Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Sign In with Google

Become a Subscriber!

Subscribe to our Patreon, and get image uploads with no ads on the site!

Read more...

Made In USA and Guitar Provenance

What's Hot
13»

Comments

  • WhitecatWhitecat Frets: 5378
    You can measure sharpness, but sharp does not always equal best.

    You can measure pickups, would a pickup that has more even output across all frequencies be better? Most likely not, and that's partly because it's part of a system (as is a lens).

    The truth is that cameras and guitars actually have exactly the same amount of "mojo" - that is, zero. Some guys do feel the camera is an extension of themselves and they want whatever they want for reasons that are exactly the same as the reasons as any given reason you might want any given guitar.

    Both are tools to create art with and it's not really for me to say what's better or best. Some crazy awesome stuff is made on Holgas and lensbabys and stuff that might not stack up 'scientifically.' My favourite lens of all time is the Nikkor 58mm 1.4 G lens - as far from optically perfect as is maybe possible, which was actually intentional on the part of the designers to give it a specific 'look.'

    Everything is a means to an end.

    Your perspective on camera equipment having "no mojo" is interesting because you are a working pro - yet you are an amateur musician with far more emotion invested in your gear rather than logic, perhaps, and I think that's pretty telling of the general mindsets of any amateur vs pro in almost any field. I worked for
    years in a camera shop and I can tell you that the majority of amateurs buying gear were doing so an emotional purchase, because this was a tool that was going to be used to capture moments in time, make memories visible, etc etc - whereas the pro customers wanted the best tools to get the job done fast and properly.

    Anyway, back on topic, yeah, Nikon makes lenses in three different countries now at least, possibly four... not really sure about the other systems, but when a new Nikon lens is released its country of origin is often a minor talking point and I have read stuff like "for this kind of money I'd at least expect it to be made in Japan!

    So my comparisons with the origins of guitars was mainly based on my experience with that brand.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • RaymondLinRaymondLin Frets: 11811
    edited December 2015

    You are very right in that the mind set between a pro and an amateur is so very different. With a pro you treat everything as a tool, you care much more about the final product and places little to no attachment to any particular gear (that's where it becomes difference to guitars, I bet May would feel a bit lost if his Red Special got stolen). I upgrade my camera every few years, lenses when it gets an update. With my guitars I am more emotionally attached, I am still upset making that ding on my PRS, I have various scratches on my camera, actually dropped my camera when the stupid tripod head came off in Sweden, but one look, test that it works and I continue. The UV filter got dented but since got replace and I don't worry about it anymore. I do care for my camera, I send them off to Canon for a service when I feel they need one, I am a Platinum CPS member, meaning if I send the lens off Monday, I have it back by Friday. I do sensor clean every season. They are all stored in a Pelican case for maximum protection, all with UV filters on from day one.

    When I refer to sharpness, of course there are many aspects that makes a lens good, focus speed, bokeh, CA control, flare control, corner to corner sharpness, vignette control, weather sealing, IS or build quality to the noise of the focus motor. Sharpness is just 1 element, it may not be the most important but it is one that most people do care about and easily measured if you place a camera side by side in a studio on a tripod taking photo of a potato.

    We are digressing off topic here, my point is that country of origin does not apply to me, my favourite lens (35L) is not my sharpest lens (50A), my most versatile lens (24-70 perhaps, although I only travel with a 35L) is not my most used lens (35L), my most expensive lens (85L) is not the best lens (?).

    I do however prefer a USA made guitar...
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • I think my Reverend RG2 is every bit as good as - say - an American standard Fender, Gibson SG std or whatever, certainly as good as a Japanese Gretsch.

    I used to cringe at the thought of 'far-eastern' guitars but the fact is that they can - if required / requested to do so - produce items of exceptional quality.

    Indonesian guitars, of which I've had 2 recently, from Squire and Sire, were 'acceptable for the price'. The Reverend is a bit more expensive but better than the price would suggest.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • You can't beat 'Made in Dagenham' During the 70s, that was a mark of quality crap.


    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • I have been a fan of all sorts of makes and nationalities over the years. Country of origin is only as good as the finished product. 

    I regret selling my 1980's Burny Les Paul I have yet to find its replacement  unless I find another 79-80 japanese Les Paul.

    As for what the President of Schecter had to say it just a bit of bad legislation that totally under values the good guitar companies making products in the US. 

    Law makers so glad I am a Law Breaker


    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • dindudedindude Frets: 8534
    Just resurrecting this old thread of mine as I noticed that the new Fender American Professional series simply states "Corona, CA" on the headstock instead of the "Made In USA" of the old American Standard.

    I'm sure it's a result of the aforementioned law, which again seems ludicrous as Fender make a huge amount of their parts in the American factory.

    I guess in reality it's becoming less and less important where a guitar is made as parts come from all over and many countries can turn out fine guitars. 

