Chalky's Guitarist Theory - profound or bollocks?

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  • ab2014ab2014 Frets: 89
    B is completely me.
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  • Chalky said:
    Hmmm...I thought C covered the creative songwriter musician for whom the guitar is their chosen instrument. Those for whom the guitar is just a >completely< incidental component in how they make music are not guitarists in my view.
    FZ once said "I'm just a musician who happens to know how to operate an instrument called a guitar". I do rate him as a guitarist though, as well as being a composer, producer. bandleader, and all the other things he did.
    "Working" software has only unobserved bugs. (Parroty Error: Pieces of Nine! Pieces of Nine!)
    Seriously: If you value it, take/fetch it yourself
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  • impmannimpmann Frets: 12645
    Chalky;526769" said:
    @impmann said "I wrote a thesis on this 15 years ago - the same principal applies here".

    I agree with you in principle and trust your thesis wasn't spell-checked :))
    Touché!

    :-)

    The joys of doing this on a phone stuck in bed with lurgy!
    Never Ever Bloody Anything Ever.

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  • SassafrasSassafras Frets: 30273
    Strictly AC/DC here.
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  • I'm E - The Reformed Gear Whore. I've reached a point where I have the ultimate amp (for me), the ultimate guitars (for me) and the effects setup that best suits my playing. I'm now desperately trying to fill the GAS-shaped hole in my life with playing guitar, but mostly only succeeding at playing Elite: Dangerous.
    <space for hire>
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  • 57Deluxe57Deluxe Frets: 7329
    Add  - The APPRECIATOR -  - has loved guitars and players for-like-ever and now seeks to own iconic versions now that they finally can...
    <Vintage BOSS Upgrades>
    __________________________________
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  • lloydlloyd Frets: 5773
    I'm none of the above, don't own an expensive guitar or gear. Not much of a player technically or theoretical knowledge, I don't get that much enjoyment out of playing/learning songs at home on my own or to a backing track or whatever.

    I do love playing music with others though rehearsals for me are great-I get to play our tunes loud with 3 mates then get to gig them fairly regularly, which is the best bit-gigging.

    Manchester based original indie band Random White:

    https://www.facebook.com/RandomWhite

    https://twitter.com/randomwhite1

     

     

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  • Philly_QPhilly_Q Frets: 22516
    Samgb said:
    Philly_Q said:
    As I always say, I don't claim to be a guitar player, I'm just someone who likes guitars.

    I'd put myself in this category. Is that lack of confidence? Ultimately, i've been playing since i was 14. I'll be 40 in July. I can play pretty much anything i want if i put a bit of work in. When exactly am i going to consider myself a Guitar Player? God knows! I dont play in a band, havent since i was 20 or so. It's just for me really, something that makes me happy. I dont really have the urge to do anything other than play/noodle away and hopefully get a bit better every now and then. It's enough.
       

    There is a lack of confidence in my case certainly, but also a lack of any basic talent....

    I have always vaguely believed that if I put in the hard work (and somehow found the time) to learn to play a bunch of popular/classic songs "properly" then I might have a sudden breakthrough and realise that playing guitar's easier than I thought it was (I long ago stopped harbouring any ambitions of becoming an amazing sweep-pickin' lighting-fast shredder or anything like that ....).

    But there's also the fear that, even if I did acquire the ability to fumble through a few ham-fisted cover songs, I'd still be unable to pick things up well by ear and I'd still be unable to actually create anything musical. 

    I do sometimes contemplate jacking it all in but the thought of selling all those guitars is depressing and very..... final.  What would I have to obsess about afterwards?

    You, on the other hand, sound like a Guitar Player.  To me, anyway.


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  • TheOtherDennisTheOtherDennis Frets: 2010
    edited February 2015

    Philly_Q said:
    Samgb said:
    Philly_Q said:
    As I always say, I don't claim to be a guitar player, I'm just someone who likes guitars.

