Post your vintage guitar pics

robgilmo

meltedbuzzbox said:

Voxman said:

meltedbuzzbox said:

Gassage said:

meltedbuzzbox said:

the term vintage really needs some qualifying 

Anything before 1965 if a Fender.

Or any CS Blue Jazzmasters.

wisdom awarded

I disagree. There's been a big thread on what is and what is not vintage. If for the purposes of this thread you only want to see pre-CBS Fenders then that's fine. However, although not pre-CBS, I certainly would regard a 1969 Strat as vintage and I think any vintage specialist dealer would concur.   

but the desirebles are the pre CBS Fenders. Thats why there is a premium, thats why they are the most sought after.

CBS fender are associated with bad quality and corner cutting, the same with Norlin era Gibsons. 
By the very definition of the word vintage how can something synonymous with bad quality be deemed to be of high quality?

"Vintage guitar" is a lie when paired with something because its over 25 years old. Its such horse shit
A fucking Marlin Sidewinder will be 25 years old soon. You need stabbing if you ever call one of those vintage





You mean anything of good quality can be vintage, anything short isn't? That's bollocks now , isn't it.

Voxman

meltedbuzzbox said:

Voxman said:

meltedbuzzbox said:

Gassage said:

meltedbuzzbox said:

the term vintage really needs some qualifying 

Anything before 1965 if a Fender.

Or any CS Blue Jazzmasters.

wisdom awarded

I disagree. There's been a big thread on what is and what is not vintage. If for the purposes of this thread you only want to see pre-CBS Fenders then that's fine. However, although not pre-CBS, I certainly would regard a 1969 Strat as vintage and I think any vintage specialist dealer would concur.   

but the desirebles are the pre CBS Fenders. Thats why there is a premium, thats why they are the most sought after.

CBS fender are associated with bad quality and corner cutting, the same with Norlin era Gibsons. 
By the very definition of the word vintage how can something synonymous with bad quality be deemed to be of high quality?

"Vintage guitar" is a lie when paired with something because its over 25 years old. Its such horse shit
A fucking Marlin Sidewinder will be 25 years old soon. You need stabbing if you ever call one of those vintage

Nobody's disputing that as a generalism a pre-CBS Fender is more desirable than a post pre-CBS Fender.  But similarly a 1954 Strat is more desirable than a 1961 Strat; a 1961 strat is more desirable than a 1965 strat; a 1966 strat is more desirable than a 1969 strat; - and a 1969 strat is more desirable than a 1972 strat.  The OP asked folk to post their vintage guitars - he didn't restrict this to a particular year, or criteria for desirability.  

And as for quality not all pre CBS strats are 'better quality' - not by a long shot.  It's precisely because of the hand-made, hand wound, hand assembled modular approach that quality could vary enormously as there was no real quality control back then. Fender would use whatever woods and parts were available, & pick-up quality was another thing that varied hugely which is why you get so much variation of windings and voltage output.  Even the neck plate numbers on pre-CBS Fenders could be up to a year out either way - why? Because they were kept in a large wooden box and pulled out at random - that's how much quality control there was.  And which is why dating by neck and other components is deemed more accurate.  And painting quality? When a sunburst finish went wrong Fender would repaint over the failed sunburst finish with a custom colour - and charge 5% more for the privilege.  

So please don't try & tell me that a pre-CBS is more desirable because of superior quality - yes, there are some lovely pre-CBS guitars that genuinely have real mojo - but many are just good guitars that are no better than many later versions - their desirability is simply because of their pre-CBS status and because of the fiscal value placed on them by undiscerning dealers and owners who's self-interest is to perpetuate the myth that all pre-CBS Fenders are 'magical' and better than post CBS guitars, so as to inflate their values in order for dealers to line their own pockets & for owners to boost their own ego's.  But often that overly inflated fiscal value is something that most pre-CBS Fenders do not deserve.  It's got so stupid that people will even pay up to £1,000 to have a genuine year case or £1,000 for an original scratch plate - are you seriously telling me that the cases and plastic used then were better quality?

