New bandmate dilemma...opinions sought

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vasselmeyervasselmeyer Frets: 1840
After two years together, our singer has left  (on good terms) and we have auditioned and offered the position to her replacement. The new singer is absolutely terrific with great feel and we're all confident that she can deliver. However there's an issue I have never encountered before and I wondered on your opinions.

The drummer,  bass player and I are all middle aged (45-50). The drummer and bass player are a married couple and drive together with their gear in a completely full van and I  drive separately and  we meet at rehearsal/gigs.  However, our new singer is just 19 years old and is a full time student in her first year. The problem isn't a generation gap, it's more that I have some significant concerns about her transport situation post-gig.

We're based in Manchester and a lot of the gigs are around the outside of the city. This isn't like London where the public transport is good. You really need to be able to drive to get to and from these places. As a young female, having to get back to the city centre from the outskirts  of the city after midnight, I am going to worry  about her. 

I talked to my wife and said that I could drive her back to her university accomodation after gigs but  my wife immediately said she'd rather I didn't. It's not that she's worried about  me running off with the new singer. We've been married 23 years and  I think we're past thinking that one of us might run off with someone else! It's more that having a young woman in the car, late at night, might open me to accusations that would cause me some major problems, should that ever happen. Again, I can't see it, but  I suppose the potential is there for a life-ruining situation.

I'm more guilty of thinking like a dad than a bloke. My own kids are her age and also at university and  I'd want my own daughter to be  able to get home safely, but I also don't want to  leave myself open to  any  situation that might cause me a problem. I've done  Safeguarding courses when I was a junior rugby coach and I'm inclined to treat the situation in the same way (i.e. always have someone else in the car at the same time, never be alone with her etc).

Thoughts from you guys?
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 16065
    edited January 6
    I talked to my wife and said that I could drive her back to her university accomodation after gigs but  my wife immediately said she'd rather I didn't. It's not that she's worried about  me running off with the new singer. We've been married 23 years and  I think we're past thinking that one of us might run off with someone else! It's more that having a young woman in the car, late at night, might open me to accusations that would cause me some major problems, should that ever happen. Again, I can't see it, but  I suppose the potential is there for a life-ruining situation.

    I'm more guilty of thinking like a dad than a bloke. My own kids are her age and also at university and  I'd want my own daughter to be  able to get home safely, but I also don't want to  leave myself open to  any  situation that might cause me a problem. I've done  Safeguarding courses when I was a junior rugby coach and I'm inclined to treat the situation in the same way (i.e. always have someone else in the car at the same time, never be alone with her etc).

    Thoughts from you guys?
    Honestly, I can't think of any problem at all with driving your singer back to her accommodation.
    I've just posed this question to Mrs Oct and she said it wouldn't be a problem at all.
    Her exact words were 'don't be ridiculous, of course you should drive her home'.

    It is 2017, not 1917- there is no issue with two adults being in a car together, one driving the other one home.

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  • fields5069fields5069 Frets: 929
    My thoughts are that I agree with your wife. Maybe one of her friends could tag along, misunderstandings are less likely but could still lead to a sticky situation where the friend backs up the singer's version of "events".
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  • mgawmgaw Frets: 2101
    edited January 6
    think your wife is overreacting a bit but if the singer can have a friend along then great or make sure someone else is in the car with you
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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 5607
    I don't see the issue unless you don't trust the singer.

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  • fftcfftc Frets: 210
    The drummer and bass player need to buy a bigger van with crew seats! =)

    I don't see a problem with giving your fellow adult band member a lift home. I'm pretty sure my wife would think anything else would be ridiculous, but different people see risk in different situations I suppose.
    One solution would be to set up an account with a taxi firm or driver that you trust and book a taxi for her after every gig. Paid on account afterwards so no cash has to change hands and it takes her back to her residence.
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 16065
    edited January 6
    I don't get the paranoia- what do people actually think is going to happen?
    You are doing her a favour by dropping her off, why does that suddenly get scary for the driver- is she going to accuse you of assaulting her or something?
    Why?

    I've never given it a moment's thought about being alone with a female adult.
    If she was 12 then yeah perhaps you need to think about the way it is perceived- but 19?
    Not a second thought.
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 7229
    I'm with @octatonic 100%. Do people really think like that in the real world? 
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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 5607
    octatonic said:
    I don't get the paranoia- what do people actually think is going to happen?
    You are doing her a favour by dropping her off, why does that suddenly get scary for the driver- is she going to accuse you of assaulting her or something?
    Why?

