There's an industry built around...

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ewalewal Frets: 2558
...the nuances of distortion, OD and fuzz. But if truth be told there really is a limit to the number of clipping/EQ flavours that can be produced, especially from the listening audience point of view. As such the industry is all a bit of a snake oil sale, designed to part players with their money.

Discuss.
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26743
    Maybe, but there are a lot of different ways of adding flexibility to those basic RW & clipping otptions, and pretty shiny boxes are fun :)
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    I like shiny things.
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  • TeetonetalTeetonetal Frets: 7801
    I'm not even sure how much it's about nuance either. People seem fairly happy to buy almost exact clones shoved in new boxes. A huge amount of all this is one big con.
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  • HattigolHattigol Frets: 8175
    edited July 2018
    Agreed. I'm always impressed by how reviewers manage to describe yet another drive pedal's nuances.

    Doesn't stop me constantly trying different ones though... I love the taste of snake oil!
    "Anybody can play. The note is only 20%. The attitude of the motherf*cker who plays it is  80%" - Miles Davis
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  • thecolourboxthecolourbox Frets: 9654
    Most industries are the same, that's why they are businesses. Just look how many different types of rice you can buy in the supermarket
    Please note my communication is not very good, so please be patient with me
    soundcloud.com/thecolourbox-1
    youtube.com/@TheColourboxMusic
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  • Do your mids even haunt bro?
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  • TeetonetalTeetonetal Frets: 7801
    Most industries are the same, that's why they are businesses. Just look how many different types of rice you can buy in the supermarket
    there is a certain amount of choice that is discernible (pudding rice is very different to long grain whole grain rice etc) and then there are competing companies offering those choices in different packets. I think that's pretty normal business. 

    Where FX pedal builders have really turned up the stupidity is in pretending that the subtle nuance between two circuits with slight component changes offer HUGE improvements in clarity, drive, feel, tone etc, etc and will change your playing life. There is so much bullshit floating around the marketing. It's a saturated market with more companies than really required. It's fairly easy to claim being a designer / builder when you are not (couple of high profile cases over the years) and the whole industry needs guitarists to believe that buying new gear will bring the missing "x" factor to their playing or increased enjoyment.

    most people could get buy with 1 or two guitars, 1 amp and a couple of FX - but that's no good to the industry, it requires us to constantly search for something more, to spend more money, to invest. 

    The sad fact is that almost everyone would be much better off diverting their time into learning who to play better, rehearsing more often, doing more writing, recording and gigs vs trying to buy the difference.

    That said, there are companies who make outstanding gear and are redefining what we can do with FX and long may they continue.
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  • joetelejoetele Frets: 947
    I'm a big pedal nut - but mainly for pedals that greatly expand the sound or make it sound almost non-guitary - yer reverbs, delays, octaves, synth pedals etc. I'm sure that there is a discernible difference between a lot of drive pedals, but I think personally there's only so much difference I can hear. I've tried quite a few different ones over the years but just tended to stick with a Blues Driver, DS-1 and a Big Muff Pi Nano. They're all your average / predictable / standard drive pedals, but they work for me, and the controls can be tweaked to get the sounds I need.  I'm sure the BD Waza, the Keeley DS-1 and some grand EQD Fuzz pedal would sound even better, but as they're not huge parts of my sound I don't really need them. As @Teetonetal says above, it's about actually playing above anything else (despite the fact I have 15 pedals across two small boards and wouldn't be without them). 
    MUSIC: Pale Blurs
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  • impmannimpmann Frets: 12641
    Tbh, there *are* different flavours of fuzz - and some more "different" than others... but genuinely, the BS that rains down about Big Muffs could fertilise Africa.

    However, I agree about overdrives. Very few genuine variations.

    Distortions to a point.
    Never Ever Bloody Anything Ever.

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  • sgosdensgosden Frets: 1993
    yeah but I can't play guitar at work to procrastinate ... I can plan pedal boards to hide my lack of talent  and lust after amps I'll never be able to afford. :)
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  • BluesyDaveBluesyDave Frets: 410
    ewal said:
     As such the industry is all a bit of a snake oil sale, designed to part players with their money.


    A pretty good summary.
    No Darling....I've had that ages.
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  • BBBluesBBBlues Frets: 635
    edited July 2018
    Low start up costs and few barriers into the industry means loads of pedal companies. Its called monopolistic competition. Differentiation between products is mainly branding.
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  • It's interesting that most replies so far are people agreeing that it's largely just snake oil, yet we all seem to willingly admit to being unable to resist that tasty, tasty snake oil!

    I have to say I've watched a few of those That Pedal Show vids on YouTube, and you see them doing their 'cum faces' over the latest £300 OD pedal and I just don't get it. Half the time I don't think they sound any better than a £30 Joyo tubescreamer clone.
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  • bbill335bbill335 Frets: 1368
    impmann said:
    Tbh, there *are* different flavours of fuzz - and some more "different" than others...
    It's amazing how many variations of fuzz you can get from a pair of transistors and a few component swaps.
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  • ICBMICBM Frets: 71951
    ewal said:
    ...the nuances of distortion, OD and fuzz. But if truth be told there really is a limit to the number of clipping/EQ flavours that can be produced, especially from the listening audience point of view. As such the industry is all a bit of a snake oil sale, designed to part players with their money.

