"Don't attenuate - buy an amp of appropriate size"

TimmyO

Despite using quote marks I have paraphrased Mr Rift from this video (which I very much enjoyed)



I must say I heartily disagree - one of the best amp-owning periods of my life was a JCM800 through a Torpedo Reload - I don't think I've played a 15w amp that responded like a 100w amp attenuated does.

What are others' thoughts on this? 

Great video overall - really interesting and I really must play a PR35 at some point... 

guitarfishbay

Just use the master volume and deal with it is my opinion. A lot of the fun of high power amp tone is the punch you get at louder volumes, and that’s not possible at low volumes regardless of an attenuator anyway 

ICBM

It depends what sound you want. If you want the sound of a cranked big amp quieter, then using a big amp and an attenuator will get you a lot closer than a small amp or turning the MV down.

There are so many ways to get good sounds at low volume that there are no right or wrong ways. Personally I generally prefer the response and flexibility of big amps, attenuated if necessary.

Caffeine_Vampire

Tell that to the Boss Waza Tube Expander when it lands. 

TimmyO

ICBM said:

It depends what sound you want. If you want the sound of a cranked big amp quieter, then using a big amp and an attenuator will get you a lot closer than a small amp or turning the MV down.

There are so many ways to get good sounds at low volume that there are no right or wrong ways. Personally I generally prefer the response and flexibility of big amps, attenuated if necessary.

for me with the 800 it was easily as much about the clean sound - not just the 'hard working power stage' thing 

I honestly think that owning a good attenuator and then being able to choose from all the great amps there ever were is a "better" way (if indeed one way can be said to be best) 

dindude

It’s an interesting subject - I was watching the Andertons Rift Demo and the PR6 sounded great and I started plotting in my head that it was much more fit for purpose than my 18 watt Carr Sportsman for home use - then he kicked in the drive pedals and it reminds you that you need some headroom for them to sound right. 

monquixote

One of the main things I've learned from lots of experimentation is that loud amps sound good mostly because they are loud and there is no substitute for loud.

Quite a few amps need to be up a little to get working but IMO don't actually sound that great flat out as they get mushy and lose definition.

As ICBM often points out a big amp ticking over often sounds better than a piddly amp about to go on fire.

jellybelly

15 watts is great for smaller rooms and when you’re mic’d up, but I’ve found having one un-mic’d in a bigger room are some of the most difficult gigs I’ve ever played. 

The sweet spot for any amp is the goal, and so all these new ‘re-amp’ devices are the ideal.

Practically, though, clean headroom with a master volume to dial in some dirt is probably the most sensible thing to do this side of £1k. 

Jalapeno

I'm very much sold on the PR35

TimmyO

Jalapeno said:

I'm very much sold on the PR35

I love the idea of it - not had chance to try one yet 

bbill335

Jalapeno said:

I'm very much sold on the PR35

is it just a blackface vibrolux reverb in a 1x12? looks like it doesn't have the normal channel

TimmyO

bbill335 said:

Jalapeno said:

I'm very much sold on the PR35

is it just a blackface vibrolux reverb in a 1x12? looks like it doesn't have the normal channel

No not at all - the PR amps are a development of the Princeton - he does do a vibro type - and it does have 2 channels 

TimmyO

Also any of them can be specced with black, silver or brown face preamps I think 

RiftAmps

bbill335 said:

Jalapeno said:

I'm very much sold on the PR35

is it just a blackface vibrolux reverb in a 1x12? looks like it doesn't have the normal channel

No, it very much is a high-power 6L6 PR, cathodyne PI and all

bbill335

RiftAmps said:

bbill335 said:

Jalapeno said:

I'm very much sold on the PR35

is it just a blackface vibrolux reverb in a 1x12? looks like it doesn't have the normal channel

No, it very much is a high-power 6L6 PR, cathodyne PI and all

well, buddy, that sounds pretty cool!

Bygone_Tones

Nice amps. I had to google the rift saw thing to get my head around it.

matone

monquixote said:

One of the main things I've learned from lots of experimentation is that loud amps sound good mostly because they are loud and there is no substitute for loud.

Quite a few amps need to be up a little to get working but IMO don't actually sound that great flat out as they get mushy and lose definition.

As ICBM often points out a big amp ticking over often sounds better than a piddly amp about to go on fire.

Totally agree with this !

Exorcist

I think its a mixed bag. I've had great success with attenuators on amps, some success with power scaling type systems, and success with MV's. My current Bogner has a fantastic MV and sounds incredible at low volumes - (my 4 watt FUCH's on the other hand was too loud for home before it sounded half decent.)

ESBlonde

I'm a bigger amp turned down guy and compromise on the size of the speaker cabinet if I must.

I recently spent a week in the pit doing a show with a 20w combo. When the band got loud it felt horrible and chocked with no more dynamics, but up to that point it was OK. Size was important so I used the real estate for a pedal board rather than a bigger amp as the job required it and I didn't have time to reconfigure a smaller board between jobs.

PolarityMan

monquixote said:

One of the main things I've learned from lots of experimentation is that loud amps sound good mostly because they are loud and there is no substitute for loud.

I agree with you....*but*...a guitars on records still sound ace at quiet volumes and retain their apparent size, id argue more so than a typical small amp.

Obv modellers are trying to capture this to greater or lesser extents using cab simulation etc and I have to say if im at home i dont normally bother turning on amps as helix native sounds much better at low volumes.

Dominic

Depends on the amp
.........some respond really well to a good attenuator and others don't 
ALSO some 15w Amps EG ; Matchless Lightning or a 30w Vox AC 30 are as loud as some 100w amps
My Lightning 15w would drown my Brunetti 50w Plexi 
Not all small amps are quiet