Is there a decline in the popularity of PRS guitars ?

Bogwhoppit

I considered buying a PRS towards the end of last year, but other things got in the way.  I've recently noted that he majority of the ones I mulled over are still up for sale, despite several price reductions.

welshboyo

seems to be the case, not so much the decline in popularity, more a decline in prices...but thats something I'm seeing across the boutique genre at the moment - guitars and amps, pedals not so much..

grungebob

I wondered this too, I've owned lots of PRS guitars as I found them to be great players but with prices on the decline I sold all but one off and put my money into some nice playing gibsons. Seems daft now I think about it, maybe if I don't bond with the G's I'll swap back?

ICBM

It seems daft to be selling my last one now when the prices are so depressed as well, but... I've just moved on and I don't need it. I'm losing money on it, but if you divide by the years of use I had out of it it's not a bad deal really.

@Bogwhoppit - was it you that wanted my Standard 22? I can't remember.

jeztone2

I think its a question of fashion. In the early 2000's they were very popular. But less so now. I was gonna sell mine. Because Id not played it much. But then for the last 6 weeks Ive played it loads. So much so I bought another one. I sort of struggle with Gibson. They are like Leica camera's in that I know its a classic design, but given the price. A Fuji X series does it better. Ive owned 4 Gibson's and the inconsistancy of build just became too much. I think people have gone back to Fender & Gibson recently. Maybe the guitarist seeking modern sounds wants a Suhr? But then if the next Kurt Cobain or Bonamassa is playing a PRS... These are just random ramblings...I have no conclusion

RaymondLin

There are just more of them, more S2 and SE line as well, not to mention all the used ones are normally in great condition so it means you need to price even lower to sell one.

Great time to buy a PRS if you always wanted one or to try one.

guitarfishbay

I don't think (actual completed) used guitar prices are ever coming back up personally.

Some brands are faring a bit better than others but on the whole anything being sold privately around the £1k mark is struggling for a market right now from what I can tell.

I wonder how many shops without an easy access credit plan will still be selling expensive guitars in the coming years, new or used.

crunchman

2nd hand PRS prices are really low at the moment.  It's a good time to buy if you want one.

There was a lot of hype about PRS 15 or 20 or so years ago.  They were relatively new.  Magazines were full of how wonderful they were.  Nice maple tops were really popular as well.  As a result I think a lot of people (me included) went out and bought them based on all the reviews and hype.  I'd seen all the magazine reviews and how pretty they looked and wanted a PRS.  When I got the money to buy a nice guitar  I didn't even try any Gibsons or Fenders - I just went out looking for a PRS.  Over a 9 year period I bought 6 US PRS - although I don't think I had any more than 2 at any one time.  That level of hype seems to have dissipated now, and the flash maple tops are not as fashionable.

There are also quite a few people who bought them back in the day who have moved on and are getting rid of them.  @ICBM says he's selling his last one.  I sold my last one last year.  Now I'm a bit older and more experienced I tend to try guitars for myself without the prejudices of magazines telling me what is the latest greatest thing, and I've come to the conclusion that a decent Gibson sounds better to me for humbucker sounds, and a good Fender is better for single coil sounds.  I don't think we're alone in that.  I've seen enough comments to suggest other PRS owners have done the same and there seems to be a lot more supply second hand than there is demand.

They are very well built guitars but there is something about them that doesn't quite do it for me tonally.  I still love the look of them but I don't really see myself getting another, although I am tempted when I see a guitar advertised for £1000 that would have been advertised for £1450 a few years ago. 

Skipped

Looks to me like a whole load of stuff is not selling at the moment (not just PRS). Here in the Classifieds and elsewhere.
How can that be the case during a "strong recovery"?
Will the thread now be moved to Speakers Corner?

I have never owned a PRS guitar. I did once pick one up in a shop.

richardhomer

I think there is a general lack of demand for more expensive guitars.

According to a dealer I was talking to, Fender has cut Custom Shop production, Gibson produce a 'better' R whatever every year to bolster demand and PRS have introduced the S2s - presumably because they believe there are more sales to be had in that price bracket.

The 'boutique' market (I'm really not a fan of that phrase, but it seems widely used) is saturated. There are Andersons in the Classifieds on here at Fender Deluxe Series prices.

It seems to me that all these companies are waiting for demand to return to pre-recession levels - something which I'm unconvinced will happen. The 'stock' of guitar players is diminishing as fewer kids take up the instrument - and high housing costs put a break on most people's spending in their 30s and 40s these days. Older players will either give up or die.

I have met PRS - he is a remarkable man; full of energy and passion. I believe he may be the last truly great 'mass market' guitar builder.

I think the high-end future will be very different in 20 years time. The Monteliones of this world will survive - the big boys will inevitably have to scale down their operations, or go out of business.

thomasross20

Good point on high housing costs!! Killer!!

I've said before I'm tempted to sell one of my new Cu24s... but I would always keep one as honestly, they play like perfection. Bummer is I love the Orange one but the neck on the purple one feels like velvet so don't want to get rid of either (or swap necks, before anybody says it!). But that leaves me with 3 electrics which I think may be a bit much. I'd lose about £800-1k on the PRS if I sold. 

