The Oil City Masterwound PAF-Alike thread

OilCityPickups

Seeing as Most People are not aware of the Masterwound Series of oil City pickups, I thought I would start a thread talking you through the making of one of my accurate 50s style, lower output humbucker sets. Showing you guys all the steps I go through to create these beasts inspired by the legendary PAF.

Hopefully I can shed some light and explode some myths along the way. I don't have all the answers, but I have taken apart and examined closely several 'golden era, PAFs over the years, and here's what I've found .... this may take a while lol.

Magnets:

It’s a well-documented fact that Gibson actually used alnico 2,3,4, in early PAFs, alnico 5 later as they evolved into the TTop… with no rhyme or reason to it. They simply used whatever their supplier had in stock. What the magnets did have in common was that they were rough cast not polished as a rule. Rough cast magnets ironically are more expensive than polished ones these days, but there is a subtle but noticeable difference in their sound. For the want of a better word, rough cast magnets seem a little more rounded and musical … suited to the vocal and expressive nature of the PAF (and the P90).

Rough cast alnico 4 magnet

Polished alnico 4

Later in about 1961 Gibson started to use shorter but more powerful alnico 5 magnets ... see the difference here

My masterwound series PAF-Alikes can be ordered with alnico 2 or 4 or 5 in rough cast or polished, depending on preference and pickup style ... alnico 3 to follow shortly.

The low down on potting and pickup components next time ...

OilCityPickups

Potting: or rather not potting is also a subtle factor in the PAF tone.  Personally I don’t believe you can take a modern pickup, use modern building methods and leave it un-potted successfully. It will squeal like a pig. The actual construction of 50s PAFs were more structurally rigid than many of today’s pickups, causing less ‘free play’ between components … and so the design could get away with being un-potted at relatively much higher gain levels than a modern pickup with sloppily fitting components. To that end in my Masterwound PAF-Alikes I use threaded nickel silver base plates, where the pole screw has no ‘slop’ as it passes through.

This is a modern base-plate with over sized holes

And I use drawn and drilled ‘keeper bars’ or ‘pole shoes’ exactly as used in the 50s, as they are a much tighter fit on the pole screws. 

Left is a modern spec one, punched out. Right is one of our US made, drawn and machined steel ones.

More on bobbins and wire shortly :-)

Jez6345789

Nice keep it coming

Skodadad

Never really occurred to me you could learn anything from looking at old pickups. I am messing with an old 2373b Ibanez bass with some fancy assed looking Maxon pickups. It's a long way from completion so if you can learn anything you are welcome to dismantle one?

Megii

Great thread, following with interest, cheers!

rsvmark

Great stuff. More please!

OilCityPickups

Thanks for the comments everyone. and I'd like to take you up on that @Skodadad

As I said, next I will be going into bobbins and wire ... then I will take you through a complete PAF-Alike build showing you every stage. Its fun to invite you guys 'into my workshop' ... gives you an idea of the time, effort and research that goes into Oil City Pickups :-)

Skodadad

Let me have your address mate I'll post you one, or do you need both? Not sure if they are different

OilCityPickups

I'll PM you later :-)

TTony

Thanks for sharing @TheGuitarWeasel

OilCityPickups

TTony said:

Thanks for sharing @TheGuitarWeasel

Don't mention it ... 

There is a lot of total hogwash talked online about the PAF, and as I hadn't seen another winder go into this much detail ... I thought this might help explode some myths, Show the bits that really matter ... and the bits that tend to get over hyped, 

So few people have had the opportunity to try a guitar fitted with the legendary 'genuine article' that people only get an idea through recordings of famous stars. Back when I worked as a repair man in a music shop in the 70s we handled and played a lot of PAFs ... and there were just as many bad ones as good ones. But the bad ones didn't get chosen for recordings ... and were probably binned in favour of the new fangled Super Distortions that I remember fitting to so many nice old Gibsons at that time. :-)

JCA2550

This is destined to be a "pinned" killer thread.

impmann

Nail hit!

The bollocks spoken by some winders on this subject could fertilise a lawn.

An old friend owns a 1961/2 Les Paul SG. The bridge pickup had been switched for a DiMarzio, but the original came with it. I swapped it back for him and it sounded weedy and yet middly and honky.

The DiMarzio is back in there - where it will probably remain as he loves it!

the_jaffa

Thank you for all the info Ash, great to see you builder guys going into this kind of detail on here for us punters.

What is it that causes the squeal in an unpotted pickup?  Is it a resonance thing? 

xJonnysixstring

Great info keep it up! I find the main issues is peoples pre conceived perception of what a PAF should sound like, this is based on a handful of instruments that people reference having never used the original pickup in anger in a period instrument. Most guys reference, Page/Clapton/Green-Moore/kossoff in my experience, which in reality is four instruments that have spawned a whole obsession! A great PAF sounds great, But there are some bloody awful ones too! A great Shaw in my opinion is as good as it gets.

Ash is right tight fitting components, a consistent wind and quality ingredients will make a great pickup that WILL fulfil your PAF obsession as long as you are realistic about what the pickup is technically capable of delivering. Keep up the good work sir

OilCityPickups

the_jaffa said:

Thank you for all the info Ash, great to see you builder guys going into this kind of detail on here for us punters.

What is it that causes the squeal in an unpotted pickup?  Is it a resonance thing? 

Any part of a pickup that can move will act like the diaphragm, coil and magnet in a dynamic microphone and turn your pickup microphonic. Hence squeal. 

It is less often loose, unpotted winding wire that causes squeal, more often loose magnets, poorly fitting keeper bars, and the chief culprit, improperly fitted covers. 

