Should I Sack Them Off???Band Advice Please.

Bellycaster

I'll try and make it short, but it needs explaining and it will be difficult. I could really do with some advice, so please read. It'll likely make you laugh too, I would if I wasn't so fucked off.

I joined a group of guys about 6 weeks ago who are trying to form a Bowie Band, they wanted me straight in after the audition, so thought I was lucky.

There are 4 of us. Vocals, Guitar(me), Bass and Drummer, all very good players and decent enough lads. The Singer and Bassist have played together before but me and the Drummer are new to the project(though I came in last).

We have a Keys player coming down(massive Bowie fan, who I know from some other muso mates) this coming Tuesday that might be interested and he is a musician for a living, full time.

So, in the meantime, we've been focusing on the songs that we can get away with playing without keys. The original plan for songs with keys/piano before I accepted the place in the band(and before I got the keys player to agree to come along) was for the Drummer to do them with SPDS Sampling, but I realised after a couple of weeks that they seemed to be a bit reluctant to do this.

We've only had about 4 rehearsals and have 16 tracks that we could gig, we do them well.

Ziggy
Queen Bitch
Moonage Daydream
Jean Genie
Starman
Hang onto Yourself
Rebel Rebel
Sorrow
Suffragette City
Heroes
Man Who Sold the World
Modern Love
China Girl
Let's Dance(this sounds ok without keys)
Loving the Alien (Live Version)
Dancing in the Street

So not a full gig set by any means as you can tell. We could do a short support slot or something, but that's it.

So imagine our surprise when, at our last rehearsal the Singer drops it on us that his promoter (the singer does other things with this promoter) has got us a Gig in late March, we he would like us to honour with a 2 x 45 minute set list, this means we have 4 possible rehearsals before the gig (one per week). I doubt the keys player would be ready for this gig even if he did join us.

So the Singers solution to this is to drop in 6 Rod Stewart songs, that he - and probably the Bassist - already knows......Errrrrrrrrrr

To make matters worse, the 5 songs are:

Do Ya Think I'm Sexy(Could Do with a Synth there I reckon)
Maggie May
Ooh La La
Blue Moon
Sailing
I Don't Wanna Talk About It

So that's 50% slow weepy tracks out of the 6 from someone who isn't David Bowie. Now, they did mention possibility of doing half Bowie and half Stewart in the event we couldn't find a keys player, but they knew I wasn't too thrilled about that.

Another annoying thing is the singer couldn't tell us if we'll be paid anything on top of expenses for the March Gig, he couldn't remember the exact date of the March gig and he's slow coming up with the other gig dates he says the promoter has gotten us later in the year.

I don't even think the 16 Bowie plus 6 Rod tracks can fill out a 90 minute Gig.

Plus, there are at least a few more Bowie tracks that don't need keys that we could put in the gig if we really knuckled down with learning them, such as:

Kooks
Drive In Saturday
Diamond Dogs
John, I'm Only Dancing
Valentines Day
Oh You Pretty Things (at a push, just doing a Guitar Version)

The Singer doesn't seem to do much "homework" and seems to put off learning stuff and I seem to be the one who has put lots of time in learning a lot of tracks, while some of the others turn up and say things like "Oh, I didn't know we were doing that one this week", when it's been on Whatsapp for a whole fucking week. The communication is not good, I've sent emails that singer says he's read regarding the keys player and then doesn't remember the simple details come next rehearsal.

I don't know what world the singer is living in, he thinks we'll end up getting £700 per gig as a Tribute Act....errrrm, not without a Keys Player(or good keys backing tracks) we wont... and if the Keys Player does join us, he'll have to be impressed enough for us to keep him.

I've already put time and rehearsal money into this and the singer wants us to do photo shots(£????) and a recording of a track(£100) for promotions and wants us to put gig money into a PA which would be fine if it was an organised set up and knew what we would be earning.

I feel like giving him an ultimatum: "Drop the Rod songs and/or cancel the March gig until we are properly ready"

I don't like being fucked about, but my soft side doesn't want to let them down, even though I feel someone in there (most likely the singer) hasn't been 100% up front with me. Sad thing is it has potential.

Sorry it's long, I did try, but so much to put in and it was difficult to arrange it in a sort of logical order corresponding with how things have progressed.

Whatever I decide I will have to act soon. Would you wait until after the Keys player has come down? I think it's glaringly obvious that we are not ready to fulfil this March Gig.

Help us out here chaps!

Thanks.

digitalscream

That ultimatum is exactly what I'd do, followed by "This is supposed to be a professional outfit, but it seems we intend to make the same mistakes every amateur band makes, which are always the reason they never get anywhere".

chromatuna

Personally I would be very wary of continuing and investing more time and effort based upon what you have said. There seems to be a lack of professionalism and clarity both of which are going to be essential to succeed as a tribute act as if you don't have these qualities there are plenty of others who will. I suspect the pro keyboard player will figure this out very quickly, when your income depends upon it you have to. Been there quite recently myself (not as a pro) and although it was fun playing for a while it was ultimately unsatisfactory and I would have been better moving on when I first saw the signs.

Bellycaster

Thanks @digitalscream ;

That 22 song set is a joke! Am I right, some of those songs are less than 3 minutes long and 6 of them are by Rod Stewart and he thinks he can drag 90 mins out of that, now it's not a Theatre Gig, it's a pub, but if I was gong to see a Bowie Band in a pub, the last thing I'd expect is 6 fecking Rod Stewart time fillers in there.

