What do you consider 'essential spec' on a car?

thisisguitar

Phil_aka_Pip said:

But engine management usually means expensive faults you can't fix. You spend more on the repairs than you save on a few extra mpg. My Escort CVH van had electronic ignition (but no silly "management system") and its fuel consumption & performance were no worse than the Vauxhall I've got now in which I'm just waiting for the next inexplicable fault. Manual winders = something that'll work when you want it to instead of failing to open or close because of some obscure electrical fault. 

You can't really compare the fuel efficiency between what I assume to be a much newer Vauxhall and an old Escort van. For instance, I'll bet the new one weighs a lot more because of the extra safety kit included (you certainly wouldn't want to crash an Escort, they were shoddily designed and built). Legislation has forced makers to include a lot of electronics and better structural integrity that older cars just didn't have, they have to meet Euro Ncap standards, and strict emissions regs these days. 

As much as you like the idea of older cars, you certainly wouldn't swap seats with your modern vehicle in an accident.

ICBM

Phil_aka_Pip said:

• Floorpan flat to the back of the tailgate with NO lip

Oops. I forgot that...

Phil_aka_Pip said:

• Proper spare wheel
  
• instrument panel visible in sunlight (NO LCDs)
  
• road & engine speed visible at a glance (proper dials)

I used to think so, but I ended up giving in on all those because all the cars that had all the other stuff I wanted had the 'modern' alternatives. I've got used to them now.

Mick said:

A spare wheel.  I mean a proper spare wheel, not a can of sealant which is absolutely no use when you've fooked your tyre.

And also not one of those bloody space saver wheels which people insist on driving about on at normal speeds.  Bloody dangerous imo.

I've accepted a space saver. I did go and buy a real spare alloy from a scrap dealer though, and put a good tyre on it, which I keep at home so the space saver only has to get me back there. And no, I wouldn't drive at normal speed on the space saver - in fact, I wouldn't even drive with it on the front if at all possible, even if that means making two wheel changes.

I won't ever have a car with a can of sealant if I can help it. Guarantees that the tyre is then unrepairable and you'll have to pay extra for the rim to be cleaned as well, if I remember.

TTony

ICBM said:

I won't ever have a car with a can of sealant if I can help it. Guarantees that the tyre is then unrepairable and you'll have to pay extra for the rim to be cleaned as well, if I remember.

My TT only had a can of sealant.

I never felt totally comfortably driving it long distances, just in case a tyre blew.

Current car has a space saver, and I did consciously reject some alternatives because they didn't have a spare of any kind.

Phil_aka_Pip

thisisguitar said:

Phil_aka_Pip said:

But engine management usually means expensive faults you can't fix. You spend more on the repairs than you save on a few extra mpg. My Escort CVH van had electronic ignition (but no silly "management system") and its fuel consumption & performance were no worse than the Vauxhall I've got now in which I'm just waiting for the next inexplicable fault. Manual winders = something that'll work when you want it to instead of failing to open or close because of some obscure electrical fault. 

You can't really compare the fuel efficiency between what I assume to be a much newer Vauxhall and an old Escort van. For instance, I'll bet the new one weighs a lot more because of the extra safety kit included (you certainly wouldn't want to crash an Escort, they were shoddily designed and built). Legislation has forced makers to include a lot of electronics and better structural integrity that older cars just didn't have, they have to meet Euro Ncap standards, and strict emissions regs these days. 

As much as you like the idea of older cars, you certainly wouldn't swap seats with your modern vehicle in an accident.

I swear the Escort van was no worse that the newer Vauxhall. Yes the Escort would have caved in, but looking at the Vauxhall I think it would as well. And I don't give a sh!t for the "what if scaremongering". I'm an ex-biker, I know that you get hurt in crashes, it's the natural order of things and the risk you take.

thisisguitar

@Phil_aka_Pip - I used to ride motorbikes too, and had a pretty bad accident. Don't think it's scaremongering, car makers have been forced to make safer cars, and we wouldn't really want it any other way. What Vauxhall have you got btw? 

I came within about an inch of an accident just over a year ago, the closing speed would have been over 120 mph. As my car went into a spin and a Mk3 Astra was coming at me, I remember distinctly thinking how glad I was to be in a Saab 9-5! Also how much I wished I'd had my ABS module repaired!!

ROOG

TTony said:

ICBM said:

I won't ever have a car with a can of sealant if I can help it. Guarantees that the tyre is then unrepairable and you'll have to pay extra for the rim to be cleaned as well, if I remember.

My TT only had a can of sealant.

I never felt totally comfortably driving it long distances, just in case a tyre blew.

Current car has a space saver, and I did consciously reject some alternatives because they didn't have a spare of any kind.

Just bought a space saver spare for my car, I didn't feel happy with just a can of gloop!

thumpingrug

Increasingly thinking that Auto box is the way to go.  With Cruise control for the M'ways, but a decent sound system is a must.

ROOG

Not really essential in my book, but I've had a few autos, I love em. New autos are a huge improvement over the "slush boxes" of old.

chillidoggy

Anyone remember the old Borg-Warner BW35? Shit, that was an awful box.

bertie

thisisguitar said:

It's a nice touch if you need it :-)

tho fucking annoying if you dont

thisisguitar

bertie said:

thisisguitar said:

It's a nice touch if you need it :-)

tho fucking annoying if you don't

Shouldn't be, you have to choose whether to put them on or not in my experience (based on a Cayman).

chrispy108

I'd really miss keyless entry & ignition now, it's one of those features you don't really appreciate, but once you've got used to it you'd miss, same with the capless fuel tank, great thing.

Phil_aka_Pip

central locking, immobiliser etc = PITA! There's Nothing Wrong with an ordinary filler cap and a key in the door.

thisisguitar

@Phil_aka_Pip - You are an analogue man in a digital world ;-)

chrispy108

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRXy4xhJYHFr48ipUHZ7gj3TmjTBaj-Kh5fHESYXZsMhWecyWmXCg

Is this your car Phil?

The capless fuel is all mechanical anyway, and there is something wrong with a filler cap, you leave it behind and you can misfuel.

Flanging_Fred

A roof that doesn't leak water on my head when I go round a corner would be a significant upgrade on what I've got at the moment.

Phil_aka_Pip

thisisguitar said:

@Phil_aka_Pip - You are an analogue man in a digital world ;-)

The world is essentially analog. The digital layer is purey an artificial invention by humans who think they know better. Just because digital technology is good at some things doesn't make it good at everything.

holnrew

When I buy my own taxi, heated seats and air con will be up there.

ICBM

Phil_aka_Pip said:

thisisguitar said:

@Phil_aka_Pip - You are an analogue man in a digital world ;-)

The world is essentially analog. The digital layer is purey an artificial invention by humans who think they know better. Just because digital technology is good at some things doesn't make it good at everything.

Actually the world is more akin to digital than it is to analogue… on the sub-atomic scale - which is what makes all the stuff on the big scale work - physics consists of step changes rather than smooth gradients. The apparent 'analogueness' of nature is just because the step changes are so tiny that you can't usually tell.

Sometimes you can… go outside in any city at night and look at the orange sodium lights.

[/physics geek thread hijack]

Phil_aka_Pip

@ICBM light behaves as waves as well as particles. sound waves into a microphone produce an analog signal. it's not all digital.