Cheap lower output humbuckers often rely on loads of wax ... often vacuum impregnated ... everywhere, even where not needed, to make up for slack tolerances. Their harmonic richness is compromised because a tiny bit of microphonic response from a pickup is in fact good. Super high output pickups can stand higher levels of potting as their frequency response can be more tightly focused without problems.

OilCityPickups

Jonnysixstring said:

Great info keep it up! I find the main issues is peoples pre conceived perception of what a PAF should sound like, this is based on a handful of instruments that people reference having never used the original pickup in anger in a period instrument. Most guys reference, Page/Clapton/Green-Moore/kossoff in my experience, which in reality is four instruments that have spawned a whole obsession! A great PAF sounds great, But there are some bloody awful ones too! A great Shaw in my opinion is as good as it gets.

Ash is right tight fitting components, a consistent wind and quality ingredients will make a great pickup that WILL fulfil your PAF obsession as long as you are realistic about what the pickup is technically capable of delivering. Keep up the good work sir

You've hit it on the nose, as I would expect from another winder. Those four examples were fed through idiosyncratic amp set ups, through analogue desks and mics ... and that is what many base their expectations on. There is no fairy dust or magic bullets in PAF winding, just the best components, the tightest tolerances, and intelligent, consistent winds. 

xJonnysixstring

TheGuitarWeasel said:

Jonnysixstring said:

Great info keep it up! I find the main issues is peoples pre conceived perception of what a PAF should sound like, this is based on a handful of instruments that people reference having never used the original pickup in anger in a period instrument. Most guys reference, Page/Clapton/Green-Moore/kossoff in my experience, which in reality is four instruments that have spawned a whole obsession! A great PAF sounds great, But there are some bloody awful ones too! A great Shaw in my opinion is as good as it gets.

Ash is right tight fitting components, a consistent wind and quality ingredients will make a great pickup that WILL fulfil your PAF obsession as long as you are realistic about what the pickup is technically capable of delivering. Keep up the good work sir

You've hit it on the nose, as I would expect from another winder. Those four examples were fed through idiosyncratic amp set ups, through analogue desks and mics ... and that is what many base their expectations on. There is no fairy dust or magic bullets in PAF winding, just the best components, the tightest tolerances, and intelligent, consistent winds. 

I have honestly had a guy request a true PAF un-potted, then complain and bring it back when it squeals through a EVH amp high gain at full whack! but then the same pickup through a cooking Suhr Badger is simply orgasmic! I find that sometimes our job is to act as a kind of counsellor and adjust things to match the player, which at our level we have that luxury to do. Support the little guys people you won't get this service from anyone else

I love the PAF thing and own more than one period instrument with them in, but in honesty I always go for a hotter bridge pickup matched with a neck PAF or recreation.

Evilmags

I've got a couple of Ash's custom shop PAF a likes in my Heritage and they are nicer than anything that's been in their before.

OilCityPickups

Jonnysixstring said:

TheGuitarWeasel said:

Jonnysixstring said:

Great info keep it up! I find the main issues is peoples pre conceived perception of what a PAF should sound like, this is based on a handful of instruments that people reference having never used the original pickup in anger in a period instrument. Most guys reference, Page/Clapton/Green-Moore/kossoff in my experience, which in reality is four instruments that have spawned a whole obsession! A great PAF sounds great, But there are some bloody awful ones too! A great Shaw in my opinion is as good as it gets.

Ash is right tight fitting components, a consistent wind and quality ingredients will make a great pickup that WILL fulfil your PAF obsession as long as you are realistic about what the pickup is technically capable of delivering. Keep up the good work sir

You've hit it on the nose, as I would expect from another winder. Those four examples were fed through idiosyncratic amp set ups, through analogue desks and mics ... and that is what many base their expectations on. There is no fairy dust or magic bullets in PAF winding, just the best components, the tightest tolerances, and intelligent, consistent winds. 

I have honestly had a guy request a true PAF un-potted, then complain and bring it back when it squeals through a EVH amp high gain at full whack! but then the same pickup through a cooking Suhr Badger is simply orgasmic! I find that sometimes our job is to act as a kind of counsellor and adjust things to match the player, which at our level we have that luxury to do. Support the little guys people you won't get this service from anyone else

I love the PAF thing and own more than one period instrument with them in, but in honesty I always go for a hotter bridge pickup matched with a neck PAF or recreation.

Yup I think of myself as a 'sound counselor' ... we give you what the big guys simply haven't the time to do ... advice....

And in my own gigging instruments I go hotter at the bridge too. When you wind you realise DC resistance is not everything, you can create a hotter bridge pickup with tone ... it's just a matter of restraint.

the_jaffa

TheGuitarWeasel said:

the_jaffa said:

Thank you for all the info Ash, great to see you builder guys going into this kind of detail on here for us punters.

What is it that causes the squeal in an unpotted pickup?  Is it a resonance thing? 

Any part of a pickup that can move will act like the diaphragm, coil and magnet in a dynamic microphone and turn your pickup microphonic. Hence squeal. 

It is less often loose, unpotted winding wire that causes squeal, more often loose magnets, poorly fitting keeper bars, and the chief culprit, improperly fitted covers. 

Cheap lower output humbuckers often rely on loads of wax ... often vacuum impregnated ... everywhere, even where not needed, to make up for slack tolerances. Their harmonic richness is compromised because a tiny bit of microphonic response from a pickup is in fact good. Super high output pickups can stand higher levels of potting as their frequency response can be more tightly focused without problems.

Nice one, thank you.  Cheers for explaining that