Id these two 1960's amps?

robgilmo · October 2018

Apparently the one with no grille is a Selmer, the other I think is a Bird Golden Eagle with a tolex recover, Any clues guys? And are they worth buying? Im afraid I dont have any more photos, they are just described as 60's amplifiers.

https://i.imgur.com/ybHpeVg.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/JwWBuUY.jpg

impmann · October 2018

Deffo a Bird - not sure on the model. They are collectible in good shape but as an amp they aren’t very good.

the other looks like a Selmer but without seeing the top panel it’s hard to say which one. Some vintage dealers ask big money for the Selmer combos but they sit around for sale for ever (ie they are overpriced - nobody will pay it). They can sound ok, though for recording - assuming the filter caps are in fine fettle.

It it depends on how cheap they are really and they’d need to be cheap.

Funkfingers · October 2018

It goes without saying that @HarrySeven is a past owner of at least one of those amplifier designs. (The Bird.)

The second amplifier is going to be tricky to identify without images of its control panel or whatever legend appears on the rear panel.

robgilmo · October 2018

My guess the Selmer is a Blue and Gray, it doesn't have the magic eye thing at the front.

HarrySeven · October 2018

First amp is a Bird Golden Eagle 2/15, IIRC. They’re quirky (but not necessarily in a good way) with some odd component/circuit design choices. I sold (a pristine) one, with original legs(!) a few weeks ago. Unless it’s crazy £cheap (or you REALLY want one), I would avoid. I’ll guarantee the reverb will be dead and the tremolo probably won’t be far behind.

Second looks like a Selmer Selectortone/Diplomat/Constellation, etc - you can tell from the residual piping on the front. As @impmann has said, you need to see the top panel.

As has already been said, some sellers - particularly the likes of Soundgas - ask crazy money for stuff like this (but they’ll be in minty condition, fully serviced and working - though they’re not worth the £££ even then, IMHO).

robgilmo · October 2018

Thanks guys, I just noticed them and they go under the hammer today, if I could afford it I might have taken a chance on the Selmer but it would be a gamble not knowing exactly what it is.

ICBM · October 2018

Pay no more than £50 max each. If you get them for that you can decide if it’s worth restoring, reselling or scrapping for parts.

robgilmo · October 2018

I really cant afford to take the chance, they are here if anyone wants a punt on them, a few interesting guitars too.
https://www.twgaze.co.uk/auctions/catalogues-and-auctions/current-catalogues/musical-instruments/

ICBM · October 2018

Most of the estimates look about right - I can’t see much that’s worth getting excited about. The Carlsbro 50 Top (4005), the Hondo J200 copy (4099), the Westone Thunder (4107), and Eros 12-string (4123) all look a bit underpriced, but they’re not exactly like finding a lost old master.

robgilmo · October 2018

The Mex Strat 120 - 150 would be a bit of a bargain if it sold for that, but it will probably sell for more, a 1996 Mex Strat, 400 quid? I doubt it, the Sophomore looks like a nice thing if you were after a keeper but the one that caught my eye, just to have was the 19th Century Salvador Ibanez acoustic , its something different and might be nice to own. Underpriced depends on the day, they might sell for that or they might sell for a lot more. If I wasn't so skint Id probably have a punt on one or two of them.

HarrySeven · October 2018

The only thing I'd go for would be the 50 Top, but it would need to be £cheap.

HarrySeven · October 2018

HarrySeven said:

The only thing I'd go for would be the 50 Top, but it would need to be £cheap.

Actually, that's not entirely true - I'd also go for the Korg Delta and the Roland CompuRhythm...

robgilmo · October 2018

I went and had a look, most of the guitars were tatty, the photos arnt really showing this, the Ibenez has substantial damage to the bottom of the body, its probably fixable but some of the wood is missing. The Sophomore structurally looked good but the finish has some deep scratches in it, the little Selmer looked Ok but I think its missing its foot switch, the Bird was very tatty. I never got to plug them in to see if they worked. The 50 Top looked in fairly good nick.

