Piano: how much?

mart

Ok, this may be an impossible question, but let's try:

My son is taking grade 7 on piano. My wife has decided that our digital piano is not good enough for him and wants to get him a proper upright.

How much do we have to spend to make it worthwhile and take him at least through grade 8? 

I just looked at a piano shop and saw one going for £135,000, so I'm hoping that's not the answer.

viz

You can get a decent upright for nothing, 400 or 3000. All depends on the how lucky you are and what you find. Many people are happy for you to take the piano off their hands for nothing. Look for steel frame, overstrung, underdamped, not too old (post 1940 really - doesn't mean 100-year old pianos can't be nice, but they're harder to find). Check all the notes are even volume, that none of them sticks, that when you let go of the right pedal, none of the notes rings on. We just got a 100-year old one for 100 quid, and it's absolutely lovely. 

octatonic

Very much been here, done this.

We had one- carted it all over the planet- eventually sold it for double what we paid for it (£40).
I wouldn't have another one.
I would have a grand piano- if we get to a stage where we can sacrifice the space for one.

People are chucking uprights away- they are essentially worthless to many people.
Whether that can be tuned is anyone's guess.

If it can then it needs to be regularly tuned and when you move house you need to get it moved properly.
I'd urge you to stick with a digital piano- even if it means upgrading the existing one to something that is pro quality.
They are a billion-gazillion times less hassle.

Sporky

When we looked at options for Lady BMcH the overall best approach seemed to be one of the fancy-schmancy Roland modelling ones - really good key action, lovely sound.

octatonic

Sporky said:

When we looked at options for Lady BMcH the overall best approach seemed to be one of the fancy-schmancy Roland modelling ones - really good key action, lovely sound.

Yup- I like the Roland kit- it is well made and sounds/feels good.
Roland DP90 around £2k, F130 around a grand if you want an upright, or an RD800 if you want a stage piano.
On a budget an FP30.

Sporky

We were/are looking at the LX-17 but it's gone up about £500 since that thing that happened happened.

mart

Thanks guys.

@Viz: we aren't probably going to have much energy for an extensive search, nor much skill at seeking out bargains. Buying something new would be easiest, but does that automatically mean worse value, like it would for guitars?

@octatonic: I hear what you're saying, and completely agree. But piano teacher says, and wife agrees, so logic and my opinion count for approximately zilch.

@Sporky: any chance of a less poetic but more precise description? A model name/number would be lovely if poss. Edit: thanks for adding details, while I was writing this.

Sporky

Sorry!

What we liked is that it has a more complex key action - it feels a lot like a real grand - and it has a lot of speakers so not only does it sound rich but you get some of that string vibration back through the keyboard. Darned heavy though, and over four grand now.

viz

New is more reliable - you won't get a bargain but you won't get a dud either. 

mart

Thanks again. 

@Sporky: I'm told there is a complex key-string-body interaction on a proper piano that you just don't get on a digital. From what you're saying, Mr Roland and friends are making some progress on capturing that interaction. Am I understanding you right? 

And if the LX-17 is so heavy, and not cheap, is it really so advantageous over an acoustic? I need strong arguments if I'm going to persuade the Luddites.

@Viz: yes, I guess I'm tempted by new, probably because I feel I know where I am buying old guitars, and am consequently aware of how little I know about buying old pianos.

How little I know about much, in fact. Sigh.

Sporky

Yes. There are speakers inside to give resonance back through the keys so it did feel more convincing. I'm not very good at piano though. The advantages (from my point of view - your position may vary) are that it stays in tune, sounds very convincingly like a grand (or baby grand, or upright) and works with headphones.

I think it's still lighter than an upright.

mart

Thanks, that's useful. I guess I might need to get son and wife to try out both expensive digital and acoustics.

sgosden

I'm in the opposite boat to you. Having faffed around finding a piano tuner and measuring up doors and hall ways. I can't fit the Missus' piano from her mums, in to my house. Angles of doors and crazy weight of the thing won't allow it!

So looking at getting an electric piano. played some of the Rolands in local music shop, but £800 is way above budget! so the second hand search is on.

Her Mum on the other hand is getting rid of hers. probably for free to anyone who can get it out the house. but then it is a honky tonk (I believe this is the phrase), which needs a bloody good service and tuning.

paul_c2

I am tempted to say, a decent piano costs £100,000+ and anything less than that is a compromise of some kind or other.

But, the truth is, upright pianos are a screaming bargain secondhand considering what you can get for your money, if you can cope with the "physicality" ie the size, weight etc including picking it up, safely transporting it and delivering/installing it in your home (or next one, if you move house) then go ahead and get one, there's loads for sale so the prices are cheap.

mart

Fortunately we are unlikely to be moving house in the foreseeable, so as long as we can get somebody to deliver the piano here, then the size/shape/weight won't be much of an issue. 

Jalapeno

Missus got a reconditioned upright for IIRC £650 - there's a place that does recon pianos in Leighton Buzzard.

TimmyO

Jalapeno said:

 recon pianos 

Danny1969

Check out the Roland RD-800 .... it's a stage piano, quite a light one as stage pianos go. Sounds awesome, hammer weighted keys and not too expensive at £1800 ish

mart

Danny1969 said:

Check out the Roland RD-800 .... it's a stage piano, quite a light one as stage pianos go. Sounds awesome, hammer weighted keys and not too expensive at £1800 ish

Thanks; I'll add to the list to try.

octatonic

Danny1969 said:

Check out the Roland RD-800 .... it's a stage piano, quite a light one as stage pianos go. Sounds awesome, hammer weighted keys and not too expensive at £1800 ish

Am I right in thinking that the RD800 doesn't have in built speakers?
Most home piano folks usually want some built in speakers without having to buy an amp.

sweepy

Erm, when it comes to digital piano's the only brand is Yamaha, approved by teachers and music colleges.