Chasing Tone

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ChrisMusicChrisMusic Frets: 1133
Chasing Tone - a quest for life?

How do you see "tone" ?

What do you feel are the main contributors to that elusive "perfect sound signature" ?

A healthy open debate to follow I hope, it's a big subject - thanks for your perspectives  :)

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  • John_AJohn_A Frets: 3775

    It really is 99% in the fingers, I've seen guitarists with a squire strat and a peavey bandit that sounded amazing, and others with mega gear that sounded awful.  Doesn't stop me from trying to buy 'tone' but the things I play that sound good are the things I play well. 

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  • elkayelkay Frets: 77
    The wood used, nut/bridge material, strings, and manner of consruction are the obvious physical attributes, but there are also the imponderables like mood, temperament and what you had for breakfast, which are more difficult to pin down. Ultimately, many would say that it's in the fingers. Put any guitar in Tommy Emmanuel's hands and he'll sound like Tommy Emmanuel. Having said that, vast amounts are spent in striving to 'improve' tone, whilst, in my view, the simplest, quickest and cheapest way of shaping tone is all too often overlooked, and that is the use of picks of varying size, shape and thickness. Most guitarists I know have their one favorite, which they'll stick with regardless, whereas merely by using a heavy pick you could bring out the mellow sweetness so loved by jazzers, or open up the sound with increased sparkle and clarity by using a thin gauge pick. At the end of the day, someone will come along and kill all arguments at a single stroke with the observation that tone is subjective.


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  • ddloopingddlooping Frets: 325
    Unless you're playing solo, I consider a good "tone" whatever works, mixed with the rest of the band, in the context of a song.
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  • dindudedindude Frets: 8534

    I don't quite buy into the 99% fingers thing, I think it misses the point. Here's why: put a crap guitar and amp into the hands of a great player and they will make it sing for sure, but sing with relative crap tone that is. Likewise an inexperienced player won't get the best out of a high end rig, but their limitations are still there with a squire and a peavey amp. Anyone who thinks that buying quality gear makes them better is derranged, doesn't mean that a player doesn't want the best gear they can afford though. I find it really inspiring to play with a quality guitar or amp, it's just tools, but great tools are better than average tools.

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  • What constitutes a good tone is, of course, subjective, but there are a few things I have observed/ learned/ been shown throughout my own tone quest that apply to the kind of tone I am looking for:

    Tune up and stay in tune.
    Seriously, most beginners sound bad mostly because they are out of tune rather than actually playing the basics wrong.

    Strings - replacing worn strings more regularly has had a major impact on tuning and tone, for me.

    Technique. I don't know that I agree with the "99% in your fingers" brigade (after all, why have several different guitars then?) but I DO know that a clean technique with clear picking and accurate bending is going to make me sound better and allow notes to ring better etc.

    Learn what different settings do - I have had some major tonal breakthroughs with playing around with different amp settings and listening to the differences. Don't always stick to your "go to" settings, enjoy twiddling your knobs.

    Gain - Turning down the gain paid dividends for me

    Compressor - Also a major breakthrough. Some people don't "get" them, some people don't need them...In the right context for me it has made a huge difference.

    Enjoy different guitars - Don't expect to get everything out of one guitar, enjoy and exploit the differences.





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  • Dave_McDave_Mc Frets: 2324
    nah not really. i mean i have lots of gear, but it's all for a reason. i don't have 50 very slightly different tubescreamers, for example, as that can get silly.

    Obviously if you're using unsuitable gear for what you want to play, that's different. There's a difference between obsessing about minutiae (or worse, seeing stuff that isn't there) and buying different gear for a genuine reason.
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  • LixartoLixarto Frets: 1618
    I think it is mainly in the fingers.

    At least two people whose opinions I trust (one a musician - not guitar - and one not musical) told me I sound the same no matter what guitar I'm playing. Hey ho.
    "I can see you for what you are; an idiot barely in control of your own life. And smoking weed doesn't make you cool; it just makes you more of an idiot."
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  • Dave_McDave_Mc Frets: 2324
    When I wave my fingers around in mid-air I don't get any sound at all, though?

    Maybe I'm doing it wrong
    :-O


    Seriously, though, I agree that the player does make the biggest difference. That's pretty self-evident, if you ask me. :)
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  • monquixotemonquixote Frets: 17485
    tFB Trader
    I like dicking about with pedals and stuff, but ultimately I really only ever sound like me. 

    Doesn't stop me GASing though.
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  • ESBlondeESBlonde Frets: 3576
    Agree with the jist of those posting above. One aspect of tone is understanding how you react or more particularly how pieces of gear interact. I bought a particular echo unit many moons ago and discovered that by mismatching the output from it into the valve amp I got a different range of response from each that I could utilise. That and a thorough understanding of the guitars own controls and the impact they had. Even without specific bits of gear or possibly your favourite guitar it is possible to get back near that preferred tonal response which from experience works in context.


