Why Pentatonic rather than Major scales for soloing?

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  • vizviz Frets: 10644
    carlos said:
    viz said:
    Major penta:
    Add P4 & M7: major scale: happy or settled
    Add aug4 & M7: lydian: cool and a bit naughty
    Add P4 & m7: mixolydian: solid and strong
    You can also add aug4 and m7: overtone scale (a mode of Melodic Minor - a different family of scales altogether). 

    minor penta:
    Add M2 & m6: aeolian. Mournful yet beautiful
    Add M2 & M6: dorian. Sad but quirky or hopeful
    Add m2 & m6: phrygian. Mysterious, full of eastern promise
    You can also add m2 and M6: phrygidorian scale (also a mode of Melodic Minor).
    My words for those modes wouldn't be like yours at all :) Funny how that works.
    awesome! What would you have?
    Roland said: Scales are primarily a tool for categorising knowledge, not a rule for what can or cannot be played.
    Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    edited March 2018
    viz said:
    carlos said:
    viz said:
    Major penta:
    Add P4 & M7: major scale: sounds like recorder practice '78-80
    Add aug4 & M7: lydian: Steve Vai-motherfucker!
    Add P4 & m7: mixolydian: Allman Brothers
    You can also add aug4 and m7: JAAAAAAAAAZZ

    minor penta:
    Add M2 & m6: aeolian. Jam sandwiches
    Add M2 & M6: dorian. Welcome to Ireland
    Add m2 & m6: phrygian. Who let Malmsteen in here?
    You can also add m2 and M6: Who let Shawn Lane in here?
    My words for those modes wouldn't be like yours at all Funny how that works.
    awesome! What would you have?
    I've had a go.
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    edited March 2018
    I'd go from bright to dark like this:
    Lydian - Spiritual, contemplative, peaceful
    Ionian - Happy-go-lucky, bubbly, vanilla
    Mixo - As above, but with a streetwise edge
    Dorian - Grown-up, in control of my emotions, but melancholic
    Aeolian - Emo, dramatic suffering like Romantic era classic music and overall cheesy music
    Phrygian - Eastern edge but not really committed to that edge! Poser!

    To be honest what I know about their uses colours my opinion. Like for Phrygian where if you really want to go eastern you really need an m2 followed by an m3 interval for that sound... but you can't be bothered learning a new fingering.
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  • danowensdanowens Frets: 27
    In my opinion you need some augmented seconds to sound really 'Arabic/Klezmer/Eastern'. Preferably 2 as in the Double Harmonic Scale or the Hungarian Minor.
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  • vizviz Frets: 10644
    edited March 2018
    danowens said:
    In my opinion you need some augmented seconds to sound really 'Arabic/Klezmer/Eastern'.
    I think that’s what Carlos meant - a m3 on top of the m2. Phrygian dominant
    Roland said: Scales are primarily a tool for categorising knowledge, not a rule for what can or cannot be played.
    Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    Yes, although I explained myself poorly. Something C(m2 gap)Db(m3 gap)E... Phrygian Dominant and others.
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  • danowensdanowens Frets: 27
    carlos said:
    Yes, although I explained myself poorly. Something C(m2 gap)Db(m3 gap)E... Phrygian Dominant and others.
    You're right, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding. I'd thought you'd meant m3 above the root rather than the enharmonic m3/aug2 interval. 

    And this is why theory is so much easier to understand on the instrument and in the ear rather than on paper!
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  • carloscarlos Frets: 3426
    @danowens every time one of these threads pops up I always think that music should be explained with sounds not their numbers and letters analogues 
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  • danowensdanowens Frets: 27
    What's that "dancing about architecture" quote...?
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4943
    Today, merely out of curiosity, I worked out the notes on the Pentatonic scale key C.

    C, Eb, F, G, Bb, C etc.

    Hard to believe that actual music can be wrung out of those notes.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Rocker said:
    Today, merely out of curiosity, I worked out the notes on the Pentatonic scale key C.

    C, Eb, F, G, Bb, C etc.

    Hard to believe that actual music can be wrung out of those notes.
    A little game for you to play.
    Play C minor pentatonic in the root position, then stay around the 8th fret and play the F minor pentatonic without sliding up or down the fretboard.
    The play the G pentatonic minor.
    This gives you a I IV V in one section of the fretboard.
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  • ellangusellangus Frets: 250
    This may be of interest:


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  • danowensdanowens Frets: 27
    Rocker said:
    Today, merely out of curiosity, I worked out the notes on the Pentatonic scale key C.

    C, Eb, F, G, Bb, C etc.

    Hard to believe that actual music can be wrung out of those notes.
    It's worth noting this is the minor pentatonic scale; the major pentatonic has a different set of notes and it's worth being able to describe both:

    Minor: C Eb F G Bb
    Major: C D E G A
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  • RockerRocker Frets: 4943
    Thanks guys, as you can see I am a novice in music theory. 


    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. [Albert Einstein]

    Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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  • ModellistaModellista Frets: 2039
    Rocker said:
    Today, merely out of curiosity, I worked out the notes on the Pentatonic scale key C.

    C, Eb, F, G, Bb, C etc.

    Hard to believe that actual music can be wrung out of those notes.
    Nah, all you're missing from the diatonic scale is the 2nd and the 6th, which are easy to fling in there as passing notes.

    That's what great about the pentatonic, you've got the big hitters in there (minor 3rd, 5th, 7th), which are all very cool, especially played as double stops, but you're only a couple of passing notes away from the entire scale.
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  • ModellistaModellista Frets: 2039
    edited March 2018
    octatonic said:
    Rocker said:
    Today, merely out of curiosity, I worked out the notes on the Pentatonic scale key C.

    C, Eb, F, G, Bb, C etc.

    Hard to believe that actual music can be wrung out of those notes.
    A little game for you to play.
    Play C minor pentatonic in the root position, then stay around the 8th fret and play the F minor pentatonic without sliding up or down the fretboard.
    The play the G pentatonic minor.
    This gives you a I IV V in one section of the fretboard.
    The reason this works is the Fm pent contains all notes from Cm except Ab which is the 6th of C, and ditto Gm except it contains D which is the 2nd of C. 

    So an alternative way of thinking about this is, when you want to shift to the IV sharpen the G to Ab, and when you want the V flatten the Eb to D, keeping all the other notes the same. 

    Then you can do really clever stuff like using B instead of Bb over the V which sounds major but gives an even stronger feeling of resolution when you move back to the I.
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  • ModellistaModellista Frets: 2039
    ^ and when you've got the hang of introducing the 2nds and 6ths, try leaving out the root note C.  Seriously.  It forces you to land on the 2nd or 5th or whatever, which means the whole thing has a feeling of ambiguity and aches to be resolved.
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