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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    edited May 2014
    Here is the part list - 

    1 W022772 / W022772EU Power Transformer    USA  EU
    Qty  Part Number Description
    1 CAB-5F2A  Cabinet, 5F2A, complete
    1 Sig10A-S Speaker, Signature Series, 10", 8 ohm, AlNiCo, S type
    4 Nut-#8-32 Nut, #8-32 with integral washer (for mounting speaker)
    1 5F2AKT 5F2A Chassis, brass plate, fiber board front and back
    1 W022913 Transformer, output
    1 WY3GT Copper Cap Rectifier
    1 6V6GT Vacuum tube
    1 12AX7B Vacuum tube
    1 PC-CUT Power cord, cut end
         
    1 CCW-5F2A Kit, cloth covered wire, 5F2A
    ( 8 ft. Red, Yellow, Green, 3 ft. Black, White)
    2 CHK-11 Knob, black, chicken head, flat top
    1 CF-1 Fuse, 1 amp
    2 SKT8 Tube socket, octal
    1 SKT9 Tube socket, 9 pin
    2 TR-8 Clamp, octal
    8 Bolt-SKT Bolt, machine, #4-40x3/8, with nut and star washer
    4 Spacer-SKT    Spacer, nylon, for SKT8
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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    1 RJP-2 RCA jack, chassis mount, diamond fiber base
    1 RP-C RCA plug, male, cable mount
    1 FH-2 Fuseholder
    2 CB-1.5 Bolt, chassis, tweed style, chrome, with nut
    1 PL-2 Pilot light, red
    1 6N-4 Strain relief
    1 WSW-SPST-3 Carling Switch, toggle, panel mount, SPST
    2 PJP-S Chassis mount phone jack, shorting
    2 Small Grommet 9/16" OD  Chassis Grommets
    2 WP105A-MF Potentiometer, 1 meg audio
    1 Wire Nut Wire Nut, small
    2 #8 sheet metal screw Fiber Board Mounting Screws
    1 SMC501-500 Capacitor, 500pF, 500 volts
    2 EC256-25 Capacitor, 25uF, 25 volts
    2 EC805-450 Capacitor, 8uF, 450 volts
    2 EC166-450 Capacitor, 16uF, 450 volts
    1 PEC472-630 Capacitor, .0047uF, 630 volts
    2 PEC223-630 Capacitor, .022uF, 630 volts
    2 MFR1500-.5 Resistor, 1.5K, 1/2 watt
    1 MFR22K-.5 Resistor, 22K, 1/2 watt
    2 MFR68K-.5 Resistor, 68K, 1/2 watt
    2 MFR100K-.5 Resistor, 100K, 1/2 watt
    1 MFR220K-.5 Resistor, 220K, 1/2 watt
    1 MFR1M-.5 Resistor, 1M ohm, 1/2 watt
    1 MFR10K-2 Resistor, 10K, 2 watt
    1 MFR22K-2 Resistor, 22K, 2 watt
    1 RES470-5 Resistor, 470 ohms, 5 watt
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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    Well, Weber got back and it's all good - shipped cost is $598 which is about £355. According to HM Reveue & Customs new online duty calculator import costs will just be the VAT, so £71. That's actually a fair bit less than I budgeted she I first got this idea. So, it's game on! Lead time for the cab is about 4 weeks though so I've got some time to learn! This evening, I made this - 
    image
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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    I didn't make it upside down though??
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  • It's a copper cap rectifier, which plugs into the second octal socket (see the list) so you will be able to use valve rectification if you are dead set on it. Considering it comes with cab and speaker I think you got a bargain.
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  • MtBMtB Frets: 921
    Late in to reading this thread, but if you need any other parts you could try Allparts. They supply all sort of useful amp parts - I bought my Champ chassis from them (to convert the ampmaker WF4). Perhaps not the cheapest tho'.


    I think that you have done the right thing buying the Weber kit - I bought my 5e3 kit from them (had the cab made in the UK). I ended up putting a valve rectifier in mine.
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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    It does seem a good deal - we'll have a better idea when it arrives. I'm in two minds about the rectifier, I'm at the start of what I think is going to be a steep learning curve and the more I read the more I am starting to understand why people say it makes little difference in a single ended amp like this.

    @MtB - what did you think of the Weber 5e3 kit? 
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  • MtBMtB Frets: 921
    This was my 4th build (first was the Ampmaker 5f1, then the SE-5a, then I copied a Ceriatone 18 watt TMB layout and schematic but bought all the parts myself).

    There is so much information out there on the web that you shouldn't have too many problems. For the build process (components to the board) I was VERY methodical. With each resistor / capacitor I wire-wooled the leads before soldering - to ensure a good soldered joint, and fitted each component dry before soldering (making bends in leads, etc, before making the joint). After each connection I then marked up the layout drawing to show that each joint had been completed. It's a ball-ache, but there are so many joints to be made that it's easy to lose track.

    From recollection I think the only "issue" that I had was with a couple of leads from the power transformer (green / yellow and red / yellow). I finally found out (on my build) that they are redundant - so have to be terminated safely (I put a loop on the end of the wires and used shrinksleeve to cover the whole lot.)  
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  • MtBMtB Frets: 921
    Oooh, didn't answer your question! 

    I thought the kit was good, didn't have any issue with the quality of the components and it all went together quite well. There's not much room inside some of these chassis, so some patience is required - do a dry run with components prior to soldering up.
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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    Cheers man, I am compulsively reading amp building forums and it's good to see that everyone seems to manage. Hopefully I won't let the side down! Good to here the components are adequate - a read a few folk gripe on one of the yank site about the transformers and  pots and switches. Looking at the parts list they appear to now supply carling switches, and I have a couple of 1 meg audio pots kicking about. I can't wait to get started.
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  • AlanPAlanP Frets: 54
    Gagaryn said:
     I am starting to understand why people say it makes little difference in a single ended amp like this.