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  • John_AJohn_A Frets: 3775
    edited August 2013
    Dave_Mc said:
    When I wave my fingers around in mid-air I don't get any sound at all, though?

    Maybe I'm doing it wrong
    :-O


    Seriously, though, I agree that the player does make the biggest difference. That's pretty self-evident, if you ask me. :)

    No you're doing it right, no one can ever tell you it sounds bad!! ;)
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  • TTonyTTony Frets: 27343
    Lixarto said:
    I think it is mainly in the fingers.

    At least two people whose opinions I trust (one a musician - not guitar - and one not musical) told me I sound the same no matter what guitar I'm playing. Hey ho.


    I think that's largely true.

    To me, "in the fingers" means your whole playing style - your fretting technique, how you strum/pick, the sort of stuff you play, your "signature" runs or chord changes (etc).

    It's why you recognise a particular player when they're playing rather than saying that's xxx (insert name of the particular player) playing any specific guitar.

     

    Having trouble posting images here?  This might help.
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  • SkippedSkipped Frets: 2371
    Fingers are the biggest factor.
    I used to be in a band with a guy who had a beautiful 60's Fender Strat. But he lusted after my Gibson - and assumed that it was the key to my sound ( I had no idea either way - I was just a kid...)
    So we swopped for one night and he was a bit fed up that the Gibson sounded totally different is his hands.

    But other than fingers?
    Some of you will not like this. After considering the matter for several decades I come to the conclusion that the seach for tone will lead to Old Wood. But it is not as simple as that. For example, most of the 70's Norlin Gibsons I pick up sound worse then the Historics made in the last few years. But (all these comments are about Gibsons) the 50s and 60s guitars are top of the tree for me and it has nothing to do with myth, rumour,collectability or anything else. And I think they were in a different class when they were brand new*. So, for me , discussions about Old Wood need qualification.
    The Historics are getting very good (based on the 2012 guitars I have played) but even people who go crazy for these guitars are willing to admit that the closer they get to the originals - the better they are.

    Guess what that tells us about the originals......


    * People used to talk about "playing in" a new guitar but the phrase is rarely heard now. Why is that? I think it might have something to do with Plek Machines.

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  • Dave_McDave_Mc Frets: 2324
    John_A said:
    Dave_Mc said:
    When I wave my fingers around in mid-air I don't get any sound at all, though?

    Maybe I'm doing it wrong
    :-O


    Seriously, though, I agree that the player does make the biggest difference. That's pretty self-evident, if you ask me. :)

    No you're doing it right, no one can ever tell you it sounds bad!! ;)
    hehe :D

    Actually it arguably sounds better than when I'm playing a guitar  :-w
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  • Lixarto said:
    I think it is mainly in the fingers.

    At least two people whose opinions I trust (one a musician - not guitar - and one not musical) told me I sound the same no matter what guitar I'm playing. Hey ho.
    I think (to some extent) it's in the head.

    You, the player, might notice subtle (or not so subtle) differences but you can bet that 99% of your audience won't.
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  • bertiebertie Frets: 13564
    Chasing Tone - a quest for life?


    depends how fast he runs
    just because you don't, doesn't mean you can't
     just because you do, doesn't mean you should.
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  • ChrisMusicChrisMusic Frets: 1133

    Thank you to everyone for your responses and perspectives, that does make interesting reading.

    I'm not sure if I should have posted this here in "Guitars", or have put it in, or maybe to move it to, the "Off Topic" section to get to all of our 400 fellow FretBoarders?   BTW fantastic job by the team on making our new home here, testimony to how many we now have in the FB community.


    On a more philosophical note:


    this appears to be a bit like the fractal Mandlebrot set; the more you learn and think you understand, the more the picture opens up to you, and the more there is to explore and understood.

    So in a way Bertie may be right, the more you chase "tone" the more subtle nuances are revealed, and a never ending journey ensues.


    What do you think?


    There are obviously many aspects to making up "tone", how about kicking off the next section with:

     

    Your views on how instrument construction and "tone wood" choices affect the final sound and character.


    Thanks for your replies and perspectives, much appreciated.


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  • scrumhalfscrumhalf Frets: 11262
    Dave_Mc said:
    When I wave my fingers around in mid-air I don't get any sound at all, though?

    That's because your air guitar needs an air amplifier.
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  • mike_lmike_l Frets: 5700

    When photek and myself had a jam/gear test session the other evening, we played each other's guitars, and mine sounded totally different when he played them as to when I played them, even on the same (flat-out) settings......

    @scrumhalf air guitar also needs air F/X for a full air guitar session.......

    Ringleader of the Cambridge cartel, pedal champ and king of the dirt boxes (down to 21) 

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  • ChuffolaChuffola Frets: 2014
    I pretty much always sound like me, too, no matter what guitar I play.

    Lucky, then, that I sound like the perfect blend of Gilmour, Lifeson and Django Reinhardt.




    ;)
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