How does a bass and drums lock in to create a groove? AKA playing bass with a drummer.

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Maybe I am way off the mark with this question but a drummer friend and a guitar/singer friend want me to visit their house after Christmas to jam for a few hours.  We all played together 40+ years ago and this session is totally for the fun of playing music.

I will bring my Les Paul, amp, my Aria bass and amp but I have never played bass with a drummer before and am not sure what to do!  Songs will be country, country rock and Simon & Garfunkel type.  Creating a groove is something new and unknown to me.  Any help in any way will be appreciated.  Thanks.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

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Comments

  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    If you are playing bass then follow the kick & the snare backbeat to 'lock in'.
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4944
    octatonic said:
    If you are playing bass then follow the kick & the snare backbeat to 'lock in'.
    Very helpful @Octatonic, what exactly is the snare backbeat you allude to?  I used to play drums [very amateur and self taught], as a backup for the drummer in our band.  All the terms are new to me, so please clarify backbeat.  Thanks again.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Backbeat is the snare on 2 & 4.
    What I am saying is don't follow the snare ghost notes (unless you are playing fusion).
    The main thing is to follow the kick.
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  • Depends on the part, I think the biggest grooves actually have fairly sparse bass drum parts with the bass being a bit busier than the bass drum. For me locking in is more about both having the same swing feel.
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  • I've stood in a few times - you just play and adjust until it feels right don't you? It's all about the feel. 
    "A city star won’t shine too far"


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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Depends on the part, I think the biggest grooves actually have fairly sparse bass drum parts with the bass being a bit busier than the bass drum. For me locking in is more about both having the same swing feel.
    Agree.
    When I say lock in I don't mean only play as much as the bass drum, but certainly land a note when the bass drum lands.
    It is a hard thing to explain in words. :)
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  • had another thought about this ... muting is important to groove as well, subtle variations in how the bass notes are muted can give pretty different feels, the muted or grace notes played by the bass can be hugely important in establishing the pull towards to accented bass+bass drum notes.

    Its kind of like the rhythmic equivalent of a cadence.
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  • If you are new to bass, keep it simple, listen to the drums, match the kick drum beat as first priority, snare as second.
    Basic country bass is all about the root - fifth with passing notes to the next chord, it's quite easy to get a good groove going. 
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  • You may be rusty. If you play in time you will be fine. "Locking in" and "in the pocket" will come with time. Maybe minutes, maybe months.
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4944

    Still buzzing after the get together yesterday evening!


    The setup in my friends music room was pretty impressive.  He had a small PA system with a microphone for the singer.  The singer played acoustic guitar which was plugged in to his guitar amp. My biggest problem, one that took about a half hour to sort out, was my amps low volume.  Turn it up is the obvious answer but it took that long to figure out the correct volume level, one that the other guys could hear clearly yet still hear themselves.  My little Stinger guitar amp, one I built myself, has a switch that bypasses the tone stack.  This gives a hotter sound and suits the Les Paul perfectly.  The Minimark had no problem with volume, again it was a case of determining what the 'right' volume level was.


    I found that playing with a drummer was easier than I had feared.  Much easier than I hoped it would be.  From the first strike, we were on!  My limitation was my little skill as a bassist.  But the vibe was that mistakes were to be expected and not to be afraid to try something even if it did not come off.  During the evening I progressed from playing straight root notes to root notes and ascending or descending runs to the next root note. Progress indeed.  Nothing spectacular but the two lads loved it.  They said the bass really helped them and filled out the sound.


    The singer tended to sing in odd keys.  Odd to me, I 'seldom' try anything in Bb or Eb.  This was less of a problem on the bass than on the Les Paul.  Most of the intros and fills I knew were in the standard recorded keys, I found transposing to a different key 'challenging' if not impossible but it was fun when I got it right!


    Lessons learned were the little bass runs, the need to practice intros and fills in keys other than G, A or E.  But the most important lesson learned was that at a certain volume level, less is actually more.  By less a sustaining power chord on the Les Paul gives great support to the amped up acoustic guitar.  And playing thirds instead of full chords adds a lot to the overall sound.


    We started around seven and started packing up just after ten o'clock.  My fingers felt a bit numb and this morning my wrist is slightly painful.  In a nice way.  And I got texts from the lads inviting me to the next get together in a month or so time.  So thanks to all you guys who offered tips and strategies for dealing with the demands of the evening.  It was great fun, I am looking forward to the next outing.  And knowing what we might be playing gives me greater impetus to practice more.  And to practice with a purpose. 

    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • BridgehouseBridgehouse Frets: 24578
    Sounds great @Rocker - I really wish I could find something like this near me to get some live Bass time in...
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Rocker said:

    The singer tended to sing in odd keys.  Odd to me, I 'seldom' try anything in Bb or Eb.  This was less of a problem on the bass than on the Les Paul.  Most of the intros and fills I knew were in the standard recorded keys, I found transposing to a different key 'challenging' if not impossible but it was fun when I got it right!

    Does he/she have a Jazz background?
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4944
    Well spotted @Octatonic. They both appear to have a liking for Jazz and Latin music. The drummer was very into Rock and the singer into Ballads and Country.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Rocker said:
    Well spotted @Octatonic. They both appear to have a liking for Jazz and Latin music. The drummer was very into Rock and the singer into Ballads and Country.
    Jazz is frequently in flat keys to accommodate transposing instruments.
    It is very, very good for you to be forced to play in these keys.
    I know more than a few accomplished rock musicians who get lost once they get out of the usual rock type keys (Am, C, Em, G etc).
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  • JalapenoJalapeno Frets: 6378
    Latin emphasises1 + 3 beat, opposed Jazz/Rock/Blues emphasiese the 2 + 4 beat. Funk is all about the 1 ;)
    Imagine something sharp and witty here ......

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  • Personally I'm all over Eb and C#....but that has nothing to do with the 2 tuning I most frequently use....*cough*
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