    Discuss.
    I think there are actually only about four overdrive sounds the average non-musician can recognise or differentiate...

    Light break-up
    Smooth midrange overdrive
    Heavy scooped distortion
    Fuzz

    Beyond that, how it's EQ'd, fits into the mix, and what the player does with it are the main factors in 'different' sounds.

    That doesn't mean there are only four types of pedals of course, but you can probably get by with only one each of those and cover nearly any sound if you know how to use them effectively.

    bbill335 said:

    It's amazing how many variations of fuzz you can get from a pair of transistors and a few component swaps.
    Yes, but it's also amazing how much variation you can get with just one fuzz and an EQ pedal.

    "Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski

    "Just because I don't care, doesn't mean I don't understand." - Homer Simpson

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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 16253
    There's a lot of MeToo pedals  - you get to sell on the basis of best distribution, internet presence, marketing, price,etc, what it sounds like is reasonably secondary. But, as has been said, you could apply that to rice or super minis or PP3 batteries or jelly babies.
    As a market one of our main sources of information now is via YouTube - infomercials that are compressed to buggery ( and often watched/ listened on things like ipad speakers) extolling sonic virtues  of expensive little boxes. I really, really like youtube demos as I like pedals but they only really show me what a pedal does and how it is operated, it's extremely ballpark in terms of the actual sound ( let alone how that little box would work with my particular gear).
    I don't doubt ( okay, I slightly doubt) that if given the opportunity to A-B a bunch of overdrives and fuzzes I could hear differences, even quite subtle differences between ostensibly different pedals. But the difference between one reasonably built TS type pedal and another reasonably built TS type pedal by the time it is in a band context I'm really, really uncertain of. 
    I'm sure there are parallel markets with their own forms of mojo and it's not just guitarists who suffer a lack of almost any kind of objective critical review of products. I guess that's a gap that social media attempts to fill. If you ask what is the Ibanez mini TS like and 20 people tell you it's exactly like every other TS then it probably is. Although  how many of those people are just passing on internet wisdom and how many have actual hands on experience of both would be another matter.   

    So, err, in conclusion be careful out there and buy some old Boss pedals.

    Tipton is a small fishing village in the borough of Sandwell. 
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  • Dave_VaderDave_Vader Frets: 358
     But the difference between one reasonably built TS type pedal and another reasonably built TS type pedal by the time it is in a band context I'm really, really uncertain of. 

    I would doubt all of it if it weren't for the fact I have not played any reasonably built TS type pedal that sounds half as good as the Harley Benton Vintage Overdrive clone that I am now on my third (and at £20 a pop i'm okay with that) replacement of.

    Long live the unreasonably built TS clones.
    :)

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  • schrodinger1612schrodinger1612 Frets: 390
    edited July 2018
    Personally I base all purchase decisions on marketing and the appeal of shiny metal boxes. What I look for is not just sound, but snazzy designs and slogans which offer transcendence from the sense of being an ordinary guitar player, into the realms of sonic greatness. With an OD, I want to feel like Prometheus, reaching for the fires of heaven. 
    Feedback Thread: https://goo.gl/bquaSD
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  • bbill335bbill335 Frets: 1368
    ICBM said:
     but it's also amazing how much variation you can get with just one fuzz and an EQ pedal.
    That's no fun!
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  • shaunmshaunm Frets: 1591
    Most industries are the same, that's why they are businesses. Just look how many different types of rice you can buy in the supermarket
    there is a certain amount of choice that is discernible (pudding rice is very different to long grain whole grain rice etc) and then there are competing companies offering those choices in different packets. I think that's pretty normal business. 

    Where FX pedal builders have really turned up the stupidity is in pretending that the subtle nuance between two circuits with slight component changes offer HUGE improvements in clarity, drive, feel, tone etc, etc and will change your playing life. There is so much bullshit floating around the marketing. It's a saturated market with more companies than really required. It's fairly easy to claim being a designer / builder when you are not (couple of high profile cases over the years) and the whole industry needs guitarists to believe that buying new gear will bring the missing "x" factor to their playing or increased enjoyment.

    most people could get buy with 1 or two guitars, 1 amp and a couple of FX - but that's no good to the industry, it requires us to constantly search for something more, to spend more money, to invest. 

    The sad fact is that almost everyone would be much better off diverting their time into learning who to play better, rehearsing more often, doing more writing, recording and gigs vs trying to buy the difference.

    That said, there are companies who make outstanding gear and are redefining what we can do with FX and long may they continue.
    Get out

    nobody needs to start their potential buying days with this sort of negativity.  

    Robben Ford would sound like me if he played though a Laney, that’s why I need his gear to sound like him now.
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