Thus, a 1969 strat may not be as valuable as a 1964 Strat, but it's still 48 years old which is probably older than most people on this board, and it's still a very desirable year and qualifies as a vintage guitar - Hendrix played 68 & 69 strats and Fender Custom shop has created 1968 and 1969 reissues for God's sake - and by so doing even Fender acknowledges that those years are Vintage.

I'm truly fed up with the narrow-minded attitude of certain people on this board who believe the ridiculous nonsense that all pre-CBS Fenders are fantastic and superior instruments just because they are pre-CBS, and all post CBS Fenders are pieces of trash and not worthy of being called 'vintage'.  I'm sure there are quite a few nice pre-CBS guitars owned by folk here that are genuinely very good instruments that play nicer and sound better than typical later year versions - but I'm also willing to bet there are also more than a few that aren't.

So for anyone who disagrees, my message is simple - get off your pre-CBS 'mine's better than yours' and 'pre-CBS is the only vintage standard' high horse - & get over it.  A good guitar is a good guitar and a bad guitar is a bad guitar regardless of year, and a 'Vintage Fender' is not restricted to only pre-CBS.  

richardhomer

^ Not sure randomly selecting neck plates is an indicator of a lack of quality control....

FWIW, when it comes to things that matter, like neck shapes, properly fitting neck pockets, weight and contouring, pre-CBS Fenders were very consistent, given the manufacturing methods available at the time.

Issues around originality are not about quality - they are about collectibility.

Yes their tone varied from sample to sample - but having had two almost identical 2005 Les Pauls at my house at the same time, with serial numbers a few digits apart - I can tell you they sounded 'very' different from each other. That's because wood (even of similar weight) varies from piece to piece.

The main reason a '54 Strat is worth more than an early '60s one, is because it is very rare - Fender simply built more in later years.

By the late '60s, there were production changes, which set those guitars apart from earlier ones - notably thicker poly finishes, which dratamically changed the feel of the instruments. As time progressed, more classic features went by the wayside; four bolt neck plates, two piece trem assemblies, pressed saddles, staggered pole pieces, etc. Wood was bought to hit a price-point - not a weight spec, finishes became 'much' thicker....

I'm not saying that individual later guitars were all bad - but the odds of finding a good one became progressively greater after CBS took over. Even the '65 I used to own was much less good than the '63 I also owned.

In the great scheme of things, the differences might seem marginal, compared to the differences in value across various periods. That said, the biggest madness to me in the 'vintage' market is that a late '70s dog is often dearer than a used CS guitar. That really makes no sense whatsoever....

alanchanxd

Something to confuse you Fender CBS-era lovers and vintage Fender lovers.

I got a vintage Fender strat with CBS Headstock and E2 prefix serial (not the usual Sx prefix to indicate that the neck was made/assembled in the seventies). The neck is verified genuine by Fender and it is considered to be one of the last production CBS headstock neck used for assembly during the Dan Smith's smaller headstock era. The neck heel stamping however has 1985 stamped there with Herbie Gastelum's stamping to show that he finished/built the neck.

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx224/AlanChanXD/Fender CBS E2 stratocaster/IMG_9627_zps467b533f.jpg

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx224/AlanChanXD/Fender CBS E2 stratocaster/IMG_20120414_153637.jpg

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx224/AlanChanXD/Fender CBS E2 stratocaster/IMG_20120414_153526.jpg

Previous owner added a rare vintage genuine Fender upgrade part - the Fender Brassmaster tremolo plate (with non-original saddles)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx224/AlanChanXD/Fender CBS E2 stratocaster/20121229_151815_zps0caf6bb5.jpg

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx224/AlanChanXD/Fender CBS E2 stratocaster/IMG_9624_zps8e4c85b3.jpg

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx224/AlanChanXD/Fender CBS E2 stratocaster/IMG_9628_zps24b2dad8.jpg

marantz1300

"I mean old by "vintage". Not just the usual cork sniffing ones. 80's Hamers ,Musicman,70's Guilds etc are great."

The thread is for old interesting guitars. They don't have to be 50's/60's Gibson's or Pre CBS Fenders.

meltedbuzzbox

@Voxman I wouldn't say one is better over the other. I buy guitars that I feel are good. I don't care when or where they were made. I would generally always go CS over vintage as the guitars generally are better made in my opinion and I don't buy into mojo. 

