Lazy J20 and alternatives?

markj

Lebarque said:

Why do none of the others offer onboard reverb and trem? Reverb is a deal breaker for me, since I use my guitar volume to control gain.

Strymon flint takes care of that 

RiftAmps

Lebarque said:

Why do none of the others offer onboard reverb and trem? Reverb is a deal breaker for me, since I use my guitar volume to control gain.

There’s not enough room in a 5E3 chassis to add a reverb circuit, let alone tremolo as well.

Adding external units seems to be the popular method, but running both HT and LT along with the guitar signal back and forth through 1/4” cables to the units doesn’t seem very safe to me, let alone compliant with the regs. They really should have their own inbuilt power supplies.

menamestom

Lebarque said:

Why do none of the others offer onboard reverb and trem? Reverb is a deal breaker for me, since I use my guitar volume to control gain.

Changes the circuit so many like to keep reverb separate.  I use a flint with my tweed and even my PRRI much of the time.    

Ossyrocks

I have owned a vintage blackface Deluxe Reverb since about 1995, and I used to think I couldn’t live without Reverb.

But, the 5e3 has so much going on I don’t miss it at all now. In fact using these amps has caused me to strip back much of my gear to almost guitar straight into amp. 

Dominic

markj said:

Dominic said:

I have played Lazy J extensively but having had the side by side experience of a Gartone Bluesman ,which isn't actually much cheaper from new I would say that in my opinion the Gartone is a superior amp - a fantastic amp ,in fact and incredibly loud for it's size.

Being an owner of a Bluesman, in what way is it superior to a LazyJ.

The sound has more "punch" and less grainy  "CHHHCHHCH " background  lower mid  level "over-tweediness "
The overall sound is slightly sweeter ( some may say not enough bite but I like it )
The spread of sound is huge .....side by side with a 4 x12 it sounds similar......never heard a little combo do this
It creates it's own reverb ......the cabinet seems to resonate and create just the right amount of reverb once the volume is above one third of the way up - this may be down to the cabinet build and not the electronics....don't know
You can get clean tones with higher headroom than Lazy J but this may be attributable to the valves / NOS/ brand etc
 

crunchman

Dominic said:

markj said:

Dominic said:

I have played Lazy J extensively but having had the side by side experience of a Gartone Bluesman ,which isn't actually much cheaper from new I would say that in my opinion the Gartone is a superior amp - a fantastic amp ,in fact and incredibly loud for it's size.

Being an owner of a Bluesman, in what way is it superior to a LazyJ.

The sound has more "punch" and less grainy  "CHHHCHHCH " background  lower mid  level "over-tweediness "
The overall sound is slightly sweeter ( some may say not enough bite but I like it )
The spread of sound is huge .....side by side with a 4 x12 it sounds similar......never heard a little combo do this
It creates it's own reverb ......the cabinet seems to resonate and create just the right amount of reverb once the volume is above one third of the way up - this may be down to the cabinet build and not the electronics....don't know
You can get clean tones with higher headroom than Lazy J but this may be attributable to the valves / NOS/ brand etc
 

I think a lot of it is down to the speaker and cabinet.  Jesse made a few with the Tayden version of a Blue, and it was slightly sweeter/warmer sounding.  The former manager of Chandlers had a Lazy J with an original 60's Blue in.  That sounded absolutely stunning.  I went looking for original Blues on Feebay until I saw the prices they go for.

I get what you are saying about the cab seeming to add its own reverb.  Mine seems to do that.  Jesse made the cabs for the early ones himself, so I don't know if the later ones are different.

dazzajl

There must be as many interpretations of the 5e3 amp as there are of the Les Paul. Some of those that are listed as firm favourites here haven’t floated my goat at all and anyone in search of clean headroom isn’t going to like the ones that hit the spot for me. 

