Tiny amps

funstuie

the 1watt marshall 50th aniversary amps are flipping loud at 1 watt. 0.5 watt they are still loud. 

I had an amp built for me which has power scaling - goes from 0.25 watts to 8 watts. It's lovely and even at the lowest level sounds great. 

Phil_aka_Pip

I've used my GA5 in the Stowmarket Regal, and it's loud enough without micing it up. For applications with no acoustic drums, or in situations where rock'n'roll guitar levels are neither expected nor appreciated, 5W is plenty.

AlanP

To be twice as loud you need 4 times the power (ignoring for the moment the amount of distortion you might be prepared to put up with).

To be twice as loud as 5W you need 20W.

To be twice as loud as 20W you need 80W.

So 5W always seems a lot louder than you might imagine...

midiglitch

It rally depends on the voicing, and how clean you want to run the amp.  And the speaker sensitivity.

An amp like the tiny terror, which is very focused in the mids (where your hearing is most sensitive), and overdriven very early on seems very loud.  Loud enough to gig with if you need that particular sound.  But try running it truly clean and you find it's actually very quiet.  

As a result it's not much use for running pedals into, particularly delays, reverbs or big muffs.  Small amps therefore tend to be one trick ponies.  If you like that trick they can be great, particularly for recording, but in a live environment you've got nowhere left to go and that could be a problem for some.

The other thing of course, is that if your whole plan is to get a small amp so that you can get the overdrive from the power amp (not making any judgements about that principle here) then there is only a narrow window of volume for which that is going to be effective.  That is generally not very useful live.

So, on the whole, too loud for home use, not versatile enough for live use and very much one trick ponies means that the best application for these amps almost always ends up being for recording.

underdog

funstuie;209656" said:

the 1watt marshall 50th aniversary amps are flipping loud at 1 watt. 0.5 watt they are still loud. 

I had an amp built for me which has power scaling - goes from 0.25 watts to 8 watts. It's lovely and even at the lowest level sounds great. 

Who made the amp and how much if you don't mind me asking?

Phil_aka_Pip

AlanP said:

To be twice as loud you need 4 times the power (ignoring for the moment the amount of distortion you might be prepared to put up with).

To be twice as loud as 5W you need 20W.

To be twice as loud as 20W you need 80W.

So 5W always seems a lot louder than you might imagine...

I always thought for twice the spl you needed 10 x the o/p. I bet @ICBM knows

ICBM

Phil_aka_Pip said:

AlanP said:

To be twice as loud you need 4 times the power (ignoring for the moment the amount of distortion you might be prepared to put up with).

To be twice as loud as 5W you need 20W.

To be twice as loud as 20W you need 80W.

So 5W always seems a lot louder than you might imagine...

I always thought for twice the spl you needed 10 x the o/p. I bet @ICBM knows

In theory, yes - 10 times the power gives 10dB (one Bel) more spl - but that doesn't seem to be how it sounds in practice. If you play a 10W amp and a 100W amp though the same speakers in a big cab like a 4x12", the 100W amp is *way* more than twice as loud, even though the 10-watter is louder than most people would expect. Through a small speaker it's closer - if you can find a small speaker that will take 100W - but that may be because thermal compression and cabinet volume limit the volume with the big amp.

I would say AlanP's four times is closer to the perceived reality, whatever the theory says.

A cranked 10W amp through a good efficient cab is loud. A cranked 100W amp through the same sort of cab is extremely, frighteningly loud, not just 'twice as loud'.

funstuie

underdog;209772" said:

[quote="funstuie;209656"]the 1watt marshall 50th aniversary amps are flipping loud at 1 watt. 0.5 watt they are still loud. 

I had an amp built for me which has power scaling - goes from 0.25 watts to 8 watts. It's lovely and even at the lowest level sounds great. 

Who made the amp and how much if you don't mind me asking?
[/quote]

Phaez based out of Canada. I work for a company with offices all across the US so shipping was not a factor for me (got it shipped to a US office and a colleague fedexed it internal to me). So I paid about £280 for the amp and I am having a combo cab built here for £200.

Its a sweet one of a kind amp (AFD for home use).

