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Adventures in acoustic buying

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  • uncledick said:
    See if you can find any higher end Furch OM guitars near you. Worthwhile trying one out.
    Beat me to it...

    The best I've played under £1500.
    I'll see what's around. They don't seem to have so many dealers these days...
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  • Don’t need a bluegrass guitar nor do I need a Celtic wonder of DADGAD beauty, but if it can handle slack tunings a la Doughty then great. I don’t really like big bodied guitars - I find them too unwieldy.

    I had a Lowden 0-23 for a few years and loved it but it was hopeless with a singer and for strumming for me, plus it was ridiculously huge, so I sold it. I bought a Martin 00-16m as a songwriting guitar in the interim and really love it, great neck, comfy, easy to play, sounds great but caves under pressure and lacks a bit of sparkle. 

    None of them made me buy, but I’m getting closer. I think I fundamentally prefer the Martin sound to Gibson.
    What body size are you after and what is your playing style?  Do you mainly play standing up or sitting down?  Are you a strummer or a fingerpicker?  Do you need a guitar with a thicker neck, do you need one with wide string spacing at the nut/saddle? 

    IMO, there is a significant difference for playability for acoustic body sizes when the lower bout is smaller or larger than an inch, for example Jumbo/Lowden O size 16", Martin Dread/Gibson J-45 - 16", Martin 000/OM - 15", Martin OO - 14". 

    It sounds like you might be after Martin 00-16M with a bit more sparkle in that particular body size, I think the rosewood back and sides of the Martin 00-28 seeming to be an excellent fit but it's £2.7k new.  14 fret 00's are fairly thin on the ground though, the only other rosewood models I can think of under a £1.5k are the Eastman E20SS,  Sigma have a few as well. 

    Under a £1.5k or so, the Furch guitars are excellent.  The Rainbow series are the their modern inspired series, and their Vintage ones are the Martin inspired ones.  They generally come with a 45mm wide nut which may or may not be a good thing for you.
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  • Don’t need a bluegrass guitar nor do I need a Celtic wonder of DADGAD beauty, but if it can handle slack tunings a la Doughty then great. I don’t really like big bodied guitars - I find them too unwieldy.

    I had a Lowden 0-23 for a few years and loved it but it was hopeless with a singer and for strumming for me, plus it was ridiculously huge, so I sold it. I bought a Martin 00-16m as a songwriting guitar in the interim and really love it, great neck, comfy, easy to play, sounds great but caves under pressure and lacks a bit of sparkle. 

    None of them made me buy, but I’m getting closer. I think I fundamentally prefer the Martin sound to Gibson.
    What body size are you after and what is your playing style?  Do you mainly play standing up or sitting down?  Are you a strummer or a fingerpicker?  Do you need a guitar with a thicker neck, do you need one with wide string spacing at the nut/saddle? 

    IMO, there is a significant difference for playability for acoustic body sizes when the lower bout is smaller or larger than an inch, for example Jumbo/Lowden O size 16", Martin Dread/Gibson J-45 - 16", Martin 000/OM - 15", Martin OO - 14". 

    It sounds like you might be after Martin 00-16M with a bit more sparkle in that particular body size, I think the rosewood back and sides of the Martin 00-28 seeming to be an excellent fit but it's £2.7k new.  14 fret 00's are fairly thin on the ground though, the only other rosewood models I can think of under a £1.5k are the Eastman E20SS,  Sigma have a few as well. 

    Under a £1.5k or so, the Furch guitars are excellent.  The Rainbow series are the their modern inspired series, and their Vintage ones are the Martin inspired ones.  They generally come with a 45mm wide nut which may or may not be a good thing for you.
    Thanks for the response.

    I like a smaller guitar, more for depth than anything else, though with a Lowden O you cant even sit on a chair properly without the bottom end contacting the chair, you have to sit at an angle..so width of the lower bout *and* width of the waist is a consideration too. In rehearsal i'll generally be sitting, live more likely to be standing but not always. I found the Lowden neck to be both too big and too wide and generally that made the guitar harder to play for me than - say - the 1 11/16" 00-16 neck with Martin's low profile neck shape. In Gibson land, I am perfectly happy with the standard J45 neck but the J35 was a bit too large and rounded for my tastes. The ulta-modern (ish) Martin profile on the OMC was pretty much perfect for me. 

    My playing style is 'hack' - call it general acoustic playing. As noted, no Celtic fingerstyle, no flatpicking bluegrass, mainly backing a singer with chords and part-chords and the like. A bit of basic fingerstyle stuff for fun. I do like to drop down to open C for a few tunes so a longer scale can help - haven't tried that with the 00 but I suspect it'll not work, currently I use my old Jasmine electro for that (unplugged). It sounds pretty bad but it's passable at home!

    00-28s and 18s are on my radar for sure, though there aren't that many around at the moment.

