Flipping

richardhomer

TINMAN82 said:

Split with the original owner?! Just not grounded in reality. Once cash has been handed over, the buyer has no responsibility whatsoever to the original seller. Why should they make their intentions known if they decide to sell it on quickly?

There’s nothing legally fraudulent in this whatsover. The seller ultimately decides the selling price, full stop. If they unwittingly undersell it’s on them, lesson learned. If they are foolish enough to accept less on the back of a sob story from a stranger, it’s also on them (haggling is not illegal). If they consciously decide to accept less for a quicker sale, it’s also their decision. They have no further stake in the item purchased whatsover.

Funnily enough - someone who bought something off me on here did exactly what I was advocating. Don’t judge everyone, based on your own morals....

proggy

Someone did this to me on Basschat, it really pissed me off.

I only let him have the bass cheap because I thought I was helping him out.

He put it up for sale the next day, for almost double.

Roland

carlos said:

Reminder that this is a collector and wall displayer forum first and a musician's forum second. 

Speak for yourself

leerocker

Philly_Q said:

leerocker said:

Philly_Q said:

leerocker said:

I think a few people on here will attest that i am certainly not a dealer and an absolute gear head who loses more money on gear than anyone on this forum

Ooh, I dunno, I've managed to lose quite a bit over the years....

i worked out i have lost about 4 grand already this year!

I must concede you're well ahead of me on current form, then!    It's been a few years since I've sold anything.

Yep it was mainly amps , bought a couple of friedmans which i lost a grand on each of them, few guitars i bought new and sold at a massive loss when i quit my main band and had no need for them, Swings and roundabouts i suppose and its just the name of the game , i could have pissed a lot more up the wall if i went out on the razz every weekend so at least i get some of it back when it is time to let them go!

AlexC

carlos said:

AlexC said:

Bottom line - guitars are commodities or objects of desire to many people. The fact they’re musical instruments built to  be played is secondary to some. There are people who collect stamps or Toby Jugs or thimbles and there are people who collect, swap and sell guitars. Just the way it is.

Reminder that this is a collector and wall displayer forum first and a musician's forum second. 

Fair point. 

Longtallronnie

No one is under any obligation to sell an item for less than they would happily accept. If you accept a lower offer and later find that the buyer has made a profit, that’s your bad luck/poor salesmanship. 
Name and shame? What a pile of horseshit. 

Garthy

DB1 said:

Fair play to you - actually I agree with you, it's your business (apart from the pics thing which could infringe copyright) - but I get you don't give a sob story to get something cheaper do you? Again, absolutely not related to my earlier posts in the the thread.

I think the key is 'transparency' - it's a good deal when both parties end up being happy and, because we're enthusiasts, many of us would like to think that a deal's been done in good faith.

The argument seems to fall into two camps - 1) the folks that think 'it's none of your business what the buyer does with it' and 2) the folks that think that being honest is the right thing to do. 

I think it's 1) and 2) personally.

It's not a marriage proposal!

Longtallronnie

TTony said:

Hattigol said:

And yes, sold on here. Now on Ebay for 30% more.

Unfortunately, there's no indication on your FS thread as to who bought it.  I presume it was all done by PM.

On the one hand, you sold at a price that you were - to some extent - happy to sell.  It was your choice to sell, so you got what you wanted, or would accept.  Whoever bought it, and is now trying to flip it on eBay for profit, now has to deal with the eBay chancers, run the risk of the eBay scammers, and pay the eBay/PP fees.  Hopefully, they're aiming to make a few £hundred to make it worth their while - and if someone is willing to pay the extra on eBay, then so be it.

On the other hand, the flippers really PISS ME OFF.  The Classifieds used to be a benefit-for-the-community.  It was something that was there to be used by people who were using the forum for all of its purposes.  Mates rates were often available, and deals were done on a word, and trust was all around.  That's undermined by flippers.  Nowadays, many people *only* inhabit the Classifieds, either looking to sell-free, or to buy-cheap-and-flip.  

PM me @Hattlgol with the name. 

@TTony I’m not expecting an answer but I’m curious as to what you were planning on doing if the OP pm’d you with a name? 
Maybe I misinterpreted but your post just seemed a little insidious to me. 

John_P

If I get a price I’m happy with then I’m happy to sell.      If I take less than I’d like for a quick sale or to save the hassle of posting then I’m happy as the overall deal made sense.   
Mid the buyer can sell it on without losing out or they make a profit then it’s win win and I’m happy for them - why begrudge someone else’s good fortune if you got a deal your ok with. 


That said I do prefer to avoid bedroom dealers that are actually running a business and pretending to be a private buyer.   I can’t rewlly imagine they would lose many buys if they were upfront about being a dealer.

jeztone2

I sold my RG760 on Ebay for £450 and it was on Ebay a day later for £899. It was bought on a private account and then put up for sale on a business one.

So I just avoid Ebay now. 

FreddieVanHalen

Longtallronnie said:

No one is under any obligation to sell an item for less than they would happily accept. If you accept a lower offer and later find that the buyer has made a profit, that’s your bad luck/poor salesmanship. 
Name and shame? What a pile of horseshit. 