I probably could get a nice hand made amp here in the uk but I have a mate in the US who had a phaez amp and when I tried it I just have to get one.

And I just bought a Cornell plexi 7 today. I need to stop buying amps.

underdog

That amp does sound very interesting off to Google I go.

underdog

Ok been to Google, that amp could be perfect
Off to fire some emails to them.

@funstuie I notice from old posts you have or had an SL5, what do you think of it? How does it compare to the phaez amp, particularly at sensible volumes?

underdog

Still can't decide on an amp.

Got down to one of 3 choices.

Phaez AFD 8watt sounds great from the clips, but I've seen the build quality come in to question at various places online, also I'd have to order it from Canada get it sent to the US to have it put in to a cab and then shipped to me. Even then add a couple of valves when it gets here.

Marshall jcm1 looks good, sounds like an 80s Marshall (which I like) expensive for what it is

Marshall SL5 again has plenty of classic Marshall sounds, readily available but only comes as a combo.

Then the last couple of days I took an alternative view and thought about an iPad.

funstuie

Why not get the Marshall dsl5c? Its very similar to the sl5.

The phaez is a great amp but I only ordered it as I have a free shipping option from the US and I have a great cab builder contact. Also phaez will build you any amp you want - you want a 5 watt afd he will build it. You want a 1 watt switchable afd he will build it etc. Mine is switchable and has an effects loop. But it took a while to build and get here. The quality is top notch in my opinion.

underdog

Well, for now, the search is over. Picked up a not so (physically) tiny blackstar ht5. Really happy with the bang per pound ratio, sounds nice even at whisper volumes, it's a lot of amp for little cash.

So, as with all GAS, here's a pic as proof

rossi

You need a Yamaha THR10 .Any valve amp played through large speakers will sound too loud but the Yam has HiFi technology speakers that are tiny but sound full .I love mine .You can also play it through any PA system or MP£ type input on amps

underdog

Too late, see post above

Really please with it even at "won't wake the 3 year old in bed" volumes. Oh and apparently it's a limited colour?

rossi

woops sorry .I had an HT5 .Its fine at low volumes but not that low .

underdog

I've run it as low as I need (in in basement of 3 stories so it's not too quiet) and am happy. I got pocket pod for virtually silent playing.

imalone

ICBM said:

Phil_aka_Pip said:

AlanP said:

To be twice as loud you need 4 times the power (ignoring for the moment the amount of distortion you might be prepared to put up with).

To be twice as loud as 5W you need 20W.

To be twice as loud as 20W you need 80W.

So 5W always seems a lot louder than you might imagine...

I always thought for twice the spl you needed 10 x the o/p. I bet @ICBM knows

In theory, yes - 10 times the power gives 10dB (one Bel) more spl - but that doesn't seem to be how it sounds in practice. If you play a 10W amp and a 100W amp though the same speakers in a big cab like a 4x12", the 100W amp is *way* more than twice as loud, even though the 10-watter is louder than most people would expect. Through a small speaker it's closer - if you can find a small speaker that will take 100W - but that may be because thermal compression and cabinet volume limit the volume with the big amp.

I would say AlanP's four times is closer to the perceived reality, whatever the theory says.

A cranked 10W amp through a good efficient cab is loud. A cranked 100W amp through the same sort of cab is extremely, frighteningly loud, not just 'twice as loud'.

I think coverage must be a factor, perceived loudness is supposed to be logarithmic, but increase the power ten times and you get the same SPL out to somewhere between three and ten times as far (probably acoustics of the space are a factor, in an enclosed space I suspect you do better than quadratic).

Mark_R

congrats underdog on the HT5, I tried it out and it is so loud, a little too loud for in house use!  I did own a Blackhart 5w amp that was way louder than I ever expected, sold that and bought the HT1RH in the end so I can crank up the valves without shaking the foundations!

Blackstar are great amps for the money.  Be nicer if they were made in the UK.

underdog

I have no problem playing the ht5 quiet (really quiet) I gave it shot last night, I almost went for the ht1 myself but this one came up on eBay and I liked the colour

Now I think it's going to start pedal gas as normally I play through a pod and have a touch of delay etc so now I need that