Connecting head to a combo's speaker

thecolourbox

An amp head of course, not the one sitting on top of my neck....

Question is, as the cable with the jack to the speaker in my Hot Rod Deluxe is too short, am I going to die if I buy some kind of female to female speaker lead jack extender thing and use it to plug a head into the HRD to use it as a cab? Eyeing a few small amps that would benefit from the bigger speaker but don't have room for another cab

Also @ecc83 one of the possibles is a blackstar ht1, in your opinion is it worth doing or better simply getting the HT (or even LT???) dual pedal and going straight to the fx loop return?

Thanks all

steamabacus

I've found those female-female jack connectors to be a bit dodgy and often lose connection. Beware. There may be better quality ones out there but the standard ones from somewhere like Maplins aren't to be trusted in my opinion (especially on an amp-to-speaker connection).

Maybe get a custom male to female cable made up with something like a Neutrik locking socket? (I've no experience of them but Neutrik are usually decent).

ToneControl

you can get a locking neutrik one

I made up a few combo extension leads for this. I can sell you one if you like

Fortheloveofguitar

+1 on the maplins connectors being proper shite. Bought 4 for the same purpose and all failed within a month. Avoid!

mark_jwedge

thecolourbox;14523" said:

Question is, as the cable with the jack to the speaker in my Hot Rod Deluxe is too short, am I going to die if I buy some kind of female to female speaker lead jack extender thing and use it to plug a head into the HRD to use it as a cab? Eyeing a few small amps that would benefit from the bigger speaker but don't have room for another cab
Thanks all

Get Rob at Kabl (forum member) to make you one. He did the exact same thing for me so I could put my orange dual terror through the speakers of mycornford roadhouse. Especially useful if the cornford dies at a gig

ICBM

Yes, just to back up that the barrel type female-to-female connectors are crap and not suitable for speaker connections. I used a couple for outdoor PA years ago so I could run very long cables (I know, cheapskating and not using proper cabling! But it was just for a school speech day thing with music) and one of them actually spark-eroded the centre rivet away and fell apart. You really don't want that to happen with a valve amp.

Even the Switchcraft line sockets aren't much better. The only one I would use for any serious purpose is the Neutrik locking type.

And @ecc83 will probably have a go at me for this , but make *certain* that the push connectors on the speaker are nice and tight and can't get pulled off by tugging on the speaker cable - they're all too easy to… either that or cut them off and solder the wires to the speaker properly .

Cacofonix

ICBM said:

Yes, just to back up that the barrel type female-to-female connectors are crap and not suitable for speaker connections. I used a couple for outdoor PA years ago so I could run very long cables (I know, cheapskating and not using proper cabling! But it was just for a school speech day thing with music) and one of them actually spark-eroded the centre rivet away and fell apart. You really don't want that to happen with a valve amp.

Even the Switchcraft line sockets aren't much better. The only one I would use for any serious purpose is the Neutrik locking type.

And @ecc83 will probably have a go at me for this , but make *certain* that the push connectors on the speaker are nice and tight and can't get pulled off by tugging on the speaker cable - they're all too easy to… either that or cut them off and solder the wires to the speaker properly .

...and perhaps add a few feet of speaker cable and a decent jack plug whilst you're at it, so you can use it as an extension cab in the unlikely event that you want to.

Dave_Mc

The handier thing to do (assuming stock speaker is connected with spade connectors, and assuming you don't want to solder like ICBM said) is probably to just buy a longer speaker cable with spades on one end. Award Session/Cleartone does them.

ICBM

If you're going to do that, I would *strongly* suggest you make the cable even longer and properly secure it somewhere to either the cabinet or the speaker frame with a P-clip or a cable tie, so the push-connectors don't have to support the cable.

Even if Dave is right that they're reliable normally, the way to guarantee that they don't stay that way is to tug and stress them repeatedly.

ecc83

Ever wondered why speaker tags have a hole in them (and just about every tag of that type you have ever seen)?

It is for the little "pip" in the receptacle to lock into. Now most "industrial" grade connectors have a punched out pip and if you try to get these off with a straight tug they can be as tight as ****k! You are supposed to release them with a spiked tool.

Yeah! Ok, the modern ones are usually not as good but there should be a bit of a bump that gives a lock.

Now, I am a cynical old bugger and I know how hamfisted Joe Public can be, especially MUSICAL Joe P! So when I was loading and wiring 4x12s* I went ape ***t anal and cable tied the wires to the centre post, and left plenty of slack at each speaker and cable tied to each basket (some Cellies have handy holes!) I did not do this because I did not trust the connectors, no, it was to save the wires getting ripped of if JP pulled the back off in drunken haste! If you are going into an HT-1 I would do the same and tie to the speaker chassis.