    I've never given it a moments thought about being alone with a female adult.
    If she was 12 then yeah perhaps you need to think about the way it is perceived- but 19?
    Not a second thought.
    Absolutely 100% this. 

    Both me and my g/f have given lifts to members of the opposite sex after gigs. Neither has ever questioned each other. I see it more as a pain in the arse dropping people off at 1am than a potentially bad situation. These people are my friends at the end of the day (just ones I wish would buy a car..)

    The only time I'd consider not giving a lift would be if I didn't trust the person - those people haven't ever been my bandmates anyway.
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 5792

    You should probably initiate a conversation with her explaining you understand she doesn't drive and ask what arrangements she had in mind out of personal concern but also the functioning of the band. I suspect a 19 year old young woman will have given this some thought. 

    I cant see a problem with you giving her a lift ( the extra time added to getting home and the petrol would be more my wife's issues). Just try to avoid watching the gummy de milo episode of the Simpsons in your household for the next few months...

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  • merlinmerlin Frets: 573
    By the time you're gigging, if she's good at what she does and comes up with the Musical goods, then I'm sure you'll have developed a good working relationship with her. She's a colleague and probably will want to remain on good professional and friendly terms with everyone. 

    As has been posted above, this is the 21st Century. If you take a female friend of hers with you to and from gigs then what about the "Rita, Sue and Bob too" scenario? C'mon, it's clearly better for everyone if you just pitch in and drop her home, even if it means a later night for you. 

    My wife would be totally happy with me doing that, in fact she's totally happy with me having close female friends and going to the cinema, out for a meal/drink/gig with any of them. I have had a few young students, and my wife is also happy with me teaching them at home when she's out or away working. 
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  • DiscoStuDiscoStu Frets: 2353
    She might not even fancy you.
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 10717
    DiscoStu said:
    She might not even fancy you.
    Ridiculous. What 19 year old woman wouldn't fancy a middle aged, married pub-rocker?
    Ich bin ein Hamburgler.
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  • DiscoStuDiscoStu Frets: 2353
    Sporky said:
    DiscoStu said:
    She might not even fancy you.
    Ridiculous. What 19 year old woman wouldn't fancy a middle aged, married pub-rocker?
    With his own car?
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 10717
    Schwing!

    Slightly more seriously, I'd have thought that as a 19 year old woman she was pretty capable of travelling around the city in which she lives. Might be worth checking, and if she's stuck then I don't see an issue with giving her a lift home.
    Ich bin ein Hamburgler.
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 5792
    Sporky said:
    DiscoStu said:
    She might not even fancy you.
    Ridiculous. What 19 year old woman wouldn't fancy a middle aged, married pub-rocker?
    That's very much the thought process that's kept me playing the guitar. 
    Jesus monkey butler. 
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  • Have you actually discussed this with your new singer? Is this a problem she has posed to you?

    If you haven't, you're at the risk of patronising a capable young person. If she's at Uni in Manchester then she'll know the ropes by now as far as how to get around the town - I'd think it would be perfectly appropriate for her to figure out the closest bus route that you could drop her off at.

    If of course the bus routes aren't an option, I'd agree with the taxi on account idea; budget for it when charging for gigs. Have a band bank account or Paypal account to deal with it.

    Assuming she's intending on learning how to drive I doubt this will be a problem for long.

    But yeah, I'd maybe discuss it with her/the band first and foremost - no offence intended, but if you've discussed it with your wife and a number of strangers on a forum before actually talking to your singer about the issue, you're doing her a disservice.
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  • monquixotemonquixote Frets: 7925
    Alas this kind of thing is a common occurrence the female singer in the band I just left said that she had been cornered by the wife of the ugly 50 something guitarist in one of her bands and had some kind of "I know you are trying to steal my husband you fucking bitch" rant. When she was in her early 20s and married to a fighter pilot.
    Handsome_Chris said: Like white Nile Rodgers. 
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  • bbill335bbill335 Frets: 421
    This thread is mental. 
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  • DiscoStuDiscoStu Frets: 2353
    edited January 6
    Talking from experience, kindness can often be misinterpreted. I don't doubt your character @vasselmeyer and would probably offer a lift myself if I was in your position cos that's what good guys do but just be aware that although a woman, at 19 she is still young and possibly naive.
    I'm in my 40s. I was at a party a few years ago and there was a 19 year old art student there who I barely spoke to the whole evening. When she was leaving she realised she didn't have enough money for her taxi home to a nearby town, I didn't want her stranded/walking home so I gave her money for a taxi. Boom- instant crush on her part. She got a hold of my number and it took me several weeks and a rather blunt message to get her to stop contacting me.

