What's needed to make 'EDM'...err...music?

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My eldest has gone rogue from his guitar and rock upbringing and listens to EDM. He's expressed some interest in making his own, but none of us have much clue about what he needs. He suggested a midi keyboard to plug into a PC with Ableton or similar but I suspect there are other options.

I think he'd really like a bit of hardware with flashy lights and dials which he can use to trigger samples and stuff.

I'm just looking for some ideas thrown at me, there's a chance I'd spend a couple of hundred quid to get him started.
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  • sweepysweepy Frets: 4159
    edited September 2018
    Ableton, Reason and lots of sample libraries oh and a Midi Controller  Keyboard, Sorted
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  • sweepy said:
    Ableton, Reason and lots of sample libraries oh and a Midi Controller  Keyboard, Sorted
    You make it sound easy....thanks!

    Can you suggest specific sample libraries? Where to get them from?
    And any particular Midi Controller Keyboard? I like the size and look of the M-Audio Keystation Mini 32 and it's only £45 or so:
    https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M-AUDIO-KEYSTATION-MINI-32-MK2-USB-MIDI-Velocity-Sensitive-Keyboard-Controller/322643744540?epid=12003303602&hash=item4b1f10d71c:g:bYcAAOSwEUdagbii&LH_BIN=1
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  • Kind of stuff my youngest son does. He has access to better technology in college ( he is doing music technology)but at home he has his PC which started life as a relatively budget gaming computer and our old Yamaha keyboard which he uses for it's MIDI capability. I can't remember the model but a MIDI keyboard is relatively cheap and an old home keyboard that has MIDI can be picked up cheaply. He has an Audient id14 ( I think) interface so he can add vocals or guitar or bass. 
    He has Ableton at home ( I think it's Logic X or Pro or something at college). A lot of the sample library stuff he has got via the college otherwise that would have been quite expensive. 

    Not that I understand this stuff really  - I'm repeating it like a trained parrot. 
    Tipton is a small fishing village in the borough of Sandwell. 
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Ableton Live + a keyboard is a good way to start.
    Things can get rapidly out of hand from there though- especially once you get out of the computer and into hardware- the results are usually worth it though.

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  • sweepysweepy Frets: 4159
    edited September 2018
    There are some very good Reason and Ableton Forums and tbh it’s worth checking them out. A 49 or 61 keyboard is more than enough and can be picked up very cheaply, some have assignable sliders for VCF VCA etc real-time Control 

    https://www.ableton.com/en/packs/
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  • You can rent to own Serum via Splice at $9.99 a month.

    ...it's only a matter of time before he informs you that it's possible to rent to own Serum via Splice at $9.99 a month.
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  • vizviz Frets: 10646
    Gorilla costume
    Roland said: Scales are primarily a tool for categorising knowledge, not a rule for what can or cannot be played.
    Supportact said: [my style is] probably more an accumulation of limitations and bad habits than a 'style'.
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  • Jimbro66Jimbro66 Frets: 2418
    edited September 2018
    My young son was showing some promise as a drummer but then discovered EDM, which became an obsession. Drove me nuts but in fairness he achieved some commercial success. Nevertheless, I had no option other than to disinherit him
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  • Casio MT40

    Some folks like water, some folks like wine.
    My feedback thread is here.
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    You want a Native Instruments Maschine .. the Mikro is being updated so the old model is on sale .. it's a beat maker, sampler, track maker etc. NI have loads of content packs you can buy to make tracks.





    Check out 'Just a girl and her Machine ..'



    I actually use one ...




    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    edited September 2018
    Here's the NI Maschine site ..



    And then there's Jeremy Ellis .. lots of vids ..





    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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  • Thanks all.
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  • BodBod Frets: 1286
    Fretwired said:
    You want a Native Instruments Maschine .. the Mikro is being updated so the old model is on sale .. it's a beat maker, sampler, track maker etc. NI have loads of content packs you can buy to make tracks.





    Check out 'Just a girl and her Machine ..'



    I actually use one ...



    I have the Maschine MK2 and Jam with Komplete 11 Ultimate and it's good, but I'm increasingly frustrated by NI's treacle-like speed of development of the Maschine software.  We've had a couple of new hardware versions appear recently, yet there's still no way of recording a live performance from start to finish, which is just unbelievable.  You can use it as a plugin in a DAW, which fills that gap, but I really don't like that workflow as it messes with my already crowded and confused noggin. 