@Richardhomer has summed things up lovely above.
Ultimately CBS took a design that was driven by a penny pincher and made it even cheaper. Like its stated above its not uncommon to fit a small Volkswagon in the gaps in quite a lot of 70s Fender neck pockets.
Panzer tank like weight and under wound pickups seem to be the mark of a 70s Fender (yes there are exceptions, but they are exceptions not the rule). Super thick finishes and oversized headstocks for advertising purposes and those bullet truss rods....eeeek.

I am against anything being deemed vintage because it is old. Its just an exercise in adding fake value to bad guitars for me. 70s Fenders and Gibsons created the problems that drove guitarists to seek out older models because the 70s models were so shoddy.
I also don't believe a guitar is good because it is old.
I have played a lot of bad guitars that are deemed vintage on no merit other than their age

I do wonder what your opinion would be if your strat was pre-cbs...

If we took the same analogy to cars would you all be insistent that a Datsun Cherry is a vintage motor because of its age? Yes it was better made than its UK counter part but it was still drab and uninspiring 

Travisthedog

My 1973/4 Tele Custom
The best sounding guitar ever - but presently unplayable due to having no frets left

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/jonny73/Mobile Uploads/6BBF8409-6BBB-47F3-AC2D-FC9EA6CC05CC_zpswnfshtgb.jpg

guitars4you

Travisthedog said:

My 1973/4 Tele Custom
The best sounding guitar ever - but presently unplayable due to having no frets left

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c239/jonny73/Mobile Uploads/6BBF8409-6BBB-47F3-AC2D-FC9EA6CC05CC_zpswnfshtgb.jpg

looks lots of honest to good working character - just get a good re-fret and it will totally transform your prize asset and inject new life - I'd suggest medium jumbo and either 6105, 6100 or 6150's - The difference from now to after is night and day

Travisthedog

@guitars4you - I'm terrified of getting done for fear of it feeling all wrong or the luthier cocking up the fretboard. its just sat there waiting for me to pluck up the courage. I'd decided to take it to Chandlers of Jonathan at Feline but they are both miles from me

Bridgehouse

Travisthedog said:

@guitars4you - I'm terrified of getting done for fear of it feeling all wrong or the luthier cocking up the fretboard. its just sat there waiting for me to pluck up the courage. I'd decided to take it to Chandlers of Jonathan at Feline but they are both miles from me

It's worth travelling and getting someone you trust to do it. @SteveRobinson did both the 72 Jag and the 62 LP Special and it totally sorted both of them.

Make a day trip of it, take the missus somewhere nice and relax - there are some true craftsmen out there and it's worth it for something that means so much to you.

Travisthedog

Bridgehouse said:

Travisthedog said:

@guitars4you - I'm terrified of getting done for fear of it feeling all wrong or the luthier cocking up the fretboard. its just sat there waiting for me to pluck up the courage. I'd decided to take it to Chandlers of Jonathan at Feline but they are both miles from me

It's worth travelling and getting someone you trust to do it. @SteveRobinson did both the 72 Jag and the 62 LP Special and it totally sorted both of them.

Make a day trip of it, take the missus somewhere nice and relax - there are some true craftsmen out there and it's worth it for something that means so much to you.

I forgot about Steve - He's the Manchester Guitar tech isn't he - Top bloke to deal with

Bridgehouse

Travisthedog said:

Bridgehouse said:

Travisthedog said:

@guitars4you - I'm terrified of getting done for fear of it feeling all wrong or the luthier cocking up the fretboard. its just sat there waiting for me to pluck up the courage. I'd decided to take it to Chandlers of Jonathan at Feline but they are both miles from me

It's worth travelling and getting someone you trust to do it. @SteveRobinson did both the 72 Jag and the 62 LP Special and it totally sorted both of them.

Make a day trip of it, take the missus somewhere nice and relax - there are some true craftsmen out there and it's worth it for something that means so much to you.