    Thanks for the suggestions :)

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  • TimmyOTimmyO Frets: 7349
    Man, I love the handle-ability of 00 sized guitars but I just can't pretend I like the sound (and I've tried)
    Red ones are better. 
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  • Lewy said:
    jellyroll said:
    I bought an HD28 last week. It is boomy - but I'm hoping to tame it with string choice.
    80/20 bronze probably a good place to start...
    I hear ya..
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  • My journey has just reached it's conclusion :)


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  • @Wazmeister. ; Very nice. Mr Atkin does good work.
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  • Moe_ZambeekMoe_Zambeek Frets: 3419
    edited November 2018
    Finding myself in deepest England I took myself off to an internet dealers of some repute I’ve not visited before, and once recovered from the shock of how small the place is, I tried some Atkins. I have to say - for me - Atkin are not to my taste. I’ve now tried 2 OMs (essential series), an O-37, a couple of dreads (D37s) and their White Rice. I really don’t like the relicing and I dont really like their fretwork either, it has some room for improvement on the seating, fret-end finishing and general polishing IMO (the latter maybe relating to the relicing I guess), but fundamentally they just didn’t sound the way I wanted. They were all very rattly and quite toppy sounding. The White Rice I expected to be big sounding but it was quieter than the regular dread. Very underwhelming for my playing style and my ‘ear’. Nicely made otherwise...

    Of the remainder of the stock I tried, I preferred the Martin OM28 reimagined which was nicely balanced sounding with a lovely neck, if a little rough looking internally, and a Martin 000-15Me which was punchy and solid sounding, though neither provoked a credit card bending.

    Still good to knock some more off the list!
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  • jellyrolljellyroll Frets: 3073
    I'm glad Atkin are around, building guitars in the UK. But they are essentially Martin copies - nothing inherently wrong with that. But given that Atkin pricing is pretty much the same as the Martin Standard Series, why wouldn't one just buy a Martin and get the "original" with lower depreciation cost? I suppose, British built & hand made carries some weight with some buyers, but for me they need to do either do their "own thing" or lower their prices or make "better" Martins a la Collings & Santa Cruz. IMO, etc.....
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  • LewyLewy Frets: 4124
    edited November 2018
    jellyroll said:
    I'm glad Atkin are around, building guitars in the UK. But they are essentially Martin copies - nothing inherently wrong with that. But given that Atkin pricing is pretty much the same as the Martin Standard Series, why wouldn't one just buy a Martin and get the "original" with lower depreciation cost?
    I speak with no real experience of Atkin guitars but my answer would be that based on spec, if you wanted a D28 you’d get a better one buying an Atkin than a Standard series Martin. You’d know what you’d be getting from a materials point of view (a standard Martin neck could be made of Mahogany, could be Spanish Cedar...not sure if they use anything else but they could as they just specify “select hardwood”), have a thinner finish and the setup would likely be better. 

    I’m not sure there’s much in it from a depreciation point of view.
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  • zepp76zepp76 Frets: 2534
    edited November 2018
    I know they're not as expensive or exclusive as the Acoustics you've tried but have you thought about trying the Tanglewood sundance performance pro series? I bought one the other day and have to say it is a fantastic guitar for what I paid (£649 with discount and it came with a hardcase). Solid spruce top with mahogany back and sides, satin neck and Grover tuners. I love it, it's the most I've ever spent on an acoustic but it's well worth it in my humble opinion.

    Edit: It's dreadnought sized so don't know if that's of any use?
    Tomorrow will be a good day.
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  • I might be missing the point here but surely you buy the guitar you like best?
    If you are buying with resale in mind why bother?
    The Bigsby was the first successful design of what is now called a whammy bar or tremolo arm, although vibrato is the technically correct term for the musical effect it produces. In standard usage, tremolo is a rapid fluctuation of the volume of a note, while vibrato is a fluctuation in pitch. The origin of this nonstandard usage of the term by electric guitarists is attributed to Leo Fender, who also used the term “vibrato” to refer to what is really a tremolo effect.
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  • CMW335CMW335 Frets: 2034
    My journey has just reached it's conclusion :)


    Wow that’s cool, I had no idea these existed!!
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  • zepp76 said:
    I know they're not as expensive or exclusive as the Acoustics you've tried but have you thought about trying the Tanglewood sundance performance pro series? I bought one the other day and have to say it is a fantastic guitar for what I paid (£649 with discount and it came with a hardcase). Solid spruce top with mahogany back and sides, satin neck and Grover tuners. I love it, it's the most I've ever spent on an acoustic but it's well worth it in my humble opinion.

