Swap to Helix from FX8 - your experiences?

Vaiai

Anyone gone this way? If so, why and how did it go.
Before I say why I am thinking about it, interested to hear other's experiences!
This is to use for FX only in 4CM initially!

sweepy

I went the other way to a certain extent, Helix to Axe-Fx, it is always interesting to hear other views on these two

Bridgehouse

I thought it was generally accepted that FX8 is better than Helix for 4CM and helix is (sometimes) better as standalone?

kjdowd

I went FX8 - Helix - AX8.  Main reason for FX8 to Helix was amp modelling (AX8 wasn't readily available). If using mainly for 4CM I'd stick with FX8. Helix is more flexible and will give you more in a patch, but IMO FX8 sounds an appreciable amount better (altho Helix is still v good).

Depends what you want really. Flexible routing, USB interface, loops for pedals, lots of complicated dual paths - Helix. Bit more straightforward, better sounds, optimised for 4CM - FX8. 

I've gigged FX8, Helix and AX8 and all sounded great, but I personally prefer the sound of the Fractal stuff

Sporky

Bridgehouse said:

I thought it was generally accepted that FX8 is better than Helix for 4CM and helix is (sometimes) better as standalone?

I don't think there are enough people who've actually used both (rather than having used one and tried the other for an hour at best) for that to be anything more than received wisdom.

sweepy

Both items are units that really do need a fair bit of prodding around and experimenting with, it's very easy to get a knee jerk reaction when pressed for time. My top tip is to ask if anyone has one or the other locally and bribe them with wine or hobnobs to pop over with your guitar and sit down with someone who already has a good idea of the units wrinkles 

Vaiai

I have a GuitarGuitar session with one (using my amp) lined up and a mate locally has one so will get a good look at it - I had a PODHD500X before and was not gigging much but did use it now and then as an FX board. It also means I have some familiarity with the Line 6 world.

I tend to use the FX8 like a pedal board (scenes) but the option of other amps (modelled) and being able to record etc are appealing. Practicing at home with headphones too.
From a practical point of view - the built in Exp pedal which can go from Exp to Vol or Wah etc is great and the fact every thing is lit too - my FX8 is dark on stage apart from on the button that is selected. Editing on the fly with your foot and the exp pedal is very clever too.

Floor noise and channel switching are important too - I know how good the FX8 is so I'm maybe just being lured by bright lights and new toys I watched some vids and at the back of my mind I keep thinking "The FX8 can do that, and that" etc

There's also that looming "direct to PA with IEM" way of working that I'd like to get to one day

welshboyo

I went FX8 to Helix...

Mainly for the direct options as well as the 4CM stuff.

Was a little anxious as t'internet wisdom makes you believe that the FX8 is the only 4CM unit and Helix is not as good - absolute bollocks IMO - the Helix is totally quiet and transparent PROVIDED YOU READ THE FUCKING MANUAL!! OK, the FX8 is perhaps a little easier to integrate 4CM wise as that is all it will do and its hard to get it wrong, but the Helix once understood is just as easy - the reason Helix is perhaps a little trickier to get right is due to it being infinitely more flexible with how and where you can route things.

As for the effects, I'm not missing the FX8 lets put it that way and I get to go direct and have an instant back-up rig at my feet and the option to run different pre-amps into the poweramp of my real amp at the touch of a button..

I also don't have to worry about those magnetic Kick Tag things, its all built in and they change with my patches.

And I don't have to worry about an expression pedal or volume pedal.

And I don't have to deal with the Church of Cliff.

And....

Vaiai

The back up rig is another plus point I have considered @welshboyo - thanks for your feedback  
So in 4CM I can have a modelled amp using just the power amp in my Victory (and no Cab sim) and the real amp as another option - I think that's how they had it in the vid I posted. 

welshboyo

Vaiai said:

The back up rig is another plus point I have considered @welshboyo - thanks for your feedback  
So in 4CM I can have a modelled amp using just the power amp in my Victory (and no Cab sim) and the real amp as another option - I think that's how they had it in the vid I posted. 

