How do *you* learn cover songs ?

Emp_Fab

I haven't played for a couple of years since the last band split, but now we're having another go at it and I'm finding it really hard to learn the new numbers for some reason - probably just out of practice at...er.. practising !  How do you approach learning new covers ?  Do you get the chords / tab off the internet, or work it out for yourself ?  More importantly, how much time do you spend on each number ? 

I'm just getting bogged down and find it's taking me forever.  I don't remember it being this painful before.

Fez

I like to have backing tracks like the licklibrary ones if they are available if they are not then I program my own in reaper. Internet tabs are often questionable in terms of accuracy, some youtube vids are ok. I find writing the arrangement out with the typed lyrics helps.

Also there is no substitute for studying the songs, set up a playlist on your mp3 player and listen in the car while your driving about.

My thought for nought.

not_the_dj

If it's a song I'm not that familiar with I'll listen to it a lot before even picking up the guitar.

 Then when I've got familiar with the song I'll look for Internet tabs or YouTube clips and then sit down with that and go through it. Usually internet tabs have errors of course so I always take them with a pinch of salt, using them as a starting point to base my version on.

 It's then a case of breaking the songs down into parts and practicing each before knitting it all together.

Depending on the complexity I'll play each new song a lot, and remembering to practice standing up as that change of stance can make a huge difference. 

I tend to make a playlist of new songs on my phone/iPod i'll then have those on repeat in the car so I can really get the songs under my skin. 

jd0272

I tend not to fck about and try and get it down quick. Generally listen a few times, find the key and changes, note it down, and any problems I just hit Youtube.

I'm mostly rhythm as I'm bone idle, but if Pete insists I do a solo, I'll get the vibe for it via the track, and improv'.

not_the_dj

....if it's a really tricky part then it's a case of playing it over and over again again and again. This week I've been learning "Green Tinted Sixties Mind" by Mr Big (not actually for the band, but as a challange). I've had to go through that intro so many times to get it smooth, but it's been so rewarding to nail it.

Emp_Fab

But by the time you've nailed it, you're absolutely sick to death of it - right ? :-)

not_the_dj

Emp_Fab said:

But by the time you've nailed it, you're absolutely sick to death of it - right ? :-)

I genuinely can't think of a song we play that has been tricky to learn that I'm sick off. I probably spent the most time learning "Sultans of Swing" a few years back and I still love the song. Same with the Thin Lizzy version of "Whiskey on the Jar" and that Eric Bell solo. Those are the rare songs in our set that I learnt note for note, most others I get the general structure and feel down then then see if I can noodle over it. 

There are of course songs in the set I don't care for, but they're mostky the easy standards I don't really need to think about or brush up on before gigs (eg Sweet Home Alabama). 

jd0272

not_the_dj said:

Emp_Fab said:

But by the time you've nailed it, you're absolutely sick to death of it - right ? :-)

I genuinely can't think of a song we play that has been tricky to learn that I'm sick off. I probably spent the most time learning "Sultans of Swing" a few years back and I still love the song. Same with the Thin Lizzy version of "Whiskey on the Jar" and that Eric Bell solo. Those are the rare songs in our set that I learnt note for note, most others I get the general structure and feel down then then see if I can noodle over it. 

There are of course songs in the set I don't care for, but they're mostky the easy standards I don't really need to think about or brush up on before gigs (eg Sweet Home Alabama). 

I detest Alabama, mainly because the rest of 'em want to 'simplify' it for live use (ie; the rhythm part/parts, which is a doddle. but 'apparently' complicates the sound....grrrr)..

Grunfeld

Emp_Fab said:

How do you approach learning new covers ?

1)  Load the music into Transcribe!
2)  "Map" the parts of the song.  I generally add a measure marker on every bar and a section marker on every section, e.g. intro/ verse/ pre-chorus/ chorus/ bridge/ breakdown/ solo/ outro  -- those are the ones which come up over and over again.
3)  Check on YouTube for vids:  add the words "guitar tutorial" to a search of the song
4)  Practice.  Because in Transcribe you can slow it down and speed it up, and loop the tricky bars over and over till you get them right.  Top tip:  save the looped sections in the second Transcribe window "Audio Effects" and then you can come back to them whenever you want.