    Edit: It's dreadnought sized so don't know if that's of any use?
    Interesting, if I bump into some I’ll try them. I actually have a Tanglewood sapling travel guitar up in the cupboard from my travelling days. Quite a nicely made little thing (though it is 20 years old and so no reflection of now!).
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  • LewyLewy Frets: 4124
    I might be missing the point here but surely you buy the guitar you like best?
    If you are buying with resale in mind why bother?
    Plenty of people, myself included, like to change things up every now and then as opposed to treating every instrument like an heirloom. So resale wouldn't be the primary factor - that would be feel, sound, look etc - but it would be a factor because what I want from an instrument could be totally different in a year's time.
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  • jellyroll said:
    I'm glad Atkin are around, building guitars in the UK. But they are essentially Martin copies - nothing inherently wrong with that. But given that Atkin pricing is pretty much the same as the Martin Standard Series, why wouldn't one just buy a Martin and get the "original" with lower depreciation cost? I suppose, British built & hand made carries some weight with some buyers, but for me they need to do either do their "own thing" or lower their prices or make "better" Martins a la Collings & Santa Cruz. IMO, etc.....
    I recently bought an Atkin OM37 after A/Bing it with every Martin in Andertons and Guitar Village and it absolutely killed everything else, it made the Martins sound like cheap budget acoustics in comparison. That’s why they’re getting so much attention. 

    My experience re playing through a PA is that more heavily braced, less lively guitars fitted with an M1A gets a great sound out front. The best amplified sounds i’ve had has been a late 60’s Gibson dread fitted with an M1A. With a livelier guitar you get too much of the airy sound which just doesn’t sit in a mix with vocals.
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11411
    jellyroll said:
    I'm glad Atkin are around, building guitars in the UK. But they are essentially Martin copies - nothing inherently wrong with that. But given that Atkin pricing is pretty much the same as the Martin Standard Series, why wouldn't one just buy a Martin and get the "original" with lower depreciation cost? I suppose, British built & hand made carries some weight with some buyers, but for me they need to do either do their "own thing" or lower their prices or make "better" Martins a la Collings & Santa Cruz. IMO, etc.....
    I recently bought an Atkin OM37 after A/Bing it with every Martin in Andertons and Guitar Village and it absolutely killed everything else, it made the Martins sound like cheap budget acoustics in comparison. That’s why they’re getting so much attention. 

    My experience re playing through a PA is that more heavily braced, less lively guitars fitted with an M1A gets a great sound out front. The best amplified sounds i’ve had has been a late 60’s Gibson dread fitted with an M1A. With a livelier guitar you get too much of the airy sound which just doesn’t sit in a mix with vocals.


    You raise some good points.  What makes a good plugged in guitar doesn't necessarily make the best acoustic.

    The Atkins that I've played have been stunning.  Guitar Classics in Wandsworth had an all mahogany one a year or two ago that was better than Martins that were 2 or 3 times the price.  Some Martins are better than others though.  Assuming you get forward shifted bracing, it's very hard to find a bad Martin, but some are great while some are merely good.

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  • I must be the only one who thinks Atkins are completely underwhelming, based on this thread :)

    I tried some more stuff this weekend - Martin OMC28 & 35, GPC 28 and a D18, 000-18 and D28. This kind of reinforced what I knew already - I find 35 series guitars too woofy in the bass and 28 series guitars (generally) not far behind. I prefer the dryness and control of the mahogany 18s. Having said that, the GPC-28 had less of that booming bass and was more controlled all round. Didn't have 'that' Martin sound but was still better than I expected. Too expensive though.All were pretty nicely made and lovely to play, with the more modern neck profile and matte finish on the necks.

    I also tried an Eggle Kanuga, which was nice but more or less a generic dread-sounding kind of thing, some Lowdens (I used to love the Lowden sound...I cant stand it now after selling off my O23) and a Collings D2H - which I liked, best guitar I played on the day but I just don't want a dread, and I don't want to spend 3k either. 

    So once again I left empty-handed. 

    I went home and was considering a Larrivee OM from peach in their sale, but they couldn't tell me what pickup was in it and i'm still waiting on the callback :) Now the BF sale is over it's more than i'd pay for a new one anyway, given how poor the resale is with them.

    Now i'm back to considering doing nothing - my 0016 has a pickup, with the right pedal it'd probably do everything I need in a live environment, as long as I don't hit it too hard.
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  • earwighoneyearwighoney Frets: 3489
    edited November 2018
    I must be the only one who thinks Atkins are completely underwhelming, based on this thread

    Like yourself, the Atkins I have tried have been underwhelming.
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  • camfcamf Frets: 1190
    edited November 2018
    Mel, what strings do you have on the 00-16M? I found my Collings C10 was struggling with heavier playing but Collings recommend light gauge strings but I changed to 13-55 Newtone Heritage reduced tension and the guitar just seemed to play much better. The Newtones pretty much felt like light gauge strings and have less pressure on the bridge than a standard light gauge set. Might be worth a try - they're nice strings and not expensive, although they take a week or two to arrive. 
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