Help me decide on a BKP Bridge?

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  • FelineGuitarsFelineGuitars Frets: 11496
    tFB Trader
    I would go for a Ho;ydiver for AIC but would also consider a Miracle Man a good choice for that territory of tione 
    Bizarrely the neck Miracle Man with it's A5 magnet  is a good choice for the bridge but not sure if you can get it 53mm spaced easily from BKP

    Many guitars have a re-sale value. Some you'll never want to sell.
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    Pickups from BKP, Oil City & Monty's pickups.

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  • axisusaxisus Frets: 28280
    +1 to the suggestion of getting in touch with Tim, I did that for a reccomendation
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  • John_PJohn_P Frets: 2744
    Mahogany body and more umph - I’d go for the Aldrich I have them or BK in a few guitars and they are great.      I’m liking the RY in a les Paul at the moment as though - if you go BK then I think it might fit better than a HD,  imo the HD is a better fit in an ash or alder body. 
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  • Wilson94 said:
    When you say it is 'better', how so? What makes it actually better
    The thing with the Holydiver is that it sets itself up as an 80's Metal pickup and it's good at getting a general approximation of that tone but there's always a more modern feel to it. In my experience (and I know many disagree) the wire makes a huge difference. The sort of tone that pickups of that style produce tends to require 43AWG wire but the Holydiver uses 44AWG because Tim prefers to put more turns on the bobbin. The Classic '83 uses 43AWG, which is far more appropriate to that era and as a result it catches that tone more effectively. Both pickups are smooth but 43AWG helps to give pickups a slightly raw hairiness that more modern wire like 44AWG doesn't. If you listen to something like Jake E. Lee, you're essentially listening to a Classic '83. I only bought one by chance after a friend said how good they were. It absolutely blew me away. Mine was made with the classic alnico 5 magnet but Jaime will also make it with either a ceramic or alnico 8 magnet if you prefer. Nothing is held in stock so you'd have a longer wait than with BKP but what you get will be custom made to your own personal requirements. The Creamery is my first choice for pickups now. I own a Classic '83, a Double Six, a Creamery '59 and a neck pickup that was loosely based on a Creamery '59 but made to my own specification.




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  • ab2017ab2017 Frets: 20
    If you want Jerry Cantrell tones get a JB by Seymour Duncan he has always used that
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  • I've used a JB before. It came in a Jackson Soloist with a maple neck-thru design and was absolutely awful. I changed it to a Miracle Man which was far better. Oddly enough, I transferred the JB to an alder guitar I had lying around (a Pacifica I think) and it was far more impressive in that but still not a patch on the Classic '83.
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  • BucketBucket Frets: 7751
    Well isn't the Rebel Yell quite similar to a JB?
    - "I'm going to write a very stiff letter. A VERY stiff letter. On cardboard."
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  • ab2017ab2017 Frets: 20
    Swap the magnet in a jb to match playing attack and bodywood. Never bought into the cork sniffery of bkp.
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  • Think I'm more confused than ever now, so many suggestions, should have made a poll lol. I like your detailed reasoning for the Classic '83. Does anyone know if you can buy BKP covers separately? May get a classic '83 and a BKP cover over it
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  • Why would you want to?

    And in reply to Bucket, no, a Rebel Yell is not like a JB or Holydiver or Classic '83. The Rebel Yell has more of an open sound. It's primarily a Hard Rock pickup that is tight enough to take a lot of gain if needed but the others don't have that open sound. I've used BKP extensively over a number of years and I swore by them. They are superb, there's no doubt about it but I learned enough about pickups over the years to then both take educated risks on other manufacturers and design my own pickups. The best neck pickup I've ever owned is in my Gibson Les Paul and it was built entirely to my specification for just £60 by Catswhiskers pickups but I only got there after many years spending a small fortune on pickups from other manufacturers. These days I know exactly what works for me so all my bridge pickups use 43AWG wire and all but one use an alnico 5 magnet. In the neck I prefer 42.5AWG wire, though I also use 42AWG and 43AWG at times. I also never get covers as I prefer the extra bite you get from open humbuckers. You would find the Holydiver a very good pickup and in mahogany, you may even prefer the Miracle Man but I think Jaime at The Creamery can make you something better and do it for a lot less money.
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  • Why would you want to?

    And in reply to Bucket, no, a Rebel Yell is not like a JB or Holydiver or Classic '83. The Rebel Yell has more of an open sound. It's primarily a Hard Rock pickup that is tight enough to take a lot of gain if needed but the others don't have that open sound. I've used BKP extensively over a number of years and I swore by them. They are superb, there's no doubt about it but I learned enough about pickups over the years to then both take educated risks on other manufacturers and design my own pickups. The best neck pickup I've ever owned is in my Gibson Les Paul and it was built entirely to my specification for just £60 by Catswhiskers pickups but I only got there after many years spending a small fortune on pickups from other manufacturers. These days I know exactly what works for me so all my bridge pickups use 43AWG wire and all but one use an alnico 5 magnet. In the neck I prefer 42.5AWG wire, though I also use 42AWG and 43AWG at times. I also never get covers as I prefer the extra bite you get from open humbuckers. You would find the Holydiver a very good pickup and in mahogany, you may even prefer the Miracle Man but I think Jaime at The Creamery can make you something better and do it for a lot less money.
    Think it's either the Holy Diver or the Classic 83' to be fair which has narrowed it down a bit. It's hard to say without hearing both in comparison but the price is tempting on the Creamery ones, as you can get a fair for the price of a single BKP. Guess I need to have a think
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  • gordijigordiji Frets: 782
    Why would you want to?

