Mics for live vocals

AlanP

I've seen suggestions that there are Mics that are "better" for live vocal use than the good ole SM58....

... what would you say are the contenders?

Kebabkid

Try the SM58 Beta
http://www.shure.co.uk/products/microphones/beta_58a

Danny1969

What kinda situation is it ? I mean for rock vocals where the singer stands two feet in front of the drummer I like the senn 945 but for acoustic music and no drummer I would generally go for something with a less tight pattern for example

I agree there are better mics though than 58s I also think 58s are now overpriced for what they are

maltingsaudio

Thorny question and the only real answer is to try a load of mics and get the one that suits, There are better mics than the SM58 although in a recent pole most on here use them.Personally big fan of  the Beta 57 it has a tighter pattern than the Beta58 so on a loud stage slightly less feedback prone but this also means you need to be on it ie inside its pick up pattern to get the best out of it. This applies to all mics you need to know where it pick ups best. I also am a big Sennheiser fan.

Word to wise avoid buying mics off of ebay unless you know or trust the seller there are a lot of fakes out there, but having said that I got caught with a fake beta 57 and as it turned out the seller gave me my money back and let me keep the mic and its a brilliant mic for what it is! 

Have a look at this video you'll find it useful 

guitarfishbay

I agree just go and try anything in your price range.  What I would also advise is if you go for something with a tighter pattern than a 58 is to practice with it a bit before trying it live, on your own preferably so you can get a good feel for it and be more aware of where it picks up.

ESBlonde

Mics tend to suit voices and occasions/bands. Lead singers should make a personal choice but my default was also the Shure Beta57a. Note if you only have one monitor (wedge type) mix then keeping all the mics the same brand/model makes feedback hunting much easier without hacking the tone to death because each mic will have its own peaks in the frequency spectrum to be addressed.

IanSavage

I swear by the Sennheiser E-series, anything from an E835 upwards is a Shure competitor to my ears; they DO sound quite different from model to model though, I found that the 835 suited my own voice best whilst my old lead singer got far better results with an 845. Different pickup patterns too, which may be relevant.

Moe_Zambeek

How do you asses the best mic? Just find a place with lots? Not easy round here!

Our singer is female and I think a better mic than the 58 she uses would make a difference, but nowhere to try a decent selection round here. Would also like to go wireless I think.

Grunfeld

Kebabkid said:

Try the SM58 Beta
http://www.shure.co.uk/products/microphones/beta_58a

I like this too.  Very tight focus and hasn't squealed yet.  Pricey, but solid and (so far) has been reliable.

Danny1969

Moe_Zambeek said:

How do you asses the best mic? Just find a place with lots? Not easy round here!

Our singer is female and I think a better mic than the 58 she uses would make a difference, but nowhere to try a decent selection round here. Would also like to go wireless I think.

To try a mic you would need to gig it, because when your singing live it's more about compromise ..... you want the vocal reproduction to be good but you also want it to pick up as little of everything else as possible. Most singers stand about 2 or 3 feet in front of the drummer ..... so your vocal mic is also a drum mic if you pick one with too wide a pattern. For small stages it has to be a moving coil cardiod to minimize spill pickup, so you can rule out any fancy condensors as they generally pickup everything. On big stages however you can be a lot further from the drums and guitar cabs and with IEM's rather than wedges you have more latitude. 

I learnt a lot about spill when I was doing shedloads of live multitracking bands on small stages before I had a studio. It's only when you have to mix tracks with all this spill you realize how much spill has gotten into  everything. I used to take an E945 for the lead vocalists and E906's for guitars on all mobile sessions to counter this

The video Maltingsaudio posted with Dave Rat explains it well in terms of the pickup pattern and proximity. If you singer eats the mic all the time like mine does, then a mic with a tight pattern is ideal and you can enjoy superb off axis rejection. But if your singer pulls away to the sides of the mic then a really tight pattern probably wouldn't suit

In terms of frequency response you only need to cover about 100hz to around 14K and pretty much all of them can do that. The fine frequency response details of a mic that you would notice in the studio get lost through your typical PA when you play live to a large degree ..... especially if your PA isn't top notch

crunchman

I've not used many, but I definitely prefer the Beta 58 to the normal 58.

ESBlonde

crunchman said:

I've not used many, but I definitely prefer the Beta 58 to the normal 58.

The original 58 was designed for the sound systems available at the end of the 1960s and was rightly regarded as the industry standard for a couple of decades (especially during the punk era). It's reputation was secured by the Shure guarantee in the USA, if you returned a broken mic they gave you a new one FOC  but that is null and void outside the USA so they are more expensive and not so repairable verses the cost. But sound systems and technology have moved a long way since then and so the standard 58 is an also ran and expensive for what it is in the UK (but still a very usable mic).

AlanP

Thanks for the great input chaps... 

(And a very good point from ESB regarding susceptibility to feedback...)

Cheers

Alan

monquixote

I would always get a 58 just because when you play festivals or other places with gear provided you always end up with a 58 so it's good to already be used to them.

Danny1969

monquixote said:

I would always get a 58 just because when you play festivals or other places with gear provided you always end up with a 58 so it's good to already be used to them.

Lol that's true but your not getting a 58 cos we think it's a great mic, it's just the bare minimum people expect if they didn't specifically ask for something better on their tech rider Those who do ask tend to be all Audix and Senn motivated although the Beta 52 and SM81 are still popular for drums

ICBM

I like the 58 because it's an absolutely known quantity for soundmen, isn't particularly feedback-prone, doesn't break easily, and doesn't sound any worse than any other mic through an average bar-band PA. If you're playing nicer gigs you may want a nicer mic.

A tip, engrave your name on it. This is my SM58, there are many like it but this one is mine. Saves arguments at shared-equipment gigs when you want to take your SM58 (which you bring and use because it only has *your* germs on it) away at the end of your set.

koneguitarist

I still use a SM58 for all the band vocals, as I know they will always work.

Danny1969

Reading this thread you can kinda see why SM58's still sell so well

koneguitarist

I am sure there are better mic's, even my old Peavey one is louder and clearer.

Would like drummer to try a different mic though, as he has quite a soft mid range vocal, hard to get him to cut through without too much cymbals.

fretmeister

Have to try them out really.

I did, and I ended up with a TC Helicon MP-75

Really close to the SM58 Beta, but there was just something that I liked more about the TC. Been very happy with it.

ESBlonde

koneguitarist said:

I am sure there are better mic's, even my old Peavey one is louder and clearer.

Would like drummer to try a different mic though, as he has quite a soft mid range vocal, hard to get him to cut through without too much cymbals.

Then (I might make this into a record) the Beta57a has a very tight pattern, alternatively the Audix OM7. Failing that get a headset with a differoid mic which is a dual diaphragm noise cancelling device the crown CM311a, the Crown CM310a (pricey) is a good handheld example (but discontinued)! Differoid mics MUST be kissed but are designed for areas of high ambient noise. No one mic is louder than another if the gain is set correctly, the difference comes in it's ability to clearly reproduce the intended signal and reject the other signals whilst not feeding back.