I'd understand the lack of keys, but I'd want to see the best possible Bowie sets imaginable using just guitars, it can be done for pub gigs choosing some album tracks obviously. We'll never be a Theatre or proper Tribute act without Keys or profession sampling and if the Keys player even gets a slight sniff that some of them are a bit lackadaisical, he'll be out of there like a shot.

I've done them a right favour even getting that keys guy to agree to come down. I'd say that the Drummer is the most reliable, but the other 2 need a reality check.

Bellycaster

chromatuna said:

Personally I would be very wary of continuing and investing more time and effort based upon what you have said. There seems to be a lack of professionalism and clarity both of which are going to be essential to succeed as a tribute act as if you don't have these qualities there are plenty of others who will. I suspect the pro keyboard player will figure this out very quickly, when your income depends upon it you have to. Been there quite recently myself (not as a pro) and although it was fun playing for a while it was ultimately unsatisfactory and I would have been better moving on when I first saw the signs.

Thanks @chromatuna ;

The sad thing is they are very good individually at their chosen instruments/Voice etc. I've not known them long, but the Singer does do other shows, so he must be able to put some sort of graft in. The Bassist has played with him in other bands, so they can get something going.

I've never been in a band that involves a promoter/agent call it what you will. My last band organised itself. My last band got tracks nailed down a lot quicker in rehearsals too.

This is the trouble, I'm hard and soft at the same time I've been stewing with it since last rehearsal, my nice side will have to take a back seat for a while. I think some truths have to be told to them.

fretmeister

Suggest other songs to make the point about Rod Stewart.

Cradle of Filth, Pantera, that sort of thing.

Fortheloveofguitar

Amateurs mate. They need to shape up 

Eartrumpet

I went through a very similar situation last year. From what you say i think this will escalate and become very messy. My 2 cents, walk away and find a band that has a more profesional outlook. Good luck

Bridgehouse

Even I could play bass well on some Rod Stewart numbers...

Bellycaster

I agree it seems that way @Fortheloveofguitar the Singer does other shows though, so I expected him to be professional in some way or other.

I was hoping that if he joined, the Keys player might whip them into shape too @chromatuna or I was telling myself, he would give them a massive incentive or sense of proportion and patience.

chromatuna

So glad that predictive text didn't mangle your thread title or you could have been in real trouble! 

Bellycaster

chromatuna said:

So glad that predictive text didn't mangle your thread title or you could have been in real trouble! 

Haha, Lol awarded. I don't think even that would motivate them though

John_P

I'd be very upfront about the issues you're not happy with.  
It sounds like there is some potential for the project to work but I think you're within your rights to say no to doing non Bowie songs.  
Its often a good idea to have a target date to force a band to get things moving but it sounds like you need the keys player in board and either more regular rehearsals or an extra 2 or 3 weeks.      
Why does it need to be that date when you could probably have a full show prepared for April? 
Most tribute gigs have a PA provided either by the venue or promoter hiring a pa company in so I'd say no to that extra complication - (who stores it and has access when you aren't using it/ who owns it if someone leaves etc) so just hire one when you need it which shouldn't be too often. 
Tell them commas need sorting - I won't work with people that don't reply or misinterpret messsges - it's not good for the blood pressure - same with not learning songs. 

im not sure you're at the point where I'd leave just yet but all the signs are there that would make me think carefully about how much energy to put in unless it improves.  

knuckleberryfinn

Poach the drummer and move on.

EricTheWeary

It does sound like the singer does actually have some experience so you could have an act of faith that his plan will work. If the gig is a pub gig and you're just the entertainment for the night it's probably fine; if it's a Bowie convention they'll throw you off stage   It seems reasonably common that tribute acts throw in other stuff - I guess most famous acts only have so many well known songs so throwing in a few hits by other people is an attempt to win over non partisan crowds. 
I don't know if you have to say it as an ultimatum but you have the right to ask to have a meaningful conversation about the gig, the set list, photos,etc. You haven't known them long so you might be getting hold of the wrong end of the stick or there might be a compromise to be reached. Or he might be an outright twat and you can wish them well and take your leave. 

Bridgehouse

knuckleberryfinn said:

Poach the drummer and move on.

Yeah, give me a shout - I reckon we could do 90mins of Rod dead easy

Bellycaster

Thanks @John_P ;

Part of me does want to give em a go, but like you say, with me getting things off my chest first. You see, everything seems to be channelled through this promoter that the singer is involved with - for his other shows too.

The singer dropped it onto us last week about this gig in late March - organised through the promoter - and then the singer forgets the fucking exact date and pay details.

I understand some venues will have PA, but this one doesn't, swings and roundabouts ain't it? Alarm bells are ringing with any sort of money investment into this and ownership etc like you said.

I'm not sure the exact details of what the singer does with this promoter but he never even gave the impression that the promoter would provide a PA, it sounded more like we would have to personally hire one and also pay for our photos and one track recording. It sounds like this promoter has this guy for a twat.

richardhomer

knuckleberryfinn said:

Poach the drummer and move on.

Jeez, that sounds cruel....

EricTheWeary

richardhomer said:

knuckleberryfinn said:

Poach the drummer and move on.

Jeez, that sounds cruel....

....it's just finding a pan big enough that's the problem...

Bridgehouse

EricTheWeary said:

richardhomer said:

knuckleberryfinn said:

Poach the drummer and move on.

Jeez, that sounds cruel....

....it's just finding a pan big enough that's the problem...

Wire up the bass kick pedal to the mains...

Bellycaster

EricTheWeary said:

richardhomer said:

knuckleberryfinn said:

Poach the drummer and move on.

Jeez, that sounds cruel....

....it's just finding a pan big enough that's the problem...

Well, me and the Drummer are both Baldies, so we look like a couple of Eggs