    However, I can't help think that his will somewhat backfire for the legislators, I mean if they can no longer put made in USA on the headstock, what motivation is there for Fender to continue to CNC and finish bodies in the US when they could do it in Mexico just as well, trunk them up and still have the same script on the headstock.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 1reaction image Wisdom
  • guitars4youguitars4you Frets: 14034
    tFB Trader
    ref above link from @dindude - I recall 'Made in the USA' started to appear in the mid late 60's as Jimmy Hoffa and the union guys started to impose their authority - As we know a pre-cbs Strat and 50's LP never had 'Made in the USA' on them - So it has become a 'symbol' since then

    see this link to see where an iPhone is made https://www.quora.com/Where-is-the-iPhone-originally-made
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • There are some USA made guitars that I happily accept are incredibly high quality, such as PRS but I don't for one second think that's simply because they're made in the USA and therefore must be better. We only have to consider most American made cars to realise that 'Made in the USA' does not mean it's going to be any good. I own a Mexican Fender Stratocaster that may not have the same quality of components as the USA made counterpart but it's still a very well made guitar and is a lot closer to the quality of the American line than the price difference would suggest. I also own a PRS SE Custom 24 and it's my third one, all of which have been built to an incredibly high standard, though I accept not as good as the American PRS guitars but again, that's either partly or largely down to the quality of components used. I do have one 'Made in the USA' guitar, which is a 2013 Gibson Les Paul Studio. It's a really good guitar and I love it. I play this one more than the others but if I'm brutally honest, the Korean made PRS is miles and miles better built than the Gibson. I'd say my American made Gibson is more on a par with the Mexican Fender than the Korean PRS.
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • ICBM said:
    Obviously Japan is 1st world, but it's still perceived as being a lower-quality producer than the US for some reason. The electrics in their export models are often intentionally lower quality than those in the home-market guitars.

    It's an intentional marketing strategy for Korea to keep costs down too. If Koreans thought they could sell guitars at the same quality and price point as American or even Japanese ones, they would. But the perception is that Korea is a lower-quality producer hence no-one would take them seriously, so there's no point.

    Koreans and Japanese workers are equally skilled and capable of using the same quality of machines as well as American ones...
    I've been in guitar manufacturing places in Japan, China and the USA. The only difference between the Japanese and American ones were that there was not a single tool or speck of sawdust out of place in the Japanese one. Tidiest cleanest workshops I've ever been in. Every tool has  a place and is put back when not in use. All the tools were the best quality you could find. The Chinese one although having QC inspectors imported from Japan, was dark and noisy and a little chaotic. The finished product was very good, however. I also have friends who have visited OEM Chinese factories where guitars are made and he said it was terrible. People sleeping under their machines, unskilled labour force. The owner of the factory reliably informed him that when they weren't making mandolins and banjos they were making hanging baskets for garden centres. 
    I work for http://www.reverb.com/uk Any questions, queries, complaints, Drop me a line.

    Remember to check out our Bank Holiday Sale 15% off New, Used and Vintage
    https://reverb.com/uk/sales/bank-holiday-sale

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • ICBM said:
    Obviously Japan is 1st world, but it's still perceived as being a lower-quality producer than the US for some reason. The electrics in their export models are often intentionally lower quality than those in the home-market guitars.

    It's an intentional marketing strategy for Korea to keep costs down too. If Koreans thought they could sell guitars at the same quality and price point as American or even Japanese ones, they would. But the perception is that Korea is a lower-quality producer hence no-one would take them seriously, so there's no point.

    Koreans and Japanese workers are equally skilled and capable of using the same quality of machines as well as American ones...
    I've been in guitar manufacturing places in Japan, China and the USA. The only difference between the Japanese and American ones were that there was not a single tool or speck of sawdust out of place in the Japanese one. Tidiest cleanest workshops I've ever been in. Every tool has  a place and is put back when not in use. All the tools were the best quality you could find. The Chinese one although having QC inspectors imported from Japan, was dark and noisy and a little chaotic. The finished product was very good, however. I also have friends who have visited OEM Chinese factories where guitars are made and he said it was terrible. People sleeping under their machines, unskilled labour force. The owner of the factory reliably informed him that when they weren't making mandolins and banjos they were making hanging baskets for garden centres. 
    Tell a lie, it wasn't hanging baskets it was barbeques and patio furniture.
    I work for http://www.reverb.com/uk Any questions, queries, complaints, Drop me a line.

    Remember to check out our Bank Holiday Sale 15% off New, Used and Vintage
    https://reverb.com/uk/sales/bank-holiday-sale

    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • StuckfastStuckfast Frets: 2393
    Whatever the good points of this legislation, it hasn't stopped some microphone manufacturers from being very disingenuous about the origins of their products. In a capacitor microphone there is basically one component that is key to the operation and sound of the microphone, which is the capsule. Every other aspect of building a microphone is basic mechanical and electrical engineering for the most part, but designing and building good capsules requires considerable expertise, skill and expensive machinery. That expertise was primarily developed in Germany and Austria after WWII by companies such as Neumann, AKG and Sennheiser.

    Today, all those companies still exist, but there's also a plethora of Chinese factories turning out cheap knock-offs of old Neumann and AKG capsules. Most of the US-based microphone 'manufacturers' are actually using these Chinese capsules, because it would be too expensive and difficult to design and build their own. But they go to incredible lengths to obscure the origins of the capsules and to imply, if not state outright, that their microphones are wholly built in the US.


    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 1reaction image Wisdom
  • So is FB going to be sued for having a "Made in the UK" sub forum? :o
    1reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
  • hubobuloushubobulous Frets: 2352
    dindude said:
    However, I can't help think that his will somewhat backfire for the legislators, I mean if they can no longer put made in USA on the headstock, what motivation is there for Fender to continue to CNC and finish bodies in the US when they could do it in Mexico just as well, trunk them up and still have the same script on the headstock.
    Trump's border tax
    0reaction image LOL 0reaction image Wow! 0reaction image Wisdom
Sign In or Register to comment.