I forgot about Steve - He's the Manchester Guitar tech isn't he - Top bloke to deal with

Sure is - knows how to do a refret as well!! I say go for it and afterwards you will wonder why it took you so long

guitars4you

Travisthedog said:

@guitars4you - I'm terrified of getting done for fear of it feeling all wrong or the luthier cocking up the fretboard. its just sat there waiting for me to pluck up the courage. I'd decided to take it to Chandlers of Jonathan at Feline but they are both miles from me

I appreciate that and heard it before - can't recall anyone with tears after a good refret - Charlie Chandler or Feline will both advise and do an excellent job - If it is that bad now and unplayable than an improvement is the only outcome - You can of course refit original fret size, but for a more well balanced action and easier string bending I'd, go 6100, 6150's or 6105 - I'd personally go 6150's - very close to PRS size on many models and I know a slick playing performance awaits - I can only say the time and investment will be well worth it and both guys will do n awesome job

IvisonGuitars

Get it down to @SteveRobinson, you'll be amazed at the result.

Alternatively, sell it to me as an 'issues' Telecaster and i'll do it! ;-)

fretfinder

monoamine said:

noice. 4 digit serial?

Yep 4 digit serial in the 6000s on the 58 Junior.

Voxman

meltedbuzzbox said: I do wonder what your opinion would be if your strat was pre-cbs...

Exactly the same - because I'm not narrow minded and I understand the difference - pre CBS is pre CBS and is more desirable, but that vintage is still vintage.  If you go to any vintage guitar dealer or even Fender themselves they will tell you that a 1969 Strat is still a vintage guitar.  Now, as to what age ceases to be vintage is like how long is a piece of string and although the CBS transition is a natural break that makes it easy to determine a 'point in time', it doesn't negate the vintage status of some post CBS Fenders either.

Out of interest, if you want a unique manufacturing feature change with a vintage theme you should be aware that maple neck Strats in 1968/9 had a unique feature - for around 18 mths only, such guitars were special order because only rosewood board versions were standard in this period. For these special orders, maple finger boards had to be specially made and fitted just as rosewood boards - i.e. via a separate maple 'cap' and not a one-piece maple neck. This meant that the routing for the truss rod could be via the top of the neck and unlike one piece maple necks, there was no 'skunk stripe' filler (typically walnut) inserted into the back of the neck.  Maple board strats were therefore more expensive in this period compared to the rosewood board price.  Because of the limited numbers made (Hendrix had a maple cap board 69 by the way) maple-board capped strats are significantly rarer than rosewood board versions.   

Aside from reissues, that manufacturing method has never beem repeated by Fender and after this period they reverted to a one-piece maple neck.  So hows that for a unique vintage feature during a very limited time-line.  

guitars4you

miserneil said:

Get it down to @SteveRobinson, you'll be amazed at the result.

Alternatively, sell it to me as an 'issues' Telecaster and i'll do it! ;-)

again Steve highly recommended - not sure where you are located and what works best for you @Travisthedog - but on a job like this I'd go with ability/reputation as against 'he's on my door step' and I don't know much about him

Bridgehouse

guitars4you said:

miserneil said:

Get it down to @SteveRobinson, you'll be amazed at the result.

Alternatively, sell it to me as an 'issues' Telecaster and i'll do it! ;-)

again Steve highly recommended - not sure where you are located and what works best for you @Travisthedog - but on a job like this I'd go with ability/reputation as against 'he's on my door step' and I don't know much about him

I probably travelled the same distance to Steve R as Travis would have to do - I know it's a pain but the peace of mind is priceless to be honest. If you were worried about the distance I'm sure Steve would accept a courier delivery to him as well? 

The most useful part of going in person is having a chat about which wire - and actually seeing and feeling some to get an understanding of the choices.. and talking him through how you want it set up/feel afterwards.. The big thing with a Tele like yours @Travisthedog is how you have the fretboard finished afterwards. Lacquered boards will probably require re-lacquering afterwards, and Steve really knows his spraying apples. 

I'm sure the other two you've mentioned will be the same - I'm only talking from personal experience. 

Voxman

Oh, one more thing.  In its Fender section, the highly respected Vintage Guitar Info site (that contains a wealth of info on Vintage guitars) doesn't stop at CBS - it includes Fender guitars up to 1969: http://www.guitarhq.com/fender.html

Quad erat demonstrandum. 

SteveRobinson

@Travisthedog I have replied to your email thanks.