    I'm considering selling it on and investing in Ableton Live and Push 2.
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  • BodBod Frets: 1286
    edited September 2018
    I should also add that I'm also considering upgrading to the MK3, in the hope that we do eventually get the live performance recording and better audio recording features...  lol 

    Sorry, bit of a thread hijack there.  The Maschine Mikro Mk2 will do the job for minimal outlay, but be careful when buying.  The Maschine software licence *must* be included with the hardware.  If it isn't then the hardware is useless and you can't buy the software separately.  It's a baffling NI policy, and lots of people have been caught out by this.

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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    Bod said:
    I should also add that I'm also considering upgrading to the MK3, in the hope that we do eventually get the live performance recording and better audio recording features...  lol 

    Sorry, bit of a thread hijack there.  The Maschine Mikro Mk2 will do the job for minimal outlay, but be careful when buying.  The Maschine software licence *must* be included with the hardware.  If it isn't then the hardware is useless and you can't buy the software separately.  It's a baffling NI policy, and lots of people have been caught out by this.

    If you buy a Maschine new you get the software. The latest software runs on all the Maschine units.

    You can record live ... may I ask what you're trying to do?

    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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  • BranshenBranshen Frets: 1222
    https://us.novationmusic.com/keys/launchkey-mini#

    The launckey mini is a great way to get started. It has knobs to turn, pads to hit, keys to play, flashing lights and comes with ableton live light. 77 quid at andertons..

    https://www.andertons.co.uk/keyboards-pianos/midi-keyboards-controllers/novation-launchkey-mini-mk2-25-note-mini-keyboard-controller

    I have it myself and the only major downside imo is that it doesn't take a sustain pedal.. For that, you want the slightly more expensive launckey 25.

    https://us.novationmusic.com/keys/launchkey
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  • He suggested a midi keyboard to plug into a PC with Ableton or similar but I suspect there are other options. I think he'd really like a bit of hardware with flashy lights and dials which he can use to trigger samples and stuff.

    I'm just looking for some ideas thrown at me, there's a chance I'd spend a couple of hundred quid to get him started.

    Have a chat with @goldtop ;)
    Be seeing you.
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  • goldtopgoldtop Frets: 6101
    That's the thing. I'm out of the loop on computer stuff. For sure, the cost-effective way of doing this is a computer and Machine/etc widget. Yoofs like the idea that it's all downloadable, I'm told.

    I hate switching on a computer to make music, so I went and got an MPC Live. Bit spendy for the OP.

    The cheaper standalone option is obvious, I think: an Electribe. Older, something like the Roland MCnnn range. (As always with hardware, lots of limitations to stimulate creativity.)
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  • BodBod Frets: 1286
    Fretwired said:
    Bod said:
    I should also add that I'm also considering upgrading to the MK3, in the hope that we do eventually get the live performance recording and better audio recording features...  lol 

    Sorry, bit of a thread hijack there.  The Maschine Mikro Mk2 will do the job for minimal outlay, but be careful when buying.  The Maschine software licence *must* be included with the hardware.  If it isn't then the hardware is useless and you can't buy the software separately.  It's a baffling NI policy, and lots of people have been caught out by this.

    If you buy a Maschine new you get the software. The latest software runs on all the Maschine units.

    You can record live ... may I ask what you're trying to do?
    Sorry, I should have been clearer.  I was referring to buying used units, not a new one.  The Maschine forum is littered with people that bought a unit from Cash Converters etc, only to find that the licence transfer hadn't been done and they'd got a useless piece of hardware.

    Regarding the performance recording, while it's possible to record patterns and assemble scenes, it's not currently possible to record the triggering of those patterns/scenes from the controllers as a full end-to-end performance.
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  • octatonicoctatonic Frets: 33725
    Agree with @goldtop.

    I much prefer hardware- currently exploring the Elektron devices and Eurorack.
    But it isn't for the inexperienced and it isn't a budget option.

    Some general advice for a new student to audio production and especially synthesis:
    The worry that I have is 'kids today' have access to all the tools but none of the techniques.
    The reason they like things being downloadable is students invariable use cracks.
    Their laptops will be filled with dozens of plugins that can do anything they want if they know what to do with them but there is a knowledge gap that is real and hard to defeat except with patient study.

    When you have a soft synth with 10,000,000 presets you can just scroll through them, rather then building a patch from scratch and understanding why something sounds the way it does.

    Having an understanding of how to build a patch, what the difference is between subtractive, additive, wavetable, FM (and others) and when to use one one or another, is actually really useful.

    I hate to be one of those people who says 'in my day...' but I've actually taught this stuff to students and they invariable start calling themselves 'producers' about half way through producing their first track.

    So, if the OP can budget for a decent hardware synth that has a one knob per function topology then do that too.
    An Arturia Minibrute or a Korg Monologue would be a very useful and instructive investment in the way that a plugin with a gazillion presets will not be.

    #grumpyoldgitrant
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