And it takes as long as it takes.  Some songs can be done if 5 minutes and don't need all that faffing about.  Others need to be worked through and practised more methodically with the method above. 

John_P

The main thing for me is getting a feel for the different parts and structure so I usually have a cd in the car of whatever tunes I have to learn so I hear them a lot.

Then sit down and play along - I enjoy the process of finding parts by ear, but I spend hours - if I get stuck I'll do a quick google. 

A couple of bands I play with have a bad habit of not doing songs on the list, so I often learn enough to get by any key parts then when it's a definite go after rehearsal I'll play it enough times not to rely on notes.

thomasross20

@Grunfeld - never heard of transcribe. How does it work and can it transcribe solo parts? 

This is meant to be ok for slowing things down: http://www.ronimusic.com/

I listen to the song and do as much by ear as I can, whilst googling tabs/chords and always checking songsterr. 

DesVegas

One thing i would add to the above is watch a live version of the track. Then there are no overdubbed guitars or other studio tricks, just the raw song which is how you'll be playing it.

Dominic

Re ;comments on Sweet Home Alabama................

It is not an easy song ..........its very ,very easy to roll around three chords and render a vague impression of the tune but it took my band a long time to really capture the song which has numerous little nuances and subtleties and it needs to be delivered with a real swagger -the original is numerous overdubs ( 17 I think ) with everything from acoustic and 12 string going on - its actually very difficult for a live 5 piece to do a good convincing version - you really do hear loads of awful covers -the monotony is what makes it difficult ..........by contrast we put together a very decent Sultans of Swing in 2 sessions

 Alabama is very deceptive and is a very tight groove and nothing is worse than a " pub " version.

Roland

DesVegas said:

One thing i would add to the above is watch a live version of the track. Then there are no overdubbed guitars or other studio tricks, just the raw song which is how you'll be playing it.

Definitely this.  It also shows what the artist thought of the song, and how it developed over time.  After a few listens I map out the structure of the song, and get the chords down. Then I transcribe any riffs and solos, this not only gets then written down for future reference, but helps me understand how they work, and remember how to play them.  At first rehearsal we check the key with the singer, and may transpose up or down a bit, after which I write it out again in the new key.

bingefeller

If you're trying to work out a guitar part I find this can be helpful for some songs:

• Make a copy of the song so you don't ruin the original audio file.
  
• 
  
• Drop it into Audacity.
  
• 
  
• Split the stereo track to mono.
  
• 
  
• Highlight the bottom track.
  
• 
  
• Go to effects and choose invert.
• Export the song and Audacity will mix it to a single mono track.  

Now you should have the vocals pushed back into the mix and the guitar will be prominent.   As I said, this doesn't work on all songs, it just depends on how they're mixed.  When you do this the lead solo may also be pushed back, but you can just refer back to  your original audio file for that.

hywelg

Listen to it loads, but do make sure all the band are listening to the same version.

Fisrt thing I do is load it into Amazing Slow Downer and divide it into sections Intro, Verse 1, Chorus, Bridge Outro etc and save the loops. Anything special like a guitar solo gets its own loop saved. Any choruses or verses that a have variantions are noted.

Then I'll hunt down a lyrics sheet for it and check it agains the actual song (so many are wrong)

Then i'll try and find a chord sheet in the internet, only as a starting point (again so many are just plain wrong)

Then i create a song sheet in Word with chords above the lyrics, checking the timing and chords. That serves to help memorise the structure and make it plain for the band.

After that its just playing it many times, especially any solos, often slowed down and tabbed out if I need to memorise it. The song sheet goes out to the rest of the band so they will all work to the same sheet. Invariably the sheet gets adapted after we've played it, usually the outro.