    And in reply to Bucket, no, a Rebel Yell is not like a JB or Holydiver or Classic '83. The Rebel Yell has more of an open sound. It's primarily a Hard Rock pickup that is tight enough to take a lot of gain if needed but the others don't have that open sound. I've used BKP extensively over a number of years and I swore by them. They are superb, there's no doubt about it but I learned enough about pickups over the years to then both take educated risks on other manufacturers and design my own pickups. The best neck pickup I've ever owned is in my Gibson Les Paul and it was built entirely to my specification for just £60 by Catswhiskers pickups but I only got there after many years spending a small fortune on pickups from other manufacturers. These days I know exactly what works for me so all my bridge pickups use 43AWG wire and all but one use an alnico 5 magnet. In the neck I prefer 42.5AWG wire, though I also use 42AWG and 43AWG at times. I also never get covers as I prefer the extra bite you get from open humbuckers. You would find the Holydiver a very good pickup and in mahogany, you may even prefer the Miracle Man but I think Jaime at The Creamery can make you something better and do it for a lot less money.
    I agree with much said here in that you need to know what you want or know what you don't want. I now know i prefer Alnico 3 magnets in single coils having had several bkp sets with alnico 5 which produced great definition but with the catch of harsh upper mids/highs that i didn't like & it wasn't immediately apparent. If you know your specs a good winder will produce them but it takes experimenting(to know what you like) which can be expensive. 
    I love the rounded top end of the Abraxas set in my prs and are amongst my fave ever pups, the bridge being an overwound alnico 4.
    IIRC The original holydiver was more like the later rebel yell..S.Stevens took the HD & customised it to his own spec so there were two pups too close in spec and the current HD changed from its original spec which was akin to the dimarzio SD.
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  • PhilKingPhilKing Frets: 1473
    The Rebel Yell was based on the 14.4k JB which was then fettled by Tim and Steve Stevens.  Originally there was an unpopular ceramic Holydiver, which Tim was revoicing anyway when Steve ordered some pickups.  Tim got in touch with him and they started working on the RY.  He borrowed my original double cream JB to check the individual coil measurements to validate his theories.  I have a set of the early prototype RY's that came to me as Holydivers, this was before Steve decided which pickup to take.

    A pickup that works really well in mahogany and can cover what you are looking at is the VHII - it's not a high output pickup, but can cover very heavy sounds.  Another one that you could also look at is the Blackhawk with Alnico magnets.  Both can give a very defined tone when you are driving them.
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  • gordijigordiji Frets: 782
    Thanks for the correction, i was speaking from memory which isn't my greatest asset !
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  • PhilKingPhilKing Frets: 1473
    Don't worry, it was a long time ago and if I hadn't have a very small involvement, wouldn't have remembered all the details anyway.
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  • FelineGuitarsFelineGuitars Frets: 11496
    tFB Trader
    PhilKing said:
    The Rebel Yell was based on the 14.4k JB which was then fettled by Tim and Steve Stevens.  Originally there was an unpopular ceramic Holydiver, which Tim was revoicing anyway when Steve ordered some pickups.  Tim got in touch with him and they started working on the RY.  He borrowed my original double cream JB to check the individual coil measurements to validate his theories.  I have a set of the early prototype RY's that came to me as Holydivers, this was before Steve decided which pickup to take.

    A pickup that works really well in mahogany and can cover what you are looking at is the VHII - it's not a high output pickup, but can cover very heavy sounds.  Another one that you could also look at is the Blackhawk with Alnico magnets.  Both can give a very defined tone when you are driving them.
    Phil - it should be pointed out that the early JBs were wound with AWG43 and as Phil says in the 14-15k bracket 
    Soon after Seymour redid it with AWG44 and it clocked in at 16k+

    Not sure if they make the old version anymore however I did work with Ash at OilCity to make the "Dirty Secret" pickup which is pretty similar.
    However do try out the Oil City Blackbird , which at 13k with AWG43/A5 is in that ballpark too

    Seymour tells the story of the guitar here:
    https://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/seymour-duncan-company/the-story-of-the-tele-gib


    Jake E Lee used either the Duncan Allan Holdsworth pickup or later the Duncan JB both of which used AWG44 and alnico 5 magnets. However he did use an old P90 in an SG Junior on many recordings so you have to do some detective work to figure it all out.
    Jake is however a seriously underrated player and was as equal a talent as Rhoads in many ways - well worth a good listen.

    Many guitars have a re-sale value. Some you'll never want to sell.
    Stockist of: Earvana & Graphtech nuts, Faber Tonepros & Gotoh hardware, Fatcat bridges. Highwood Saddles.

    Pickups from BKP, Oil City & Monty's pickups.

      Expert guitar repairs and upgrades - fretwork our speciality! www.felineguitars.com.  Facebook too!

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