Ways to beef up guitar when you're the only guitarist?

EricTheWeary

I was watching some Police stuff recently and you never think 'oh it needs more stuff going on.' Like Walking on the Moon which is sparse with very little happening on guitar (although there are overdubs on the studio version) and bass, it's a vocal and drums song almost.

My general criticism of pub level cover bands is that every song is intro then everyone in playing all the time until the song ends and there are no dynamics. At least the OP won't have a second guitarist to tell to shut up.

PolarityMan

EricTheWeary;1103466" said:

I was watching some Police stuff recently and you never think 'oh it needs more stuff going on.' Like Walking on the Moon which is sparse with very little happening on guitar (although there are overdubs on the studio version) and bass, it's a vocal and drums song almost.

My general criticism of pub level cover bands is that every song is intro then everyone in playing all the time until the song ends and there are no dynamics. At least the OP won't have a second guitarist to tell to shut up.

wis'd

BigMonka

EricTheWeary said:

I was watching some Police stuff recently and you never think 'oh it needs more stuff going on.' Like Walking on the Moon which is sparse with very little happening on guitar (although there are overdubs on the studio version) and bass, it's a vocal and drums song almost.

My general criticism of pub level cover bands is that every song is intro then everyone in playing all the time until the song ends and there are no dynamics. At least the OP won't have a second guitarist to tell to shut up.

Totally agree - there's something very intimidating about being on a stage in front of people when you're not playing much, so loads of people will over compensate for their lack of confidence by playing loads and not leaving any space (even to the detriment of the music/band)

EricTheWeary

BigMonka;1103622" said:

EricTheWeary said:

I was watching some Police stuff recently and you never think 'oh it needs more stuff going on.' Like Walking on the Moon which is sparse with very little happening on guitar (although there are overdubs on the studio version) and bass, it's a vocal and drums song almost.



My general criticism of pub level cover bands is that every song is intro then everyone in playing all the time until the song ends and there are no dynamics. At least the OP won't have a second guitarist to tell to shut up.





Totally agree - there's something very intimidating about being on a stage in front of people when you're not playing much, so loads of people will over compensate for their lack of confidence by playing loads and not leaving any space (even to the detriment of the music/band)

Just to bring it back to the Discussion, part of my point is that the smaller the band the easier it should be to play with those dynamics. If you are in the audience in a pub or club then a band can be a bit of a wall of noise, you hear the rise and fall more than the notes sometimes. If everything is five minutes of all in thump thump thump then everything starts to sound the same. In a three peice then there are probably moments when you shouldn't play any guitar at all because it sounds bigger when it comes back in.

RocknRollDave

EricTheWeary said:

I was watching some Police stuff recently and you never think 'oh it needs more stuff going on.' Like Walking on the Moon which is sparse with very little happening on guitar (although there are overdubs on the studio version) and bass, it's a vocal and drums song almost.

My general criticism of pub level cover bands is that every song is intro then everyone in playing all the time until the song ends and there are no dynamics. At least the OP won't have a second guitarist to tell to shut up.

The Police used backing tracks when they played their reunion tour, I believe. They still all played their respective instruments, and in Sting's case sang live too obviously, so it shouldn't detract from how awesome the shows were but still...



EDIT: Should add that I totally agree with your second part, about lack of dynamics when everyone plays over every part.
There's a great Clash record...Police and Thieves maybe?...where there is a kind of call-and-response thing between the two guitars, with Mick Jones kind of adding a chopping little thing at the end of each phrase rather than just Ramonesing his way through everything with barre chords, and it sound so much better for it.

Danny1969

It's apples and oranges though yeah you can play the police cream Hendrix with one guitar and it sounds absolutely fine but when you try and cover something like Bon Jovi or the Eagles with one guitar it doesn't

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When Andy Summers does a bit of a solo on message in a bottle it sounds flat as hell which is why they used backing tracks on the last tour and why Queen used a keys player and Muse use a keyboard player ( and a whole host of other backing including backing vocals ) and even Green Day had a second or sometimes third guitarist when I saw them.
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Even good old ZZ Top were using a little bit of packing when I saw them live a few years ago and they are the masters of the one guitar band

RocknRollDave

As it happens, I have been watching/ listening to a lot of live ZZ Top stuff of late, and there are lots of times where it is just screaming out for a second guitarist or a keyboard.....although yeah there are lots of times where they have stuff on tape too.

Sporky

Solution: Keep playing guitar, do the solo on kazoo.