First few times at rehrearsal will be with the song sheet, then I try and leave it alone otherwise it becomes a prop which is difficult to lose.

stickyfiddle

I get everything I'm learning on an ipod playlist, preferably between 4 and 10 songs (less gets tedious, more gets too heavy to take in) and listen to that on repeat for a good couple of days.

Then I'll sit down with a guitar and work out chords, changes and anything that's not obvious how to play after those couple of days.

Then I'll go through and write down structures a couple of times while listening to the record (intro - verse x2 - chorus - verse x1 - chorus, mid8, chorus, etc).

If I'm still struggling on anything I'll look up a couple of tabs or lessons for the fiddly bits.

For me the key things are the self-learning and actual process of note-making that really help get something in my head.

Dominic said:

Re ;comments on Sweet Home Alabama................

It is not an easy song ..........its very ,very easy to roll around three chords and render a vague impression of the tune but it took my band a long time to really capture the song which has numerous little nuances and subtleties and it needs to be delivered with a real swagger -the original is numerous overdubs ( 17 I think ) with everything from acoustic and 12 string going on - its actually very difficult for a live 5 piece to do a good convincing version - you really do hear loads of awful covers -the monotony is what makes it difficult ..........by contrast we put together a very decent Sultans of Swing in 2 sessions

 Alabama is very deceptive and is a very tight groove and nothing is worse than a " pub " version.

Agree with this 100%. Like Johnny B Goode, it's actually quite piano-heavy and the guitar parts aren't just bashing at chords.

koneguitarist

We tend to put songs on spotify for whole band to listen to the same version of the song, then try it at a sound check, if it works, we stick it in set, if not we try it again a couple of weeks later, if it doesn't work then, we drop it and move on.

 We never rehearse as a band apart from maybe once a year if we need it. 

For me personally I will listen to it without a guitar a few times, work out changes in my head. 

Then get a guitar for the key and bluff a solo. 

Danny1969

not_the_dj said:

....if it's a really tricky part then it's a case of playing it over and over again again and again. This week I've been learning "Green Tinted Sixties Mind" by Mr Big (not actually for the band, but as a challange). I've had to go through that intro so many times to get it smooth, but it's been so rewarding to nail it.

I used to do that, really cool intro and a good song

I use all the tricks people have said already. I slow it down, phase invert one side, use a high Q boost on the mid to accent the guitar. If the tracks used in Guitar Hero or Rock band I will get the Mogg file so I can solo the guitar. 

@Dominic ;

Your right about SWH and that's the reason I don't like doing it. Unless your prepared to put some real effort into it it's just a 3 chord mess that doesn't sound anything like the studio recording. 

I never use tab, I'm vain enough to think I can do a better job than most internet tabs

Jalapeno

Most important - agree with band mates which version you are trying to cover

Must confess, I'm lazy, and we don't gig (or even practice) regularly enough to learn stuff - I use cheat sheets, and am migrating to iPad IGigBook

And another +1 for Transcribe - though it isn't a silver bullet - it still takes time and patience.

Grunfeld

thomasross20 said:

@Grunfeld - never heard of transcribe. How does it work and can it transcribe solo parts? 

This is meant to be ok for slowing things down: http://www.ronimusic.com/

I listen to the song and do as much by ear as I can, whilst googling tabs/chords and always checking songsterr. 

@thomasross20 ; -- I think it was Adrian Clark from "The Collective" days who gave me the heads up on Transcribe!  -- that what he used, and as a professional transcriber I reckoned he was worth listening to.  I've used it ever since, I'm a huge fan of it, and I've tried most of the other programs and yep, they all work just fine, but what Transcribe! has is everything all in one package, ready-to-hand, with the most straight-forward workflow that I could wish for.  It's not free but it's like, £25, which is a steal.  (30 day free trial.)

I've posted this before but here's a really nice example of Transcribe! in action with the fiddly bit from GnR's "SCOM".  It's not just the "slow down" facility of Transcribe! which makes it the best, for me, it's the practice options:  e.g. looping a lick, slowing it, and having it play x number of times before increasing the speed y percent. 

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/25971574/transcribe_demo_gnr.mp3