    I'd put myself in this category. Is that lack of confidence? Ultimately, i've been playing since i was 14. I'll be 40 in July. I can play pretty much anything i want if i put a bit of work in. When exactly am i going to consider myself a Guitar Player? God knows! I dont play in a band, havent since i was 20 or so. It's just for me really, something that makes me happy. I dont really have the urge to do anything other than play/noodle away and hopefully get a bit better every now and then. It's enough.
       

    There is a lack of confidence in my case certainly, but also a lack of any basic talent....

    I have always vaguely believed that if I put in the hard work (and somehow found the time) to learn to play a bunch of popular/classic songs "properly" then I might have a sudden breakthrough and realise that playing guitar's easier than I thought it was (I long ago stopped harbouring any ambitions of becoming an amazing sweep-pickin' lighting-fast shredder or anything like that ....).

    But there's also the fear that, even if I did acquire the ability to fumble through a few ham-fisted cover songs, I'd still be unable to pick things up well by ear and I'd still be unable to actually create anything musical. 

    I do sometimes contemplate jacking it all in but the thought of selling all those guitars is depressing and very..... final.  What would I have to obsess about afterwards?

    You, on the other hand, sound like a Guitar Player.  To me, anyway.


    Me two! Except that I did learn to fumble my way through some songs and play them with a band not once, but twice. The first time was just a cobbled-together affair for a work do, and we were indulged not once, not twice but three times (over the course of about three years, mind). I was central to all three and all I really remember of any of it was the sheer terror involved. Then last year I joined a proper band to do some proper gigs in front of complete strangers. This time I was just the rhythm guy, with only a filling in the background role, and suddenly the terror had completely vanished - stage fright was bafflingly non-existent. (I was a bit nervous, but not gut-wrenchingly terror-struck, like the first time.) I did that three times before I was dropped because the main guitarist was desperate to have the stage to himself, so he threatened to leave if they didn't fire me.

    That was the closest that I've ever come to jacking it all in, but I recovered, a bit, and now I'm working my way through the Justin Sandercoe lessons on tinternet that some kind soul on here pointed me towards and its made a big difference. I'm not completely back in the groove yet, but I think there's a chance I might be getting there.

    He's worth a try, he really is. He even teaches you how to pick stuff up by ear.
    If you must have sex with a frog, wear a condom. If you want the frog to have fun, rib it.
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  • The thing I've found out about practice is that it enables me to pick new things up more quickly. I don't mean that Malmsteen would be in my muscle memory and up to speed by week 2, but more than my fingers comply more readily.

    For example, I've been learning 'Snow' by RHCP. I'm crap at arpeggiated chord picking, especially on a clean sound when all the mistakes are amplified. So, I've just gone round and round and round the main motif probably for 2 months now, in the evenings, for about 10 mins when the tv is on.

    And now my fingers work, pretty much up to speed. There's still mistakes, but they're getting fewer. If I'd tried this 10 years ago, from scratch like I have here, then it would have taken me a lot longer to get to this stage.

    In terms of ideas and creation, I find that the more I play and absorb other people's ideas, the more I get some of my own. Whether it be a chord progression, 6 note run, etc, I make a note of it and then try to use it.

    One thing that really helped me was composing my own solos to other people's tunes. They'd done the hard work in terms of setting the chords and tempo, so I had a blank canvas. Learning the original is a nice approach, but doing your own thing is cool too. Or composing two completely different solos to the same track with different vibes. You can literally take it one bar or one chord at a time and create something from start to finish that flows.

    Sorry - off topic - but was just to try to help @Philly_Q perhaps discover an inner creativity that might not yet be out in the open.
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  • ChalkyChalky Frets: 6807
    @hubobulous - I think you're on topic actually because the next question from "What type of guitarist are you" is probably what type do you see yourself becoming in the future?
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  • @hubobulous way to go man :)
    "Working" software has only unobserved bugs. (Parroty Error: Pieces of Nine! Pieces of Nine!)
    Seriously: If you value it, take/fetch it yourself
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  • SamgbSamgb Frets: 774
    Philly_Q said:
    Samgb said:
    Philly_Q said:
    As I always say, I don't claim to be a guitar player, I'm just someone who likes guitars.

    I'd put myself in this category. Is that lack of confidence? Ultimately, i've been playing since i was 14. I'll be 40 in July. I can play pretty much anything i want if i put a bit of work in. When exactly am i going to consider myself a Guitar Player? God knows! I dont play in a band, havent since i was 20 or so. It's just for me really, something that makes me happy. I dont really have the urge to do anything other than play/noodle away and hopefully get a bit better every now and then. It's enough.
       

    There is a lack of confidence in my case certainly, but also a lack of any basic talent....

    I have always vaguely believed that if I put in the hard work (and somehow found the time) to learn to play a bunch of popular/classic songs "properly" then I might have a sudden breakthrough and realise that playing guitar's easier than I thought it was (I long ago stopped harbouring any ambitions of becoming an amazing sweep-pickin' lighting-fast shredder or anything like that ....).

    But there's also the fear that, even if I did acquire the ability to fumble through a few ham-fisted cover songs, I'd still be unable to pick things up well by ear and I'd still be unable to actually create anything musical. 

    I do sometimes contemplate jacking it all in but the thought of selling all those guitars is depressing and very..... final.  What would I have to obsess about afterwards?

    You, on the other hand, sound like a Guitar Player.  To me, anyway.


    Oh God im such a fraud!
    I quit!
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  • Philly_QPhilly_Q Frets: 22516

    @hubobulous ; Thanks very much for the suggestions, much appreciated!  :D

    I shall try to check them out, especially the Justin Sandercoe lessons.  I've often thought lessons would be the way to go, but I just can't face the thought of spending weekends or wet winter evenings trudging around remote and insalubrious corners of London schlepping a gig bag.


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  • SamgbSamgb Frets: 774
    @TheOtherDennis

      I was dropped because the main guitarist was desperate to have the stage to himself, so he threatened to leave if they didn't fire me.

    Now THAT sounds like a Guitar Player!
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  • SamgbSamgb Frets: 774
    In terms of ideas and creation, I find that the more I play and absorb other people's ideas, the more I get some of my own. Whether it be a chord progression, 6 note run, etc, I make a note of it and then try to use it.


    I find this to be very true. I dont really have any my own ideas if im not playing a lot - if i put in the time, little bits and bobs of myself start to come out.
    I guess its what a Real Guitar Player calls keeping his chops up.
      
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  • HAL9000HAL9000 Frets: 9551
    Probably nearest to C. However I'm not especially excited by the solos I might play. I see my job first and foremost as supporting the singist. Fills are OK - I worry that solos are too much like self-indulgence (puts on tin hat). More than happy to be a side man. I have three guitars and no 'projects'.
    I play guitar because I enjoy it rather than because I’m any good at it
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3261
    I'm a C but with 15 guitars and a big car

    and a small willy
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • GrunfeldGrunfeld Frets: 4027
    I mostly is a C.  Playing live is a lot of fun and I like creating too.
    And I like new toys so I also tick the D box.

    Definitely not an A, and not much of a B either tbh.
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  • Chalky said:
    Hmmm...I thought C covered the creative songwriter musician for whom the guitar is their chosen instrument. Those for whom the guitar is just a >completely< incidental component in how they make music are not guitarists in my view.
    guitarist
    ɡɪˈtɑːrɪst/
    noun
    1. a person who plays the guitar.
    The Bigsby was the first successful design of what is now called a whammy bar or tremolo arm, although vibrato is the technically correct term for the musical effect it produces. In standard usage, tremolo is a rapid fluctuation of the volume of a note, while vibrato is a fluctuation in pitch. The origin of this nonstandard usage of the term by electric guitarists is attributed to Leo Fender, who also used the term “vibrato” to refer to what is really a tremolo effect.
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