Danny1969

RocknRollDave said:

As it happens, I have been watching/ listening to a lot of live ZZ Top stuff of late, and there are lots of times where it is just screaming out for a second guitarist or a keyboard.....although yeah there are lots of times where they have stuff on tape too.

Yeah I thought that, same as U2 use a ton of backing on some songs and then try and play Hold Me Kiss me with the Edge on his own or the Manics try and do some of their stuff with just a tiny bit of keys ...... recently though  I see they are using another guitarist 

Travisthedog

RocknRollDave said:

Fuzz + octave pedal = huge

And a smattering of delay

Ive only ever been the only guitarist in my bands - apparently my style has developed that way anyway

BigMonka

I regularly play as the only guitarist and for the rhythm work I've found that chord voicing can have a huge impact on how full the sound is - try and find a few which have an open string of two (even when higher up the neck). 

I've also found that it's helpful to keep chords moving all the time, so even when staying on one chord do things like add in/take out a few notes with your little finger, or swap the bass note. It's a bit like how a pianist would play, they don't just hold down the chord, they get the right hand moving to support the chord (not just adding melody) and the left hand switching to inversions of the same chord.

ICBM

Get a big two-channel amp, or one with a switchable graphic EQ, or both.

Use a more midrangy/jangly sound for rhythm and a much more scooped, bass/treble-boosted sound for lead. This is the exact opposite of what you need to do to 'cut through' in a two-guitar band - you need the solo sound to be bigger, wider and fuller-sounding than the rhythm sound. You will almost certainly need at least 50W and preferably two speakers.

That worked for me when I went from being a lead guitarist in a two-guitar band to the only guitarist.

Moss

2 amps - 1 more boxy and middy, one more scooped

Run a stereo chorus or delay to add width

thomasw88

The key to playing as three piece is to work together aka bob the builder..  As a couple of people said before, less is more, and trying to get it so the three instruments work together can be much more fulfilling than playing in a band with loads of people.  I find playing with most guitar players quite hard work, as they don't know when to shut up.

Sure there might be some songs that really need extra parts - in the covers band I play in the drummer has samples he uses on a roland drum pad and he'll trigger them as and when they're needed, but generally we don't find the songs or versions we do are really lacking instrument wise.  There are literally a gazillion great songs to play out there surely you can find 40 or so that work for your band as it is. 

LooseMoose

De-tune half a step. BEEFY!

slacker

Sporky said:

Solution: Keep playing guitar, do the solo on kazoo.

The Crosstown Traffic solution, excellent. 

digitalscream

It's really nothing to do with the guitar - the bassist needs to step up here.

1 - Guitar and bass need to be playing absolutely in lock-step with each other.

2 - When the guitar isn't playing rhythm, the bassist needs to use some form of boost - for rock and metal, this is usually in the form of a distortion which has a blend control (to allow some clean signal to come through as well). That'll fill in the gaps without losing any punch in the low end.

It's really that simple, in my experience.

DesVegas

@rocknrolldave & @travisthedog do you have octave pedal before the fuzz or after the fuzz?

slacker

digitalscream said:

It's really nothing to do with the guitar - the bassist needs to step up here.

1 - Guitar and bass need to be playing absolutely in lock-step with each other.

2 - When the guitar isn't playing rhythm, the bassist needs to use some form of boost - for rock and metal, this is usually in the form of a distortion which has a blend control (to allow some clean signal to come through as well). That'll fill in the gaps without losing any punch in the low end.

It's really that simple, in my experience.

I've played bass a lot and agree totally with 1 and also the drummer needs to step up. When the guitar drops out the bass and drums can do more. I dont agree with 2 purely subjective, I've always played more notes, maybe double stops, add harmonics to the root, whatever. 

It's easy when the original song was recorded as a three piece, often the solo section has a different bassline. If you can bare to listen to all right now the bass has a busy solo section before that solo comes in. It's when the original has multi layers eg dont fear the reaper. Apologies for the classic rock references. 

The song choice is key (ha ha) I joined a covers band cos the other guitarist couldnt fill out the sounds. He basically cherry picked what he wanted and left me the keys and brass parts. The 'MD' picked all his favourite songs full of keys and brass for male vocalists but we had a female one. I left before the car crash. 

So IMHO with a good bassist and drummer, sensible song choices and picking what guitar parts to play at any given point it will work. Oh and turn you amp up or get a lower powered one.  

octatonic

I'd use actual beef: