to hearts content adding or taking away effects/amps and altering settings. This is a hugely useful function. Switching back out of "Edit Mode" puts the looper back into its normal state.

Possibly my ONLY gripe with this unit is the ease of use on the looper. It's a bit clunky to actually use with double taps here, start and stop and then you realise there is NO UNDO function. It is a basic looper and if you're going to use it live, remember that. It's caught me out a few times.

You can also assign the treadle away from wah and volume and assign it to alter a certain parameter like Drive, Delay time, Rate, Depth etc.

The onboard tuner is excellent. and uses both of the big screens on the machine when not hooked up to the PC.

In Tone Studio, it dominates the PC screen whilst it's on and is an excellent display and perfectly accurate.

I don't bother with a clip-on tuner anymore at all.

If you plug a control pedal into the CTRL port you can assign it to do anything. I use a Boss FS-5L (Latching). A momentary switch is available (FS - 5) and so is a Dual switch (FS-6L / FS-6) so you can have 2 extra footswitches, both fully assignable for almost anything.

One function I like is to assign an external CTRL switch as a shortcut to the onboard tuner so I can get that with one button press, instead of pressing footswitches 1 and 2 together to get there and back out of it. The dual switch could use one for the tuner and one for an extra function...

If you have a 2 channel amp, there's also an Amp CTRL port to switch amp channels for you as part of a saved patch.

All the above is using it in preset mode. You can of course use this unit in "Stompbox Mode" if you wish

This is far from a Toy!

chickenchaser

wow @Alnico so much content! 

I'm not ruling out buying another multi fx,I've bought the Adio to A/B against my THR10c and decide which to keep. Its the option I can go to if I just want to plug in, hit a preset and get the most out of practice time. The G3x currently bridges the gap when I want a bit more, to use the looper and to use the stomps and multi fx with either backing tracks or music played in through the USB. Its this area that I'd like to improve on tone and to get something without digital fizz (although I do think I have dialled a lot of it out of the Zoom with adjustments). I'm also just starting to use recording tools so to have so many tones and options at my fingertips is inspiring. 

Im planning on visiting some of the bigger music stores over the next month to try out these in person and make a decision but i'll certainly digest what you've provided and see if it ticks all of my boxes. The boss option is certainly on my list now. 

Alnico

@chickenchaser ;
No problem man, just thought it's worth typing it all out since I'd already started and try to answer most FAQ's before they happen.

I've just got a Zoom Q2n recorder so I might try to put together a video on the GT100. 
It could serve me as a vehicle for learning video editing as well.

I doubt this will be a quick thing but it's worth me trying to do.

To be continued. ...