The only way to really know what’s right for you is to grab a guitar, hit the road and be prepared to kiss a frogs in the search. 

crunchman

The clean headroom thing is a lot about what valve you have in the first position.  If you go 12AY7 (as per the original), you can get quite a good amount of clean headroom on a Lazy J.  if you put an ECC83/12AXY in there, it's a lot more hooligan.

dazzajl

“Hooligan” now you’re talking my language @crunchman

BusterCrabb

Hey @mrkb - as lots of people have said there are loads of amps which will get you in the ballpark but I just thought it worth mentioning that despite being based on the same circuit - in the real world I find that my J20's are actually not very similar to a stock tweed deluxe. Volume/clean headroom/compression etc are all very different. Put it this way - if I have to use rented backline and have the option of tweed deluxe's or deluxe reverbs I'll take the deluxe reverbs every time. So if you like the sound of the J20's I'd look out for something 20watts with 6L6's rather than a stock tweed deluxe. I haven't tried most of the other amps mentioned so can't compare to the J20's - although I did get to try a @RiftAmps amp last week while I was in doing a session at andertons and it also sounded really awesome! Paul 

mrkb

BusterCrabb said:

Hey @mrkb - as lots of people have said there are loads of amps which will get you in the ballpark but I just thought it worth mentioning that despite being based on the same circuit - in the real world I find that my J20's are actually not very similar to a stock tweed deluxe. Volume/clean headroom/compression etc are all very different. Put it this way - if I have to use rented backline and have the option of tweed deluxe's or deluxe reverbs I'll take the deluxe reverbs every time. So if you like the sound of the J20's I'd look out for something 20watts with 6L6's rather than a stock tweed deluxe. I haven't tried most of the other amps mentioned so can't compare to the J20's - although I did get to try a @RiftAmps amp last week while I was in doing a session at andertons and it also sounded really awesome! Paul 

Cheers Paul,

Thanks for the input. I really enjoyed your "RIg Rundown" at the show last weekend (and Im a huge Temperance Movement fan), but Im mad at you for making me want to spend over £2k on an amp....

BusterCrabb

Ha - thanks mate!

JohnPerry

the day I got my J20 I A-B'd it for a good while in the shop with a beautifully-made stock 5e3 sat next to it.

The Lazy J was warmer, bigger, richer, growlier and more alive. It was also a bit noisier, but I decided to live with that and - despite it being literally twice the price - bought it.

Not heard a Gartone though I will admit.

markj

BusterCrabb said:

Ha - thanks mate!

Hi Paul what drive pedal are you using with your Lazy J'S at the moment? I've seen The Temperance movement many times. Many thanks Mark.

BusterCrabb

HI Mark - no drive pedal - guitar volume and a fuzz....

martinw

Lebarque said:

Why do none of the others offer onboard reverb and trem? Reverb is a deal breaker for me, since I use my guitar volume to control gain.

If that includes me, I do.

I would rather build the result into one if my own chassis in that case though; as @RiftAmps says, less than ideal using the external boxes, and I was disappointed to see there was no separate earth bonding carried to the boxes on the ones I've seen.
 
However adding reverb or trem changes the circuit, reverb the most, which may or may not be desirable. As has been said if you want the full 5E3 experience, you will lose that to some extent.
Although, as he also been said, the J20 is not quite that when fitted with 6L6s. 

Lebarque

BusterCrabb said:

HI Mark - no drive pedal - guitar volume and a fuzz....

Wis duly awarded

tone1

BusterCrabb said:

HI Mark - no drive pedal - guitar volume and a fuzz....

@BusterCrabb ;Can I ask what Fuzz are you using? 

Lebarque

tone1 said:

BusterCrabb said:

HI Mark - no drive pedal - guitar volume and a fuzz....

@BusterCrabb ;Can I ask what Fuzz are you using? 

Fuzzfaces are ace with tweed. Black Moon for me.

mrkb

tone1 said:

BusterCrabb said:

HI Mark - no drive pedal - guitar volume and a fuzz....

@BusterCrabb ;;Can I ask what Fuzz are you using? 

I think it was an analog man Sunlion, dual circuit, that’s a fuzz face and Beano boost.