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  • DiscoStuDiscoStu Frets: 2353
    The taxi on account idea is a very good suggestion. The rest of you make your own way to gigs so taxis will be her way and factor it in to the band's costs. I assume you each take petrol money??
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  • Jimbro66Jimbro66 Frets: 336
    IMO taxi funded by the band, including the singer herself, is the better option with no possible complications but a taxi after midnight from any more distant gigs could be expensive so everyone needs to be OK with that. Buses - NO.

    You don't stop playing because you grow old, you grow old because you stop playing.

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  • vasselmeyervasselmeyer Frets: 1840
    Thanks for the opinions guys. Just to clarify:
    • My wife doesn't think I'll run off with the singer, or vice versa
    • I have a daughter at university almost exactly the same age so I am aware that there is a curious mixture of naivete and maturity at that age
    • The thought that a 19 year-old  woman would throw herself at a 48 year-old man, the same age as her dad, is laughable
    • I think it highly unlikely that  there will be any problem, but  I do want to  minimise risk of the likelihood of any misunderstanding, hence "opinions  sought"
    • I like the idea of  a taxi fund from the gig money. However, I expect she's more at risk from a taxi driver than she is from me!
    Anyway...this thread is just a request for your thoughts. I fully expect that I will be dropping her off or will work something out with the whole band at the next rehearsal.
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  • english_bobenglish_bob Frets: 1805
    Sporky said:
    I'd have thought that as a 19 year old woman she was pretty capable of travelling around the city in which she lives. Might be worth checking, and if she's stuck then I don't see an issue with giving her a lift home.
    Yep. I think this should be your default assumption.

    Of course, there are also 19 year olds who are worryingly naive about this sort of thing. If she's a student, it's quite possible that she's only recently moved to Manchester and might not have a good idea of exactly what she's committed to in terms of travel to gigs. 

    I  guess I can understand Frau Vasselmeyer's concerns- there's nobody to confirm or deny anything she might accuse you of, and it potentially puts you in the unenviable position of "last one to see her alive" if something terrible were to happen, but I suspect both eventualities are highly unlikely.

    Don't talk politics and don't throw stones. Your royal highnesses.

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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 5607
    edited January 6
    Sporky said:

    Slightly more seriously, I'd have thought that as a 19 year old woman she was pretty capable of travelling around the city in which she lives. Might be worth checking, and if she's stuck then I don't see an issue with giving her a lift home.
    It's not always possible to get back to the centre of Manchester from the outskirts on public transport past midnight, depending on where you are.

    Taxis wouldn't be that efficient in terms of cost either after midnight.

    I'd just split her into my own travel costs if it was me. 

    If there was a massive concern otherwise then I'd get another singer with their own transport. She's an adult, not a kid. 

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  • GrunfeldGrunfeld Frets: 2029

    I'm more guilty of thinking like a dad than a bloke. My own kids are her age and also at university and  I'd want my own daughter to be  able to get home safely, but I also don't want to  leave myself open to  any  situation that might cause me a problem.
    I know this has got nothing to do with it but I think a dash cam for your car is well worth having.  They are really brilliant because they record the road ahead which would be useful evidence in the event of a prang, however when I watch the video back, like you do sometimes, I can hear myself singing along to my music because they pick up all the sound in the car. 

    I don't often store dash cam data but I sometimes do -- there can be all sorts of reasons why I might want to do that.  But I use video to record the work I do with clients, as I was taught to do when I trained because I'm in a 1:1 situation and it's prudent.  They obviously sign a consent form because that's necessary and I store the data safely as described.  But I do that because I don't want to leave myself open to any situation that might cause me a problem.

    Anyway, dash cams are great.  What was the question? :)
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  • axisusaxisus Frets: 8079
    Point the dash cam into the car. If something does happen you have a nice little memento.

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  • RolandRoland Frets: 1213
    I'd be more worried about how long she is going to remain with the band. Students can have busy social lives, long vacations, exam pressures, and then the course ends.
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  • vasselmeyervasselmeyer Frets: 1840
    @Grunfeld ;
    Actually, that is a bloody good idea. I have some Amazon vouchers and stuff for Xmas that  I have no idea what to spend on. Because some of our gigs are out of the city centre and there's virtually no police presence there, I do encounter drivers who are probably under the influence. I have been idly considering getting a dashcam because of that.

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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 5607
    Roland said:
    I'd be more worried about how long she is going to remain with the band. Students can have busy social lives, long vacations, exam pressures, and then the course ends.
    Or a year studying abroad they didn't tell you about (true story)...
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