They're good guitars, though - I don't buy all this PRS hate. Total rubbish! 

Agree the high-end market is becoming saturated, and people more skint! 

Adam_MD

thomasross20 said:

Good point on high housing costs!! Killer!!

I've said before I'm tempted to sell one of my new Cu24s... but I would always keep one as honestly, they play like perfection. Bummer is I love the Orange one but the neck on the purple one feels like velvet so don't want to get rid of either (or swap necks, before anybody says it!). But that leaves me with 3 electrics which I think may be a bit much. I'd lose about £800-1k on the PRS if I sold. 

They're good guitars, though - I don't buy all this PRS hate. Total rubbish! 

Agree the high-end market is becoming saturated, and people more skint! 

You bought both your PRS new recently didn't you?  If so do not sell unless you have to - you'll take a mahoosive loss on whichever one you shift.

Chalky

Quite a few set-neck US-built PRS's on the secondhand market are now nudging down towards or under the psychologically important £1000 mark. The potential number of buyers at that price increases significantly. That makes secondhand PRS's being offered at say £1400 and higher look expensive. New PRS are bought by people who buy NEW only. If rich folks get big bonuses next month then the PRS-loving guitarists among them are likely to buy new PRS, not secondhand, and maybe trade in their old one. So the secondhand market is likely to saturate more as secondhand supply continues to exceed demand until prices bottom out around £1000ish. In other words around £1000 is increasingly going to be the 'mid' price for a secondhand PRS.

There's a separate discussion to be had about where do new younger PRS buyers come from...

Bogwhoppit

ICBM said:

@Bogwhoppit - was it you that wanted my Standard 22? I can't remember.

@ICBM Not that I remember ? I was looking at the 513s at the time.

crunchman

richardhomer said:

I think there is a general lack of demand for more expensive guitars.

According to a dealer I was talking to, Fender has cut Custom Shop production, Gibson produce a 'better' R whatever every year to bolster demand and PRS have introduced the S2s - presumably because they believe there are more sales to be had in that price bracket.

The 'boutique' market (I'm really not a fan of that phrase, but it seems widely used) is saturated. There are Andersons in the Classifieds on here at Fender Deluxe Series prices.

It seems to me that all these companies are waiting for demand to return to pre-recession levels - something which I'm unconvinced will happen. The 'stock' of guitar players is diminishing as fewer kids are take up the instrument - and high housing costs put a break on most people's spending in their 30s and 40s these days. Older players will either give up or die.

I have met PRS - he is a remarkable man; full of energy and passion. I believe he may be the last truly great 'mass market' guitar builder.

I think the high-end future will be very different in 20 years time. The Monteliones of this world will survive - the big boys will inevitably have to scale down their operations, or go out of business.

I think you are right about the general slow down, but PRS seems to be more affected than some other brands.  The 2001 Singlecut I sold last year cost the original owner £3000 - he left the receipt in the case when I bought it.  I sold it on commission in a shop for £1400 (I saw £1190 after commission).  That's 47% of the original new sale price.  Other premium brands would still fetch at least 60% of original sale price.

RaymondLin

I am amazed at some of the prices some people ask for on the Facebook group though, I've seen some asking £2k for a single cut...you can buy a new one for less from the states.

I have 3 PRS, don't plan to get rid of any one of them but then all 3 came to less than a single Gibson R9 so that's value for money for the guitar you get.

jeztone2

This is really a wider question. Will the recession ever really end? I sort of see the current economic situation as " by design" and one that I think all major political parties have colluded on with big business. The creation of a casualised, low income, asset stripped populace. Retail wages have been stagnant for more than a decade. The amount of people getting working Tax credits in 1992 was 600,000 now its nearly 7 million. Could it be that someone wants to devalue the used guitar market to make a crappy ISA seem a better place to put money?

crunchman

jeztone2 said:

This is really a wider question. Will the recession ever really end? I sort of see the current economic situation as " by design" and one that I think all major political parties have colluded on with big business. The creation of a casualised, low income, asset stripped populace. Retail wages have been stagnant for more than a decade. The amount of people getting working Tax credits in 1992 was 600,000 now its nearly 7 million. Could it be that someone wants to devalue the used guitar market to make a crappy ISA seem a better place to put money?

You are right that it is part of a wider question, but the consumption of the early 2000s was driven by debt.  It's come home to roost now, and the end is not in sight for a good while yet.

Chalky

I'd take the doom and gloom about the future of guitar sales in general with a very large pinch of salt. Guitars are a fashion item and economists find it exceedingly hard to predict fashion success or failure

Bogwhoppit

jeztone2 said:

This is really a wider question.  The amount of people getting working Tax credits in 1992 was 600,000 now its nearly 7 million.

I know I'm sidetracking my own thread, but moreover, that's 7 million people currently in receipt of working tax credits, who will end up on 'universal credit' and be stereotyped as benefit scroungers. In addition, those who had savings whilst on working family tax credit (perhaps for a house deposit) will not be entitled to any UC after the change !

jeztone2

Oh I was talking about working Tax credits. I saw an article in the Evening Standard, where their own City columnist was saying wages must rise. In my place, there trying to outsource everything. Turn a £20k a year job into minimum wage. Then turn a £35-40K job into a £20 k job. Its frightening!