5 String Bass help needed

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  • DLMDLM Frets: 2513
    edited April 2017

    Cheaper instruments may benefit from 35 scale but the very best B I've ever heard is in a 34 inch scale instrument. So I bought it.
    @fretmeister Is that your Marleaux? Or the Ray?
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23930
    Here is Rinat Ibragimov (again) playing an original Gagliano 3 string 



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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 7953
    edited April 2017
    The neck stiffness is a big factor in the low B.  That can be improved with either multi laminate necks or with graphite-reinforcement.  Break angle seems to also matter, but to a lesser extent.  Even something as simple as how the nut slot is cut is a contributing factor, but again a lesser factor still.  Strings also matter.

    I've had multiple bass tuned to a low B, and the best is the US Jazz bass I have with graphite re-inforced neck, with the low B strung through the body (I've tried through body and through bridge low Bs in nickel and steel from .125-.135, settled on .130 steel).  It's also able to be set up with next to no relief and a pretty low action yet still has a lot of balls to it, the neck is super stable.

    The only non re-inforced/non-multi laminate neck low B's I've personally thought were good are on MM Stingrays.  No idea what factor is contributing there other than the overall build quality seems excellent on Music Man instruments.
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4944
    Thanks guys for your input. I don't remember ever playing the G string so BEAD has become a possibility. Would I needling restring with  a 5 string set and not use the G?
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23930
    I've had that same experience on 5 string rays.

    I'm going to guess that because the neck shape is narrower, but also thicker, that shape is stronger. Got to be harder to bend a thick bit of wood than a skinny one, no matter how wide the skinny one is.

    My Marleaux has the best B I've ever played irrespective of price - even a £12,000 Fodera I tried in a shop. The neck is 3 parts maple with wenge strips. No other reinforcement. Big slab of ebony for the fretboard.

    It's amazing.
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  • Rocker said:
    Thanks guys for your input. I don't remember ever playing the G string so BEAD has become a possibility. Would I needling restring with  a 5 string set and not use the G?
    Yes but it's likely the nut slots will need to be widened.

    If you don't have the necessary files I'd get this done by a tech. A correctly cut nut is important for both playability and intonation
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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 7953
    edited April 2017
    I've had that same experience on 5 string rays.

    I'm going to guess that because the neck shape is narrower, but also thicker, that shape is stronger. Got to be harder to bend a thick bit of wood than a skinny one, no matter how wide the skinny one is.

    I think this plus the fact it's a heel adjust truss rod (as cutting out at the headstock is theoretically a weaker design due to the wood being thinner there)  

    I'd love to try one with a Status neck one day too but that's not a cheap experiment.  
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  • DLMDLM Frets: 2513

    even a £12,000 Fodera I tried in a shop.
    @fretmeister What model was that, and what did you think of it? Thomann now have masses of them.
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  • Winny_PoohWinny_Pooh Frets: 7731
    Just an opinion here, I think the Ray B being good on 34 scales may also have to do with the bridge. Very solid and on my 4 it sounds sounds acoustically fatter than P basses even if the plugged in tone is brighter due to the pickup, even the low E has a better feel than fender basses.
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23930
    DLM said:

    even a £12,000 Fodera I tried in a shop.
    @fretmeister What model was that, and what did you think of it? Thomann now have masses of them.
    It wasa Monarch that was built for the NAMM show. It was very good, but I'm sure three-quarters of the price is just there to cover what must horrific rent levels in New York.

    A new neck through Marleaux Consat Custom would be about £4000 (mine is a bolt on), and I can't see any quality difference. Far cheaper rent in the German hills though!
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  • guitarfishbayguitarfishbay Frets: 7953
    edited April 2017
    @Winny_Pooh have you tried a recent US Standard Fender with the string through high mass bridge and reinforced neck? Pretty much every one I've played has been really good, very solid and punchy acoustically.

    The feel of the oil and waxed finished MM neck is so nice though. If I trusted myself not to screw it up I'd do it to all my guitars.
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  • Winny_PoohWinny_Pooh Frets: 7731
    One or two, cant recall my thoughts on the B specifically just I can't get along with the wide string spacing on their 5s. I thought the Dimension was decent aside from the neck profile.
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  • DLMDLM Frets: 2513
    It wasa Monarch that was built for the NAMM show. It was very good, but I'm sure three-quarters of the price is just there to cover what must horrific rent levels in New York.

    A new neck through Marleaux Consat Custom would be about £4000 (mine is a bolt on), and I can't see any quality difference. Far cheaper rent in the German hills though!
    I'll say! In fact, one could probably afford to buy outright there. 
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  • One or two, cant recall my thoughts on the B specifically just I can't get along with the wide string spacing on their 5s. I thought the Dimension was decent aside from the neck profile.
    Fair enough.

    I've decided I prefer 4 strings tuned to B so no longer have a 5.  The neck on the Jazz is about as guitarist friendly as it gets, though I can play pretty much any 4 string neck fairly comfortably.  I don't really use the extra range on a 5 so have decided to go for comfort and availability (and bought a set of Stew Mac nut files)
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  • Winny_PoohWinny_Pooh Frets: 7731
    @guitarfishbay Agreed, what's odd is the logic behind some 5 necks and spacing. Bo Diddley or Johnny Hiland can play a 6 string guitar just fine but many bassists are uncomfortable with MM spacing on a 5? Bizarre. I played a Lakland 44-01 & 55-01 side by side a while back and the 4 had a neck more akin to a skinny Cort or Ibanez while the 5 had a wide and deep neck that felt relatively oversized by comparison.
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  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 14321
    Five string bass guitar is about more than gaining four extra semitones in the low range.

    The extra string makes it possible for some moves to be executed across the fingerboard rather than up and down it. My experience has been that access to more notes within easy reach of the current fretting hand position makes for less inventive playing. 

    It is a popular misconception that lower notes somehow make for a deeper sound. If you want "deep", a professional quality, alder-bodied Precision Bass with flat wound strings will answer the brief. Jamerson, early McVie, Henderson, Shannon, Clayton. Yadda, yadda.
    Be seeing you.
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  • BridgehouseBridgehouse Frets: 24578
    Five string bass guitar is about more than gaining four extra semitones in the low range.

    The extra string makes it possible for some moves to be executed across the fingerboard rather than up and down it. My experience has been that access to more notes within easy reach of the current fretting hand position makes for less inventive playing. 

    It is a popular misconception that lower notes somehow make for a deeper sound. If you want "deep", a professional quality, alder-bodied Precision Bass with flat wound strings will answer the brief. Jamerson, early McVie, Henderson, Shannon, Clayton. Yadda, yadda.
    I can testify to this.
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4944
    Thanks for your contributions @Bridgehouse and @Funkfingers. As I have an entry level bass, a better one would probably give me a fuller sound. I was thinking of Yamaha but am hoping that you guys will suggest other decent 4 string basses, priced in the region of €500/£450. Fender is the big guy but my budget does not stretch to the region of €2000 being asked for Fenders in Dublin. Thanks.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 14321
    If it were not such bad form, I would suggest one of my own "spare" sub-£450 bass guitars. 
    Be seeing you.
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  • DLMDLM Frets: 2513
    Rocker said:
    Fender is the big guy but my budget does not stretch to the region of €2000 being asked for Fenders in Dublin.
    €2k is too much for a "basic" US Fender 4-string. Those prices are either too high, or the basses are somehow fancier, in the ilk of this: https://www.thomann.de/de/fender_am_vintage_63_p_bass_fsbl.htm
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