    A valve rectifier isn't particularly stiff, so the rail "sags" as you pull power on a loud note or chord.  But that only happens on a class AB or B arrangement - as this *must be* class A as it is single ended (single toob), loud or silent won't make any difference to the power draw, so there won't be any sag to speak of...
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71956
    edited May 2014
    AlanP said:
    A valve rectifier isn't particularly stiff, so the rail "sags" as you pull power on a loud note or chord.  But that only happens on a class AB or B arrangement - as this *must be* class A as it is single ended (single toob), loud or silent won't make any difference to the power draw, so there won't be any sag to speak of…
    That's debatable given the usual bias point of these amps. Yes, when the amp is clean the average current draw is constant… but it isn't when they overdrive because the resulting waveform is significantly asymetrical. So valve rectifiers can still make a difference even in single-ended amps.

    (At which point the amp is not operating in Class A either, for what it's worth - that applies strictly to undistorted output.)

    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski

    "Just because I don't care, doesn't mean I don't understand." - Homer Simpson

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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    Well, I'm probably getting ahead of myself worrying too much but sounds like it's easy enough to try both, and old 5Y3GT seem to be cheap enough. Weber have a page about the copper caps if it's of interest to anyone - http://www.webervst.com/ccap.html
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  • MistergMisterg Frets: 293

    Gagaryn said:
    This evening, I made this -

    image
    Good man. It's a very useful thing to have.

    Looking forward to your build :)
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71956
    Gagaryn said:
    Well, I'm probably getting ahead of myself worrying too much but sounds like it's easy enough to try both, and old 5Y3GT seem to be cheap enough. Weber have a page about the copper caps if it's of interest to anyone - http://www.webervst.com/ccap.html
    It would be interesting to compare the valve, the Copper Cap and a straight no-resistance solid-state rectifier. The Copper Cap is supposed to duplicate a rectifier valve so there probably won't be much difference at the fairly low current draw in a 5F2. Valve rectifiers are non-linear though, so there still could be.

    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski

    "Just because I don't care, doesn't mean I don't understand." - Homer Simpson

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  • thermionicthermionic Frets: 9499
    Based on my recent experience building an ampmaker kit, I would say that having step-by-step instructions does not dumb-down your understanding of valve amps. I learnt a lot about how the circuit works (and I used to be an electronic design engineer); the instructions were helpful in a more nuts and bolts kind of way - simple things like in what order to do things so you don't end up with a wire too short and trying to get your soldering iron into an inaccessible area because there's a pot either side of a small switch terminal or something.

    There's also a few hints about component value replacement, which will at some point mean I'll be looking in some detail at I-V plots for EL34s and working out different values for a cathode bias resistor for single-ended class A operation...
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  • GagarynGagaryn Frets: 1553
    ...the instructions were helpful in a more nuts and bolts kind of way - simple things like in what order to do things so you don't end up with a wire too short and trying to get your soldering iron into an inaccessible area because there's a pot either side of a small switch terminal or something.

    I fear I may run into a fair few situations like you describe.
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  • DarnWeightDarnWeight Frets: 2566
    Gagaryn said:
    So anyone suggest where to source something like this in the UK?
    No experience with these guys yet, but I'm about to order a couple of mini hums from them...


    ...it's not a kit, but looks like very 5F2A-ish to me, and they might be able to help you out.  They've been helpful answering a few of my pickup queries, so might be worth dropping them a message.
    New fangled trading feedback link right here!
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  • equalsqlequalsql Frets: 6084
    edited May 2014

    You knocked that DIM bulb tester up quick.. you must be keen ;) I think the Weber kit is a good choice cos having the full BOM makes it much less daunting for a first build and you don't get held up by not having the correct small parts...like the correct size nuts for mounting the transformers etc.

    It cracks me up that if you remove the transformers from the BOM when ordering it only costs you $30 less.. :D

    I must admit that this thread is starting to make me feel 'itchy' for another build myself, perhaps for 6G15 Reverb Tank.

    +1 for @MtB and his wiring advice. Make a copy of the circuit diagram and highlight the connections as you wire them. Adopt a "measure twice, cut once" approach for the build.  

    Let us know when you're kit arrives.... you should document your build on here, if you a brave enough, cos there's lots of good folks on here to help...and keep you safe :) 

    (pronounced: equal-sequel)   "I suffered for my art.. now it's your turn"
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  • jpfampsjpfamps Frets: 2723
    ICBM said:
    AlanP said:
    A valve rectifier isn't particularly stiff, so the rail "sags" as you pull power on a loud note or chord.  But that only happens on a class AB or B arrangement - as this *must be* class A as it is single ended (single toob), loud or silent won't make any difference to the power draw, so there won't be any sag to speak of…
    That's debatable given the usual bias point of these amps. Yes, when the amp is clean the average current draw is constant… but it isn't when they overdrive because the resulting waveform is significantly asymetrical. So valve rectifiers can still make a difference even in single-ended amps.

    (At which point the amp is not operating in Class A either, for what it's worth - that applies strictly to undistorted output.)
    Conventional wisdom is that class A amps draw constant current from their power supplies; this true for a genuine push-pull class A amp.

    However for a single ended amp the current draw is not constant even if the amp biased for optimally for class A operation, which is very rarely for a guitar amp (single ended or push pull).

    In ideal class A biasing at maximum power the signal current varys from zero to twice the idle current, so the impedance of the power supply will have an effect on the signal.

    As ICBM points out most single ended guitar amps are not biased for optimal class A operation, so the signal will vary by an even greater extent over the signal cycle.
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