Bygone_Tones · October 2018

robgilmo said:

I went and had a look, most of the guitars were tatty, the photos arnt really showing this, the Ibenez has substantial damage to the bottom of the body, its probably fixable but some of the wood is missing. The Sophomore structurally looked good but the finish has some deep scratches in it, the little Selmer looked Ok but I think its missing its foot switch, the Bird was very tatty. I never got to plug them in to see if they worked. The 50 Top looked in fairly good nick.

The Selmer does not work. For those not familiar with auction spiel the 'a/f' means 'at fault'. I think auctions have to test anything electrical by law.

Looks like an old goodmans speaker in that selmer. They can be nice speakers if they work properly.

ICBM · October 2018

Bygone_Tones said:

Looks like an old goodmans speaker in that selmer. They can be nice speakers if they work properly.

But they have highly optimistic power ratings, so are very often blown.

I've got an alnico Audiom in a huge old 'hi-fi' speaker in my workshop, which I play my background music through. It sounds wonderful and is incredibly sensitive - I run it from just the headphone jack of the computer (50mW max I think), and it has enough volume and bottom-end to easily fill the room.

robgilmo · October 2018

Bygone_Tones said:

robgilmo said:

I went and had a look, most of the guitars were tatty, the photos arnt really showing this, the Ibenez has substantial damage to the bottom of the body, its probably fixable but some of the wood is missing. The Sophomore structurally looked good but the finish has some deep scratches in it, the little Selmer looked Ok but I think its missing its foot switch, the Bird was very tatty. I never got to plug them in to see if they worked. The 50 Top looked in fairly good nick.

The Selmer does not work. For those not familiar with auction spiel the 'a/f' means 'at fault'. I think auctions have to test anything electrical by law.

Looks like an old goodmans speaker in that selmer. They can be nice speakers if they work properly.

I gave them a call and they told me it means as found, some stuff they test , dti or something like that, it has to be over a certain value , not a collectable and not industrial. It sold for a bit over a hundred quid, way more than I bid, anyone here buy it?

ICBM · October 2018

I've always thought 'AF' stands for 'As Found' too - ie no guarantee of working condition implied.

'Collectable' stuff doesn't have to be tested as long as it is sold as As Found or not working, as far as I understand it. I think that means the mains plug has to be removed, but I'm not certain.

However I would never plug in anything I bought in a sale like that without having it safety tested first, regardless of how it was sold.

robgilmo · October 2018

That didn't take long. Thats a hell of a mark up for taking it apart then putting it back together again, didn't even clean the pots.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Rare-Selmer-Truvoice-Stadium-19T-Combo-Guitar-Amplifier/142973723751?hash=item2149e5e467:g:JKQAAOSwOU9bwf4P

ESBlonde · October 2018

A bedroom dealer per chance?

robgilmo · October 2018

He sells a lot of stuff, sometimes he has some decent kit too, lives not far from me. Not to sure about the price he values the Selmer at. That Kay strat looks interesting but not interesting enough for me to go and take a look, but it does keep popping up!

Bygone_Tones · October 2018

Price is not too silly, but a lot more than I personally would pay for one. In original condition and fully serviced they can make over a grand if you look on reverb.com sold items. However most of the value in vintage gear is in the originality of it. When all the original parts are missing, and the electrics need servicing, it is just a "players grade" piece and not a collectors piece. Value-wise that makes a big difference.

Firstly it needs a lot of work and extra expense to get it looking good and sounding good. Yet it will never look 100% right because the old tolex and grill materials are just not available anymore. So even after full restoration it would still have to be classed as a "restored amp" and not 100% original - not worth full collector value after all the extra work and expense.

I'd be concerned about how it is now magically in full working order, yet the auction sold it as 'a/f'. This means faulty in my experience, and I used to go to a lot of auctions. I doubt it just refers to the missing grill cloth, but could be I guess.

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Id these two 1960's amps?

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