*Early days of B's. Had to get some product out the door and also "Areeestic" peeps were asking for special loadings. .....And Do You Know friend J? NEVER had one back with a loose connection!

But how about this for a compromise? Don't solder but use 25mm of heatshrink? Deff' will not come loose but Stan's knife and you can change the drive unit.

Forgot, yes jack line sockets are crap. I have read that the Neutrik locking jobbies are good but personally I don't think you can beat two standard sockets wires pin for pin and gaffered. If you want pretty put them in a tin (if you want to use them for line level signals take the earth of one jack to case via 100Ohms and 1000puff in parallel.)

Dave.

Cacofonix

ecc83 said:

Ever wondered why speaker tags have a hole in them (and just about every tag of that type you have ever seen)?

It is for the little "pip" in the receptacle to lock into. Now most "industrial" grade connectors have a punched out pip and if you try to get these off with a straight tug they can be as tight as ****k! You are supposed to release them with a spiked tool.

Yeah! Ok, the modern ones are usually not as good but there should be a bit of a bump that gives a lock.

Now, I am a cynical old bugger and I know how hamfisted Joe Public can be, especially MUSICAL Joe P! So when I was loading and wiring 4x12s* I went ape ***t anal and cable tied the wires to the centre post, and left plenty of slack at each speaker and cable tied to each basket (some Cellies have handy holes!) I did not do this because I did not trust the connectors, no, it was to save the wires getting ripped of if JP pulled the back off in drunken haste! If you are going into an HT-1 I would do the same and tie to the speaker chassis.

*Early days of B's. Had to get some product out the door and also "Areeestic" peeps were asking for special loadings. .....And Do You Know friend J? NEVER had one back with a loose connection!

But how about this for a compromise? Don't solder but use 25mm of heatshrink? Deff' will not come loose but Stan's knife and you can change the drive unit.

Forgot, yes jack line sockets are crap. I have read that the Neutrik locking jobbies are good but personally I don't think you can beat two standard sockets wires pin for pin and gaffered. If you want pretty put them in a tin (if you want to use them for line level signals take the earth of one jack to case via 100Ohms and 1000puff in parallel.)

Dave.

Not sure I agree with the tag point.  I know that clips do have a pip to stop them coming loose, but with some spade connectors the shape is a flattened 8 rather than a flat spade.  In that case the shrink won't make a difference because there's enough flex in the excess metal to allow it to come off.  If the connector is plane/flat, it might be a good idea, provided clamped as well, but I have seen enough of the other type to be cautious.  If my output traff is on the line, I'd rather solder, tbh.

Also, soldering avoids the issue of contamination ruining the connection, as happened on my Peavey VT Deuce.  I fixed it by soldering the spades to the terminals on the speaker.  Best of both worlds.

Dave_Mc

ICBM said:

If you're going to do that, I would *strongly* suggest you make the cable even longer and properly secure it somewhere to either the cabinet or the speaker frame with a P-clip or a cable tie, so the push-connectors don't have to support the cable.

Even if Dave is right that they're reliable normally, the way to guarantee that they don't stay that way is to tug and stress them repeatedly.

yep absolutely.

ecc83

"Not sure I agree with the tag point.  I know that clips do have a pip to stop them coming loose, but with some spade connectors the shape is a flattened 8 rather than a flat spade.  In that case the shrink won't make a difference because there's enough flex in the excess metal to allow it to come off.  If the connector is plane/flat, it might be a good idea, provided clamped as well, but I have seen enough of the other type to be cautious.  If my output traff is on the line, I'd rather solder, tbh.

 We're back to the "bad is bad" argument! IF the connectors are loose, fit better. I am pretty sure the ones in the HT-1 are ok.

And I don't buy the argument against heat shrink. If you use sleeving that is just a sliding fit, when shrunk it will grip like ***t to a blanket. If you are worried about "tugging" as I said, CT to the basket and leave some strain relief. In any case, a soldered joint will fail if repeatedly stressed!
On the transformer point, a great many mains and OPTs use 6mm spade connectors.

The connectors also got a bad name because they were used in heater circuits very close to their current rating, certainly well beyond it at cold start.

But maybe I am wrong! Maybe in ten, twenty years time the amplifiers I am familiar with will be blowing traffs all round the world!.....Thing is, I have not seen a single case to suggest that so far.

Dave.