I don’t think it’s horseshit. I’d like to know who the bedroom dealers are.

The view on this seems to be dividing into classifieds for community vs arms length commercial transactions.

Both views are valid I guess but it might be nice to know what the deal is.

Ive sold a guitar on here more cheaply than I might have got on Ebay so it could go back to its original owner.

Was I a mug for doing that? Probably... 

Longtallronnie

FreddieVanHalen said:

Longtallronnie said:

No one is under any obligation to sell an item for less than they would happily accept. If you accept a lower offer and later find that the buyer has made a profit, that’s your bad luck/poor salesmanship. 
Name and shame? What a pile of horseshit. 

I don’t think it’s horseshit. I’d like to know who the bedroom dealers are.

The view on this seems to be dividing into classifieds for community vs arms length commercial transactions.

Both views are valid I guess but it might be nice to know what the deal is.

Ive sold a guitar on here more cheaply than I might have got on Ebay so it could go back to its original owner.

Was I a mug for doing that? Probably... 

I wouldn’t say you were a mug for that at all. As long as you were happy with the deal? 
The OP’s experience wasn’t at the hands of a bedroom dealer and he’s since been on and explained his position quite reasonably. 
I’ve also sold and bought stuff at “mates rates” such is the general spirit of this place but that doesn’t mean I’m going to get pissy if someone gets a better deal out of something I’ve sold them. 

FreddieVanHalen

Longtallronnie said:

FreddieVanHalen said:

Longtallronnie said:

No one is under any obligation to sell an item for less than they would happily accept. If you accept a lower offer and later find that the buyer has made a profit, that’s your bad luck/poor salesmanship. 
Name and shame? What a pile of horseshit. 

I don’t think it’s horseshit. I’d like to know who the bedroom dealers are.

The view on this seems to be dividing into classifieds for community vs arms length commercial transactions.

Both views are valid I guess but it might be nice to know what the deal is.

Ive sold a guitar on here more cheaply than I might have got on Ebay so it could go back to its original owner.

Was I a mug for doing that? Probably... 

I wouldn’t say you were a mug for that at all. As long as you were happy with the deal? 
The OP’s experience wasn’t at the hands of a bedroom dealer and he’s since been on and explained his position quite reasonably. 
I’ve also sold and bought stuff at “mates rates” such is the general spirit of this place but that doesn’t mean I’m going to get pissy if someone gets a better deal out of something I’ve sold them. 

Yep, glad to see both sides of the OP’s deal understanding on this one - Lee is defo not in the bedroom dealer category in my book.

Some of us on here might be mistaken for dealers given the amount we buy and sell and there’s obviously scope for confusion

I’m just jealous that I usually end up losing money on stuff :-)

prowla

Me, I buy (quite a lot) and tend to sell on (quite a lot less); my general rule (or aspiration) is to not lose money on the deals. I've never really just flipped something for a profit, but I have done work/restoration on things and sold them for a bit more than I paid.

mli3

Are threads like these just a way for folk to vent their anger and frustration???  I’ve come back to it after last night and can’t believe the utter drivel on here. 
Seriously folks grow up. You’re big boys (and girls I hope). You sell something that’s it. It’s no longer yours. 
If someone, for whatever reason, wants to undergo the hassle of eBay / gumtree, and all the associated bullshit that comes with it to make a few quid then
a) it’s none of your business 
b) it’s now THEIRS. 
I trade for a living (not guitars!). If I sell something I sell for a price that I’m happy to sell at or am forced to sell at. It’s my choice to accept the trade. That’s the end of it. If it goes up, is offered higher etc sure I’m peeved cos maybe I sold to cheap.. but I did sell and that’s where it ends. 

Now can’t we all just get back to talking about R8’s ?!  

bacchanalian

I think there is a difference between those who are trying to fund a hobby without losing money and dealers who masquerade as private individuals.
To an extent they are seeking to exploit people's natural inclination to be agreeable. Believe or not there are people who might spend £2k on a guitar but do not have the knowledge available here.

Rather than being told the 'It will be going to good home' cobblers,  I would prefer ' I need 40% markup so it is only worth £xxxx to me. Take it or leave it'

Does anyone know if it against eBay policy to have both private and business accounts that are doing the same thing? 

robgilmo

The same thing as in selling stuff? No, I wouldn't have thought so.

bacchanalian

Apologies.
To clarify, using a private account to try to skirt the obligations that a business has is what I mean. 

guitarmangler

It is annoying when you sell to someone at a price in their favour and then in pops up in your eBay saved list days after .
I’ve had this via selling on gumtree ( not on here) and then watched the eBay auction with gritted teeth . Fortunately, the auction finished at £70 less than I sold it for.

I think a lot of the eBay sellers stick guitars on for a crazy price ( like that guy who sells rg560’s) and then let people haggle them down. Probably to a price close to what they bought them for .

robgilmo

Do they have differing obligations when distance selling second hand?