Yes you can, and that's how I'm using is most of the time, as there is also a modelled Shiva in the Helix (and its spot on!!) I can essentially have another extra channel available for lighter crunch tones etc - almost like turning around mid-song and re-doing my channel settings!!

I have also got it set in such a way that I no longer need to mic up - so I run the amp and a direct FOH (straight from the real amp via an IR of my actual cab) which gives our PA a constant signal every night of the week 

John_A

Used my Helix in 4CM, direct FX only in to a real amp, and now I'm using it direct to FOH with a FRFR monitor, it's been brilliant in every application, and sounds fantastic too. 

Haven't had a lot of time with a AX8, and it's probably just as good.

The firmware updates for the Helix are coming thick and fast, what was already a great unit gets better and better with every release and they don't seem to be slowing down.

Vaiai

That's the way I am heading @John_A It's the FRFR bit that bothers me as I know it's a different sound and potentially feel but I also know people say you get used to it.
At least I can start 4CM and work to direct!

John_A

Takes no getting used to at al, it just sounds great.  I think I was hesitant at first coming from a valve amp background, but once you've tried it it's so much more flexible and far easier.  That's my experience anyway

DefaultM

Wow the helix is a lot more expensive than I thought it would be. I was guessing at about £700.
How much is the fx8?

John_A

fx8 is 1399 euros  Considering what id does the Helix is a bargain, sold 2 amps and a pedalboard and got a Helix and a Mediterranean cruise

Vaiai

So, you get an awesome stage sound set up and everything sounds great - but how do you set up for direct to desk - how do you know what it will sound like thru different venues PAs (I know some of you have your own band PA)? Or do you have a base sound and can just tweak on the night?

John_A

^ there's a global EQ you can apply to your stage sound or FOH, or both to tweak, but if you are using an engineer they should be able to set it so it sounds good out front, no different to using an amp.  You can also set the volume control to work on just your stage sound or FOH as well, so you can turn up without ruining the out front mix.  It's really versatile and easier to get a good stage/FOH balance than using traditional amps

welshboyo

I'm using the Ownhammer IR's for my FOH sound which rarely need any tweaking, yes, you do end up in the hands of the venue sound engineer but its far more constant than using a mic'd up cab IMO

Vaiai

I know the stock IR's are not great but Ownhammer gets plenty praise and I think Pete Thorn uses em too so no worries now! Would be nice to get a bigger cab sound for larger stages tho - been considering a 2x12 but this could be perfect for FoH while ikeeping a 1x12 on stage - and eventually the FRFR option.

John_A

The stock IR's are great, the ownhammer ones are just a bit simpler to get a sound out of, with a bit of tweaking you can get the stock ones to sound just as good, don't believe everything you read   just go FRFR, get a little 10" active PA speaker for on stage (unless you have monitors or IEM's in which case don't bother) Half of the joy of the Helix is hot having to lift 2x12 cabs in and out of the car

welshboyo

Vaiai said:

I know the stock IR's are not great but Ownhammer gets plenty praise and I think Pete Thorn uses em too so no worries now! Would be nice to get a bigger cab sound for larger stages tho - been considering a 2x12 but this could be perfect for FoH while ikeeping a 1x12 on stage - and eventually the FRFR option.

EXACTLY what I am doing...well sort of!!

I run either a 1x12 ported Bogner or its bigger brother the OS212 on stage and I am then running the 412 Bogner IR to FOH, with the ontsage and FOH it sounds massive!!

Also remember that you can (via snapshots on Helix) switch in a different IR (say a Deluxe cab) for your clean and (as I do on a few patches) a Mesa 412 for the heavier stuff.

Never played with an AX8 but I'm not sure the Fractal can do this - the Helix is more a competitor to the AX8 than the FX8 really - in the FX8's defence, the Helix is always going to win IMO - the AX8 would need to be pretty damn sharp too to come close to the Helix - there's no "quality" difference between them, its purely flavours!!

Only thing I will say is that you will need more than a shop demo to get to grips with the Helix - I'd be tempted to do the distance selling thing and have a good session with it in your own time.

Happy to share my patches with you if you do get something.