1961 Les Paul Custom !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! _ some discussion points here

guitars4you

Wow - some discussion could be had on this 

https://guitar-auctions.co.uk/portfolio-post/lot-487-1961-gibson-les-paul-custom-electric-guitar-made-in-usa/

AlbertC

Looks like a shark bit it

Philly_Q

In the auctions listing they haven't even mentioned the obvious question.  I'll leave it to the experts....

andrewaward

Got excited there, thought it was the SG model

ICBM

I reckon that one would be no problem. Just thickness the body down and fit a maple cap - that would take care of the binding and the middle pickup rout at the same time. New fingerboard from some other run of the mill old Gibson, cut the headstock down a bit, refinish it and you’re done - instant “burst”.

GuyR

andrewaward said:

Got excited there, thought it was the SG model

https://guitar-auctions.co.uk/portfolio-post/lot-389-1963-gibson-les-paul-standard-sg-electric-guitar-made-in-usa/

gringopig

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Jetfire

Ok im not an expert so i got no idea whats up with it?

gringopig

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Monstronaut

gringopig said:

Look up the timeline for Gibson models. There was no 1961 Les Paul in that format. It had changed to the SG style we all know and love but also with the Les Paul branding.

There are several examples of the original les paul custom in '61. Probably to fulfil existing orders. It would make sense for any factory to have an overlap so they always have something to sell.

gringopig

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ICBM

https://guitars.com/inventory/eb6677-early-1961-gibson-les-paul-custom

The SG shape was introduced *in* 1961, not on January 1st 1961.

Bigsby

ICBM said:

https://guitars.com/inventory/eb6677-early-1961-gibson-les-paul-custom

The SG shape was introduced *in* 1961, not on January 1st 1961.

Indeed, the SG shape went into production late in 1960, as Standard and Custom models, but it wasn't officially announced until early in 1961, with other versions following later in the year. I guess a '61 Custom must be a rarity, even more so than a Standard. 

impmann

Bigsby said: I guess a '61 Custom must be a rarity, even more so than a Standard. 

And FAR more cool.

designerseye88

Theirs not really anything too odd about the date, theirs been a few guitars on this forum which the model spec and the date stamp haven't been consistent with the year. I may be corrected but I'm pretty sure guitars were stamped when they left the factory. This custom could have been a special order, warranty claim or simply one of the last to be made. We'll never really know but it's a cool piece of history. Will be interesting to see what it sells for. 

Philly_Q

gringopig said:

Philly_Q said:

In the auctions listing they haven't even mentioned the obvious question.  I'll leave it to the experts....

You don't really have to be an expert to detect the glaring error lol

What I meant was, like many I've always had it in my head "no Les Pauls between 1960 and 1968", thinking of that as if it was 31.12.1960 to 01.01.1968, but of course it's not that simple. 

As the comments above point out, a few singlecut LPs must have crept into 1961 (and production didn't re-start until some time into 1968, presumably).

ICBM

Exactly. Production changes don't happen on New Year's Day, and even if they did, guitars take weeks to make and companies usually like to use up old stock until model-specific parts run out. So although the first SG-shape "Les Pauls" were made in very late 1960, the last singlecuts were not - especially as they were selling very few of them at all, and it may have taken months to use up the last of the bodies and necks.

The obsession with 'year' in the guitar industry is partly responsible for this sort of misunderstanding - and even when it's done deliberately as a 'model year' as Gibson do now, the first ones seem to come out before the end of the preceding year and the last will most likely over-run, especially if that year's model wasn't as popular as they expected.

Brize

It's well established that a few single-cut Les Paul Customs were produced into 1961.

Iamnobody

1961 Gibson Les Paul Custom electric guitar, made in USA, ser. no. 1 1xx8; Finish: black, evidence of refinishing/overspray, blemishes to table, buckle rash and rubbing to back, wear to neck, further marks as typical for age, filed hole between controls from a previously installed switch; Fretboard; Ebony; Frets: generally good, refret; Electrics: working, PAF pickups, bridge and neck pickups rewound, neck pickup bobbin replaced (original retained) pickups missing covers, some resoldering; Hardware; replaced nut, replaced bridge (original retained), stop bar a Les Paul Junior wrap-around type, pickguard probably later, one replaced stop bar post (original retained), hole in control plate from a previously installed switch;  Case: 1970s Gibson hard case; Overall condition: good for age.

Given all the things highlighted above what value does the forum put in this guitar?

rsvmark

I will offer a few quid....

guitars4you

Iamnobody said:

1961 Gibson Les Paul Custom electric guitar, made in USA, ser. no. 1 1xx8; Finish: black, evidence of refinishing/overspray, blemishes to table, buckle rash and rubbing to back, wear to neck, further marks as typical for age, filed hole between controls from a previously installed switch; Fretboard; Ebony; Frets: generally good, refret; Electrics: working, PAF pickups, bridge and neck pickups rewound, neck pickup bobbin replaced (original retained) pickups missing covers, some resoldering; Hardware; replaced nut, replaced bridge (original retained), stop bar a Les Paul Junior wrap-around type, pickguard probably later, one replaced stop bar post (original retained), hole in control plate from a previously installed switch;  Case: 1970s Gibson hard case; Overall condition: good for age.

Given all the things highlighted above what value does the forum put in this guitar?

This was more my point when I stated in the opening header  'some discussion points here'

I agree that it is possible for a 61 LP Custom to exist, but check it out carefully to establish this fact - A few key points have been raised earlier by others - But the highlighted items show to many negatives for me to be interested in it, certainly with that scale of potential price tag attached -  And remember you need to add nearly 1/4 to the hammer price in additional fees, so £20K hammer ='s £24k to be removed from your bank account